Stories
Slash Boxes
Comments

SoylentNews is people

Politics
posted by mrpg on Friday May 28 2021, @11:26AM   Printer-friendly
from the what-could-go-wrong dept.

Ohio lawmakers want to abolish vaccine requirements:

[...] Lawmakers are working on legislation to call off the lottery immediately. They're also trying to head off any plans for "vaccine passports." And last month, they introduced a sweeping antivaccination bill that would essentially demolish public health and vaccination requirements in the state—and not just requirements for COVID-19 vaccines, requirements for any vaccine.

[...] State Rep. Beth Liston (D-Dublin) blasted the bill, telling The Columbus Dispatch, "Not only would it prevent schools, businesses and communities from putting safety measures in pace related to COVID, it will impact the health of our children... This bill applies to all vaccines—polio, measles, meningitis, etc. If it becomes law we will see worsening measles outbreaks, meningitis in the dorms, and children once again suffering from polio."

[...] "At its core, this proposal would destroy our current public health framework that prevents outbreaks of potentially lethal diseases, threatens the stability of our economy as it recovers from a devastating pandemic and jeopardizes the way we live, learn, work and celebrate life," the letter said.

[...] "HB 248 would put all Ohioans at risk while increasing the cost of health care for families, individuals and businesses," spokesperson Dan Williamson said. "This proposal applies to all immunizations, including childhood vaccines. If passed, this legislation could reverse decades of immunity from life-threatening, but vaccine-preventable diseases such as measles, mumps, hepatitis, meningitis and tuberculosis."

Also: Ohio GOP lawmakers, citing 'need to protect' from vaccines, seek to expand exemptions, nix COVID passports


Original Submission

 
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
(1) 2 3
  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @11:55AM (50 children)

    by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @11:55AM (#1139599)

    It burns! Anti intellectualism will be the downfall of this country. Time to buy stock in iron lung and wheelchair companies I guess.

    • (Score: 2) by driverless on Friday May 28 2021, @01:09PM (4 children)

      by driverless (4770) on Friday May 28 2021, @01:09PM (#1139614)

      So I'm not in the US and don't know much about Ohio, but this news report has me asking, Ohio would be pretty rabidly Republican then?

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @01:34PM (3 children)

        by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @01:34PM (#1139619)

        What happens is the major cities are pretty heavy on the democrats and the rest of the state is rural and republican. Due to republican gerrymandering they carve up pockets of the cities down to the street level to benefit their party.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:19PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:19PM (#1139845)

          Street level is too nice. In some states they cut single city blocks into multiple precincts if they have too many complexes on them.

        • (Score: 2) by deathlyslow on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:53PM (1 child)

          by deathlyslow (2818) <wmasmith@gmail.com> on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:53PM (#1140092)

          To be fair both parties suck and do the same thing at different times. It just depends on who has more power at the time. Think pendulum. The only winners are the politicians. Peons being helped is only a happy accident.

          • (Score: 2) by DeVilla on Thursday June 03 2021, @11:01PM

            by DeVilla (5354) on Thursday June 03 2021, @11:01PM (#1141615)

            To follow up this, MN leans fairly Democrat and we have Gerrymanders here too.

            But then again, our Democrat governor removed all the covid / mask / vaccination requirements a wile back. He just put out a set of unenforced recommendations. I'm not complaining. People are pretty reasonable and we don't need covid passports or a nanny state.

            But I do suspect that if we had been a red state I would have read about it in the national news.

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:17PM (34 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:17PM (#1139628)

      Some time you should actually ask people why they support things instead of just straw manning everybody outside of your bubble.

      If one were to list the most corrupt entities in this country, politicians and big pharma would come pretty near the top. Vaccine mandates open the door for you to combine these two actors and then create scenarios where they can pass laws generating what would amount to trillions of dollars in revenue. In the past this has never been an issue, because vaccine mandates were few and far between and (with a handful of exceptions) were generally only used for extremely dangerous diseases like small pox and polio. Small pox kills about 30% of people infected with it. COVID, by contrast, is relatively harmless for the non-elderly, and even for the elderly the mortality rate peaks around 10%. Not something to shrug off, but also nothing like polio or smallpox, to say the least. And the vaccines for smallpox and polio are not only extremely effective at yielding immunity (and not just a reduction of severe outcomes), but they also last an extremely long time - generally your lifetime.

      This bill is not about prohibiting vaccines, but about prohibiting the requirements of such. It is anti-authoritarianism. If you would like to put anything into your body, you should be able to do so. However, you also should not be able to tell other people what they should put into *their* body. Vaccines have always been about individuals protecting themselves, herd immunity a nice aside. This has not changed, though the rhetoric has. If you believe COVID is a high risk and the vaccines are low risk then feel free to vaccinate. And for many people this will be technically true. By contrast, for many individuals COVID is a low risk and the vaccines are a low risk - which means the exact calculus of what should be done is much more complex.

      And finally, this also hasn't even hit on the fact that politicians are not "following the science." People who already have natural immunity to COVID through previous infection are showing negligible rates of reinfection and when reinfected the severity is mild to negligible. Demanding all people, including these, is something worse than authoritarian because it's quite hard to argue that it's being done in good faith.

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @03:18PM (22 children)

        by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @03:18PM (#1139656)

        You are already required to vaccinate your children upon registering them for public school. How is this any different? I'm sure the people who support this really have a background in biology and medicine to understand it.

        Yeah relatively harmless Covid, only 593,000 dead. But hey I guess they were all circling the drain to begin with...

        • (Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:00PM (4 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:00PM (#1139684)

          Well it's macabre, but yes - the vast majority of them were "circling the drain" so to speak. Don't forget that in the US each year about 3 million [cdc.gov] people die.

