Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

Politics
posted by martyb on Monday August 14 2017, @10:51PM   Printer-friendly
from the thugs-and-their-thug-accomplices dept.

We've had multiple submissions on the confrontation in Charlottesville, Virginia between white supremacists and counter-protesters. We lead off with a submission about the altercation which culminated with a car driven into a crowd which left 1 person dead and 19 injured. Then we continue with GoDaddy informing dailystormer.com — a white supremacist web site which called for the rally — that they had 24 hours to find another registrar for their site. They signed up with Google's domain registration service. Now there are reports that Google, too, has dropped the registration.

This story could very well cause a lot of heat, but it is my hope we can look beyond the details of this particular situation and focus discussion on the overriding questions of freedom of speech/publication raised by one of the submitters and the implications it may lead to. This saying comes to mind: "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

Terrorism in Charlottesville: 1 Dead, 19 Injured

ProPublica reports:

Police Stood By As Mayhem Mounted in Charlottesville, Virginia

At about 10 a.m. [August 12], at one of countless such confrontations, an angry mob of white supremacists formed a battle line across from a group of counter-protesters, many of them older and gray-haired, who had gathered near a church parking lot. On command from their leader, the young men charged and pummeled their ideological foes with abandon. One woman was hurled to the pavement, and the blood from her bruised head was instantly visible.

Standing nearby, an assortment of Virginia State Police troopers and Charlottesville police wearing protective gear watched silently from behind an array of metal barricades--and did nothing.

[...] the white supremacists who flooded into the city's Emancipation Park--a statue of Confederate General Robert E. Lee sits in the center of the park--had spent months openly planning for war. The Daily Stormer, a popular neo-Nazi website, encouraged rally attendees to bring shields, pepper spray, and fascist flags and flagpoles. A prominent racist podcast told its listeners to come carrying guns.

[...] the white supremacists who showed up in Charlottesville did indeed come prepared for violence. Many wore helmets and carried clubs, medieval-looking round wooden shields, and rectangular plexiglass shields, similar to those used by riot police.

[...] The police did little to stop the bloodshed. Several times, a group of assault-rifle-toting militia members from New York State, wearing body armor and desert camo, played a more active role in breaking up fights.

[...] The skirmishes culminated in what appears to have been an act of domestic terrorism, with a driver ramming his car into a crowd of anti-racist activists on a busy downtown street, killing one and injuring 19 according to the latest information from city officials. Charlottesville authorities tonight reported that a 20-year-old Ohio man had been arrested and had been charged with murder.

[...] A good strategy, [said Miriam Krinsky, a former federal prosecutor who has worked on police reform efforts in Los Angeles], is to make clashes less likely by separating the two sides physically, with officers forming a barrier between them. "Create a human barrier so the flash points are reduced as quickly as possible."

GoDaddy Stomps 'Daily Stormer' -- Site Moves to Google

The Washington Post reports GoDaddy bans neo-Nazi site Daily Stormer for disparaging woman killed at Charlottesville rally:

After months of criticism that GoDaddy was providing a platform for hate speech, the Web hosting company announced late Sunday that it will no longer house the Daily Stormer, a neo-Nazi website that promotes white supremacist and white nationalist ideas.

[...] We informed The Daily Stormer that they have 24 hours to move the domain to another provider, as they have violated our terms of service.

— GoDaddy (@GoDaddy) August 14, 2017

[...] In the Daily Stormer post[1], [Andrew] Angelin characterized [victim Heather] Heyer as dying in a "road rage incident." He said she was a "drain on society" and disparaged her appearance. "Most people are glad she is dead," he wrote.

"@GoDaddy you host The Daily Stormer — they posted this on their site," Twitter user Amy Siskind said in an appeal to the Web hosting company. "Please retweet if you think this hate should be taken down & banned."

[...] GoDaddy has previously said that the content, however "tasteless" and "ignorant," is protected by the First Amendment. The company told the Daily Beast in July that a Daily Stormer article threatening to "track down" the family members of CNN staffers did not violate Domains by Proxy's terms of service.

[1] https://www.dailystormer.com/heather-heyer-woman-killed-in-road-rage-incident-was-a-fat-childless-32-year-old-slut/

After the incidents in Charlottesville it seems GoDaddy have decided, one can gather from and after a massive amount of pressure, to no longer provide Domain name access to the Daily Stormer. While a private company is free to do whatever they like, I wonder if there will or might be further implications. I think the interesting question here isn't what happened in Charlottesville or what kind of stories they provide over at the Daily Stormer -- they might be or are a complete shitfest filled with neo-nazi-news for all I know. The interesting aspect is if companies should now monitor their customers, which it seems the Daily Stormer has been one for years, and ban or block customers that no longer align with company beliefs or that other customers find offensive. It seems the Daily Stormer has previously posted "tasteless" and "ignorant" stories that one can only assume have not aligned with GoDaddy policy or Terms of Service, but this one was somehow over the line and the straw that broke the camel's back?

