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posted by martyb on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:03AM   Printer-friendly
from the it-is-not-the-law...-yet dept.

Alabama lawmakers have voted 24-4 to allow Briarwood Presbyterian Church in Birmingham to establish a police department. The church has over 4,000 members and is also home to a K-12 school and a theological seminary with 2,000 students and teachers:

"After the shooting at Sandy Hook and in the wake of similar assaults at churches and schools, Briarwood recognized the need to provide qualified first responders to coordinate with local law enforcement," church administrator Matt Moore said in a statement, referring to the mass murder of 20 first graders and six teachers at the Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut by a deranged man with an AR-15 style rifle just before Christmas 2012. "The sole purpose of this proposed legislation is to provide a safe environment for the church, its members, students and guests." The church would pay the bill for its officers.

[...] "It's our view this would plainly be unconstitutional," Randall Marshall, the ACLU's Acting Executive Director, told NBC News. In a memo to the legislature, Marshall said they believe the bills "violate the First Amendment or the U.S. Constitution and, if enacted, would not survive a legal challenge." "Vesting state police powers in a church police force violated the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment," his memo states. "These bills unnecessarily carve out special programs for religious organizations and inextricably intertwine state authority and power with church operations."


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  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:57AM (16 children)

    by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:57AM (#493206) Journal

    Paul says to obey secular authority. And what happened to turning the other cheek, huh? Good grief, I know atheists who are better Christians than these Christians.

    --
    I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
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  • (Score: 3, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Thursday April 13 2017, @02:40AM (13 children)

    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @02:40AM (#493225) Homepage Journal

    Turn the other cheek, and when you're hit a second time, whip out the AR-15 and blow the sumbitch into eternity. Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius - Arnaud Amalric

    --
    “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
    • (Score: 4, Funny) by marcello_dl on Thursday April 13 2017, @07:38AM (1 child)

      by marcello_dl (2685) on Thursday April 13 2017, @07:38AM (#493292)

      You seem jealous we have the best sorting algo.

      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:39PM

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:39PM (#493356) Homepage Journal

        Good one. Salutes. ;^)

        --
        “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
    • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:01PM (10 children)

      by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:01PM (#493419) Journal

      Care to point me to which translation of which verse says that? In all the years I've studied this stuff, in English and Latin and Koine, I've *never* seen any passage stating that if you're hit a second time you have permission to go Rambo on the attacker...and, oddly, not a single mention of semiautomatic weapons in the entire Bible.

      --
      I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
      • (Score: 1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:21PM (9 children)

        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:21PM (#493435) Homepage Journal

        1 Samuel 15:3 They all look alike to me, how do I know which are Amalekites?

        Don't be so literal. The same God who says to love your neighbor did command a number of genocide-like slaughters. And, if the silly Jews had just obeyed their commander, things would have been vastly different. Those Jew boys thought some of those Canaanite girls were nice looking, so they saved some of them for weekend entertainment. See where it got them? Look at Palestine today!

        I can see by your frowny face that you insist on being serious. Well, fek it - I've never told you that I'm a "good Christian", I've only told you that I'm Christian. I agree with the Muslims on one thing. There are many ways to hell, and I'll take my own way, thank you very much.

        Oh - wait. You're not one of those who actually believes any of that fairy tale crap about streets paved with gold, and being given angel's wings, sitting on marble benches and playing harps while praising God? If that be paradise, I'd rather kick puppies and eat kittens for breakfast here on earth, and then go to hell.

        Oh yeah - one more kinda serious point. You want a number of assaults that you must withstand, before you respond in kind? Matthew 18:22 Some of us can't count that high, so we take a shortcut at two. ;^p

        --
        “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
        • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:24PM (8 children)

          by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:24PM (#493439) Journal

          Oh good grief, that you call yourself a Christian at all with your worldview and (lack of) morals is a sick joke. You've chosen your own path to Hell all right. And you've got maybe 10 or 20 years left before you end up in it.

          --
          I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
          • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:34PM (7 children)

            by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @03:34PM (#493445) Homepage Journal

            Uh-huh - and listen to YOU. Judge not, lest ye be judged? Who set you up as the gate keeper?

            Life is just to damned short to take seriously. It's all a bad joke. I don't understand the joke, but at least I realize it's just a joke.

