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President Trump has accused former President Obama of... something:
In a string of tweets posted early Saturday morning, President Trump let loose a barrage of accusations at his predecessor. He alleged that former President Obama had his "wires tapped" in Trump Tower before Election Day last year, accusing Obama of "McCarthyism" and being a "bad (or sick) guy."
Trump, who is under significant scrutiny for his administration's contacts with Russia before he took office, offered no evidence to support his claims Saturday morning. Neither the White House nor Obama's office has responded immediately to NPR's requests for comment.
[...] Terrible! Just found out that Obama had my "wires tapped" in Trump Tower just before the victory. Nothing found. This is McCarthyism!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) March 4, 2017Is it legal for a sitting President to be "wire tapping" a race for president prior to an election? Turned down by court earlier. A NEW LOW!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) March 4, 2017I'd bet a good lawyer could make a great case out of the fact that President Obama was tapping my phones in October, just prior to Election!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) March 4, 2017How low has President Obama gone to tapp my phones during the very sacred election process. This is Nixon/Watergate. Bad (or sick) guy!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) March 4, 2017
Also at WaPo, NYT, Reuters, Fox News, BBC, and Snopes, which hints that it may be related to this story.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday March 05 2017, @09:10PM (4 children)
100% of the illegal aliens who crossed the border without authorization have committed a crime. The second offense is a felony.
Nearly all illegal aliens have committed additional crime in support of their illegal status, usually including felonies. Identity theft is used to obtain housing, medical care, and employment. This is not a victimless crime; people's lives get fucked up. You may get giant medical bills that ruin your credit. You may get arrested for a crime you didn't commit.
I suspect your "statistical analysis" is leaving these out. In any case, you shouldn't be lumping illegal aliens in with legitimate immigrants.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday March 06 2017, @07:52AM (1 child)
You unAmerican bastard! You Nationalist Scum Racist! I spit right down your throat, and squeeze it back up only to watch you choke!
100% of the illegal aliens who crossed the border without authorization have committed a crime. The second offense is a felony.
Yeah, it would be a violation of American law, if they were fucking Americans!!!! But you see, they are not, so they are not bound by the US Legal system. The break no law, except the racist law inside your racist head, you racist asshole of a nation to which you do not belong!!! All Americans have crossed the border illegally, without the permission of the native nations of the continent. So take your fucking Eurocentric perspective and stuff it up your fucking white pointy hood, because the Native American Border Control Agency will soon be coming for your white ass. No as for those brothers and sisters from the south, born of the soil of the Americas? We will cut them some slack. America!! Love it, or give it back!!!
(Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday March 07 2017, @10:10PM
Yeah, it would be a violation of American law, if they were fucking Americans!!!! But you see, they are not, so they are not bound by the US Legal system.
The obvious rebuttal is that one doesn't have to be a US citizen in order to be bound by US law.
(Score: 2) by urza9814 on Monday March 06 2017, @07:12PM
...which is at most about half of all undocumented or "illegal" immigrants. The rest have not necessarily committed any crime at all.
Got any evidence of that?
(Score: 2) by AthanasiusKircher on Monday March 06 2017, @09:11PM
In any case, you shouldn't be lumping illegal aliens in with legitimate immigrants.
I wasn't. I said "legal OR illegal" specifically to note that I was considering the analysis separately, though it's hard to find good statistics (since many studies admittedly do tend to lump the two together). If I had said "legal AND illegal," I would be lumping them together, but I specifically included the parenthetical for a reason.
Second, you miss the whole point of Trump's declaration, which was that Mexico is SENDING rapists and criminals to the U.S. Here, again, was the exact quotation:
When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.
The most straightforward way of parsing his sentences is that (1) Mexico has people who commit rapes (and other crime) in Mexico, (2) they "send" them to the U.S., and (3) they commit rape in the U.S. by "bringing" it to the U.S. Or maybe some of the non-rapists (e.g., the drug dealers?) are "bringing" other Mexicans who then proceed to commit the rapes. I suppose you could read it that way too. Do you have any evidence that this is the case?
Anyhow, it doesn't make sense to apply Trump's declaration of "bringing crime" to things like crossing the border. That's not a crime you can "bring" to the U.S., unlike drug-dealing or rape. I'm NOT defending illegal crossings -- I'm pointing out that doesn't seem to be what Trump was talking about, which is the point under discussion. (For that matter, note that Trump himself made no distinctions in his statement between legal vs. illegal immigrants, so I expect you'll call out him for that too??)
For those immigrants who commit crimes like identity theft, I'll join you in condemnation. But again, that's not the kind of stuff Trump was talking about. Note in your quotation from my post that I repeatedly said "violent crime," which is typically the examples that Trump has brought up. If he were talking about ID theft and specifying illegal immigrants stealing IDs or whatever, we would be having a completely different discussion here.
Again, go back and read my whole post, which was about inflammatory language and ad hominem. Trump said "rapists" as his primary example of crime Mexico "sends" to the U.S. (again, no distinction made between illegal vs. legal immigrants). I'm NOT defending illegal immigration, nor identity theft or whatever. But that has nothing to do with whether Trump's statements were both inaccurate and deliberately inflammatory.