I'm fairly sure the Daily Stormer won't be knocked offline or anything, there will always be someone willing to host them somewhere. So today they try to knock a neo-nazi site offline, I doubt many people will lose any sleep over that, but who is going to be next? Is this part of the ramping up of the current online-twitter-socialweb-culture? Is there a slippery slope here?

Google Domains, GoDaddy blacklist white supremacist site Daily Stormer

Ars Technica is reporting that Google Domains and GoDaddy have blacklisted white supremacist site Daily Stormer:

The article prompted a response from the site's domain registrar, GoDaddy. "We informed The Daily Stormer that they have 24 hours to move the domain to another provider, as they have violated our terms of service," GoDaddy wrote in a tweet late Sunday night.

On Monday, the Daily Stormer switched its registration to Google's domain service. Within hours, Google announced a cancellation of its own. "We are cancelling Daily Stormer's registration with Google Domains for violating our terms of service," the company wrote in an statement emailed to Ars.

[...] A lot of outlets covering this controversy described GoDaddy, somewhat misleadingly, as the Daily Stormer's hosting provider. But GoDaddy wasn't storing or distributing the content on the Daily Stormer website. It was the Daily Stormer's registrar, which is the company that handles registration of "dailystormer.com" in the domain name system, the global database that connects domain names like "arstechnica.com" to numeric IP addresses.

GoDaddy has faced pressure for months from anti-racist groups like the Southern Poverty Law Center and the Anti-Defamation League to drop the Daily Stormer as a customer. But until this weekend, GoDaddy resisted that pressure.

"GoDaddy doesn't host The Daily Stormer's content on its servers," the investigative site Reveal reported in May. "Because it provides only the domain name, the company says it has a higher standard for terminating service."

"We need to evaluate what level of effect we can actually have on the abuse that's actually going on," said Ben Butler, director of GoDaddy's digital crimes unit, in a May interview with Reveal. "As a domain name registrar, if we take the domain name down, that domain name stops working. But the content is still out there, live on a server connected to the Internet that can be reached via an IP address or forwarded from another domain name. The actual content is not something we can touch by turning on or off the domain name service."

But GoDaddy abruptly changed its stance on Sunday evening. What changed GoDaddy's mind? In a statement to Techcrunch, GoDaddy said: "given this latest article comes on the immediate heels of a violent act, we believe this type of article could incite additional violence, which violates our terms of service."

Reading GoDaddy's terms of service, this seems to support their stance that they could suspend the domain registration:

9. RESTRICTION OF SERVICES; RIGHT OF REFUSAL

[...] You agree that GoDaddy, in its sole discretion and without liability to you, may refuse to accept the registration of any domain name. GoDaddy also may in its sole discretion and without liability to you delete the registration of any domain name during the first thirty (30) days after registration has taken place. GoDaddy may also cancel the registration of a domain name, after thirty (30) days, if that name is being used, as determined by GoDaddy in its sole discretion, in association with spam or morally objectionable activities. Morally objectionable activities will include, but not be limited to:

  • Activities prohibited by the laws of the United States and/or foreign territories in which you conduct business;
  • Activities designed to encourage unlawful behavior by others, such as hate crimes, terrorism and child pornography; and
  • Activities designed to harm or use unethically minors in any way.

As of the time of this being written, it appears that the Daily Stormer domain (dailystormer.com) is still being hosted by Google:

Domain Name: dailystormer.com
Registry Domain ID: 1787753602_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.google.com
Registrar URL: https://domains.google.com
Updated Date: 2017-08-14T14:51:45Z
Creation Date: 2013-03-20T22:43:18Z
Registrar Registration Expiration Date: 2020-03-20T22:43:18Z
Registrar: Google Inc.
Registrar IANA ID: 895
Registrar Abuse Contact Email:
Registrar Abuse Contact Phone: +1.8772376466
Domain Status: clientTransferProhibited https://www.icann.org/epp#clientTransferProhibited


Original Submission #1   Original Submission #2

 
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
  • (Score: 3, Informative) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday August 15 2017, @12:15AM (4 children)

    by MichaelDavidCrawford (2339) Subscriber Badge <mdcrawford@gmail.com> on Tuesday August 15 2017, @12:15AM (#553919) Homepage Journal

    The Daily Storm's hate speech was not protected by the First Amendment. That only bans censorship by the government.

    Private parties are free to censor.

    That the first amendment outlaws all censorship is quite a common misconception.

    --
    Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
    Starting Score:    1  point
    Moderation   +1  
       Informative=1, Total=1
    Extra 'Informative' Modifier   0  
    Karma-Bonus Modifier   +1  

    Total Score:   3  
  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 15 2017, @06:15AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 15 2017, @06:15AM (#554118)

    Domain registrars had government monopoly authority over domain registrations, and still do have defacto derived government powers for the same.