            --
            “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
            • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday April 13 2017, @04:29PM (6 children)

              by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Thursday April 13 2017, @04:29PM (#493478) Journal

              Congratulations, you're an atheist! Stop pretending to be a Christian. I am most definitely not one, and will never be a member of ANY of the Abrahamic death cults.

              --
              I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
              • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday April 14 2017, @01:45AM (5 children)

                by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 14 2017, @01:45AM (#493761) Homepage Journal

                Agnostic, maybe - atheist no. While you're trying to figure things out, you might read up on any number of more famous popes, bishops, or whoever else. They've all questioned their faith. They've questioned whether God is real. Whatever you think you are, you've also had those times. "WTF is life all about? Do I have any idea? Is what I believe for real? What if it's all bullshit?"

                And, stop trying to put round people into square holes, fat people into skinny holes, and screwy people into straight holes. That's a big part of what's wrong with all religions, and all governments. I am exactly what I am, and not the way you like to see me be (Linda Ronstadt song there) and I'm perfectly happy with that. YOU don't get to define what a Christian is, you don't even get to define what a good Christian is. You're just like every other asshole in the world, with your own opinion. And, you know what they say about opinions.

                And, oh yeah. 42. Don't forget, 42.

                --
                “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
                • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday April 14 2017, @02:21AM (4 children)

                  by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 14 2017, @02:21AM (#493783) Journal

                  Yeah, what they ought to say about opinions is "they're all opinions, but the more they draw from and comport with observable reality the better they are." What they DO say, unfortunately, is a dangerous fallacy. "One opinion is as good as any other" is *false,* plain and simple, end of story, the exception being purely aesthetic judgments.

                  And you are not going to get away with that fallacy here, Runaway. I would say a Christian who doesn't do what Jesus says is a pretty fucking poor Christian, and supposedly, so does Jesus. And, if one is a Christian, it's his opinion (heh) that matters, isn't it?

                  --
                  I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                  • (Score: 1, Offtopic) by Runaway1956 on Friday April 14 2017, @01:57PM (3 children)

                    by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 14 2017, @01:57PM (#493962) Homepage Journal

                    Fallacy? What fallacy? You don't believe that 42 is the answer to the ultimate question of life, the universe, and everything? You can't be serious. Even the pope believes in 42!

                    http://www.americamagazine.org/content/dispatches/jesuit-priest-offers-hints-media-working-papal-visit [americamagazine.org]

                    --
                    “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
                    • (Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday April 14 2017, @05:36PM (2 children)

                      by Azuma Hazuki (5086) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 14 2017, @05:36PM (#494097) Journal

                      No no, the fallacy of one opinion being as good as any other. This is not the case, and anyone with even the smallest capacity for critical thought will realize this.

                      --
                      I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
                      • (Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Friday April 14 2017, @05:53PM

                        by Runaway1956 (2926) Subscriber Badge on Friday April 14 2017, @05:53PM (#494111) Homepage Journal

                        But, I didn't say that one opinion is as good as any other. What I referred to was, "Opinions are like assholes - everybody has one, and they all stink." Of course one opinion isn't as good as another, because mine are superior to yours. Even you recognize that, because you keep reading my opinions. Do you waste time reading your own opinions?

                        --
                        “If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ― George S. Patton on Ukraine
                      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 14 2017, @08:01PM

                        by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 14 2017, @08:01PM (#494173)

                        Never argue with runaway. He drags you down to his level, and it will never end.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by dyingtolive on Thursday April 13 2017, @05:50AM (1 child)

    by dyingtolive (952) on Thursday April 13 2017, @05:50AM (#493268)

    Why would you expect organized religion, particularly Christianity, to suddenly start practicing what they preach now, of all times?

    What absolutely fucks my brain about this is that if this winds up creating legal precedent for religious police, then they just opened the door for sharia law enforcement, which I thought was the boogy-man de jure. Of course, it's also Alabama: There's a reasonable possibility they just haven't thought their cunning plan all the way through.

    --
    Don't blame me, I voted for moose wang!
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:54PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Thursday April 13 2017, @01:54PM (#493368)

      Sharia law is OK when it's Christians taking your bacon at gunpoint.

      Gays only matter when it's Moslems who want to stone them.