    Until you or I can stand up our own TLD registrars without asking permission from ANYONE, then it's likely that current registrars need to abide by the First Amendment insofar as domain name hosting goes.

  • (Score: 1) by crafoo on Tuesday August 15 2017, @01:10PM (2 children)

    by crafoo (6639) on Tuesday August 15 2017, @01:10PM (#554241)

    Hate speech is protected. If it were not everything the current faction in power didn't approve of would be classified as hate speech.

    Private companies are free to censor but it is still censorship, and it is still contrary to the values that make this country great. Companies that censor speech are not friends of democracy. GoDaddy clearly does not value the freedom of expression, open debate of the issues, and the ability of all people to access all viewpoints that are out there. Clearly many people in the USA have views similar to those expressed on Daily Storm. Good, bad, or otherwise, access to this view and seeing it openly expressed and engaged with is the cornerstone of debunking it.

    Now, there are also many people here that are frightened of this view. There are kernels of truth in what is being expressed. Ideas that cannot be so easily debunked or rationally dealt with. For these ideas the radical alt-left has only forced-silence. There is no conversation. There is no measured rational response. The irrationality and censorship speaks for itself.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 15 2017, @03:21PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday August 15 2017, @03:21PM (#554277)

      the values that make this country great.

      Ummm... which country is that? 'Cause even a certain elected president is MAGA-ing, if you understand the implications.

      Companies that censor speech are not friends of democracy.

      This is what I keep saying for some time: capitalism and focus on profit above anything else are not friends of democracy.
      But they keep invoking free market and how this is a pillar for a free society, and how the primary responsibility of a corporation is to bring profit to their shareholders, everything else is secondary; maybe you'll have a better luck in having them believe you.

      open debate of the issues, and the ability of all people to access all viewpoints that are out there.

      So true, so so true.
      You see, trying to convince the society to keep an open mind and fiercely debate are exactly what Daily Storm advocates.
      If the others don't want to open their mind, they'll be happy to oblige by using maces and other implements (cars plunging in crowds) to literally open those closed minds.
      Even better, those implements can be reused during the fiercely debating phase, making the process cheaper, leaner and meaner.

      There is no conversation. There is no measured rational response. The irrationality and censorship speaks for itself.

      Oh, wise one, I'm lost for words.
      Please teach me how do have a rational conversation with a car hurling down at speed into a crowd - I do understand that's a form of expression [soylentnews.org] but I don't know if using in reply, e.g., a tank as a counter-argument is legal in US.

    • (Score: 2) by martyb on Saturday August 19 2017, @01:32PM

      by martyb (76) Subscriber Badge on Saturday August 19 2017, @01:32PM (#556346) Journal

      Hate speech is protected. If it were not everything the current faction in power didn't approve of would be classified as hate speech.

      Whatever 'special' rules are put into place to favor what I believe in, can be used by others to favor what they believe in. There's an inherent tension there for that to work. I must tolerate some things others say which I find repugnant in order to assure that I can say what others may find repugnant.

      I do NOT have to agree with them. And I am absolutely free to speak my mind and use my own freedom of speech and right to assembly to voice why I disagree and my reasoning for it.

      Private companies are free to censor but it is still censorship, and it is still contrary to the values that make this country great. Companies that censor speech are not friends of democracy. GoDaddy clearly does not value the freedom of expression, open debate of the issues, and the ability of all people to access all viewpoints that are out there. Clearly many people in the USA have views similar to those expressed on Daily Storm. Good, bad, or otherwise, access to this view and seeing it openly expressed and engaged with is the cornerstone of debunking it.

      Agreed. There is a difference between censorship that is performed by the US government and by individuals. The government, being so much more powerful than the person, can suppress disagreement and thus foist ever more power against the people. Some of the actions of the government back in the 1700's led to a group of folks gathering to make sure that one's voice could not be silenced, among other things.

      We are, however, in a different time. The founding fathers could never have envisioned corporations becoming so powerful that they rivaled governments in their sway. Think of Google, Facebook, and Twitter (among many others). Think, also, of the consolidation in the media where fewer and fewer companies control larger and larger numbers of newspapers, TV, and radio stations.

      If the government is proscribed from certain activities for the protection of the people, at what point must/should we draw the line when it comes to corporations?

      Now, there are also many people here that are frightened of this view. There are kernels of truth in what is being expressed. Ideas that cannot be so easily debunked or rationally dealt with. For these ideas the radical alt-left has only forced-silence. There is no conversation. There is no measured rational response. The irrationality and censorship speaks for itself.

      I can't help but see a parallel to the fallout of the 9/11 attacks. Huge shift in public awareness. The powers that be seemed to have been biding their time and used the event as an opportunity to push for things that would not have otherwise been accepted in the court of public opinion. Think Patriot act. Think TSA. Think TIA. I see similar calls for action, now, and fear what is waiting to be unleashed now that the court of public opinion has swayed.

      --
      Wit is intellect, dancing.