          I have a simple challenge for you. Go try to find the median age of individual's who died from COVID in the US. You might find it's bizarrely hard to find, even though that is an extremely critical piece of information. Fortunately there is greater transparency in the UK and our numbers approximate theirs in this regard. The answer? 80.4 [ons.gov.uk] years old. In the United States our life expectancy (from pre-COVID times) is about 78.8 years. Obviously you don't drop dead if you're otherwise healthy after hitting 78.8 years, but 50% will have died by then, and your chances grow exponentially each year that follows. So, yes - they were "circling the drain" in general. My grandfather was one of them - 101 years old, Alzheimer's, and a man who had long since left this world, even though his body refused to go along for the longest time.

          But to answer your question more directly we actually can use our numbers. [cdc.gov] The CDC does provide the death rate for the age group of 0-17 of whom your analog is appropriate for. And in a year of a plague with effectively 0 vaccines (for this age group), to say nothing of them being some of the most exposed to the virus? In this age group a total of 44,788 have died. And 300 of those deaths were attributed to COVID.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:23PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:23PM (#1139706)

            Mandatory thoughts and prayers.

          • (Score: 4, Insightful) by sjames on Friday May 28 2021, @07:23PM

            by sjames (2882) on Friday May 28 2021, @07:23PM (#1139806) Journal

            The thing is, we're all circling the drain. Some of us are a lot closer and circling faster than others, but in the long run no one here gets out alive.

            Note that the mortality figures have trended younger over time. Perhaps the infirm were just the easy targets and got taken out early at a time when kids were learning at home and many parents were working from home and carefully following social isolation.

            But mortality is only part of the question. The morbidity (in this case, lasting fatigue, brain fog, malaise) is also important and has affected younger people significantly.

            Polio had a low mortality as well, the morbidity was the problem.

          • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Bethany.Saint on Friday May 28 2021, @08:06PM (1 child)

            by Bethany.Saint (5900) on Friday May 28 2021, @08:06PM (#1139819)

            Median age doesn't mean much. Circling the drain is just plain wrong. How many years early did Covid kill is the question. Early in the epidemic here in the U.S. that figure was 9-1/2 years. For the people Covid killed it took almost 10 years off their expected lifetimes. I have no idea how this changed over time or what it is now but your looking at age alone is almost completely meaningless.

            • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:39PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:39PM (#1140016)

              The papers that have done this have engaged in a very disingenuous thing, whether intentionally or not. They look at the life expectancy at a given age, and simply apply that to deaths. So if somebody at e.g. 50 has a life expectancy of 40 more years and dies a death attributed to COVID then it's counted as 40 years of lost life.

              It seems reasonable, but it's not because of extremely important nuance. COVID is relatively harmless for people without preexisting conditions. And these preexisting conditions are often severe - diabetes, cancer, heart disease, etc. And when somebody dies of cancer but has COVID, it is counted as a COVID death. This is not to inflate the numbers but because of the inverse of what I said. COVID is brutal on folks with major preexisting conditions and so even if the cancer is what "really" killed them, it's entirely possible that COVID may have accelerated the death.

              Anyhow, the point of this is that you need to account for present health status when measuring years of life lost. A 50 year old with diabetes and terminal cancer who's death is marked as a COVID death, has a rather dramatically different life expectancy than a 50 year old in good health. Because of the nature of COVID (minimal effect on healthy, relatively severe effects on unhealthy) this is an extreme bias that renders these sort of studies on years of life lost not only meaningless but grossly misleading.

        • (Score: 2, Insightful) by ElizabethGreene on Friday May 28 2021, @04:11PM (16 children)

          by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:11PM (#1139694)

          You are already required to vaccinate your children upon registering them for public school. How is this any different?

          The MMR, DTaP, and Varicella vaccines have decades of safety and efficacy data. The COVID-19 vaccine is the first FDA approved and mass produced mRNA vaccine and the longest term safety data we have on it is from the Phase one trial participants in May 2020 twelve months ago. One of which is dead, but he was very old so that's not a huge shock or a factor to consider. [1]

          That is a nontrivial difference. ... so, does that justify for me not getting vaccinated? No, not really. I'm in the 40-49 age cohort. Based on that data, my risk of dying from COVID-19 is 0.4%, roughly 1-in-200 chance. I feel, based on solely that and a year of safety data that I'm more likely to die from the disease than the vaccine. [2]

          There is another consideration too. We don't talk about it much, but there is a nontrivial level of immunity if you've recovered from Covid-19.[3] Since I had COVID in January, the data says that provides a natural immunity that is of similar efficacy to having the vaccine. Spitball estimate, this moves my risk goes of dying from Covid from 1 in 200 to roughly 1 in 1,000. It's very hard for me to assert, on faith, that there isn't a 1-in-1,000 chance of severe long-term side effects from the Covid vaccine based on current data.

          Sources:
          [1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/william-shakespeare-first-man-in-world-to-get-approved-covid-vaccine-dies-at-81/ar-AAKn1H9?ocid=entnewsntp [msn.com]
          The dude was 90 and his death was completely unrelated. It's not a data point worth consideration vis-a-vis safety to me.

          [2] https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-age-sex-demographics/ [worldometers.info] COVID-19 Fatality Rate by AGE
          Special thanks to the CDC for intentionally obfuscating this data here:
          https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/investigations-discovery/hospitalization-death-by-age.html [cdc.gov]
          That's a dick move.

          [3] https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00662-0/fulltext [thelancet.com]

          • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:27PM (9 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:27PM (#1139709)

            Christ, hearing the cherries being picked under the guise of faux scientological rigor is honestly worse than listening to religious liberty arguments.

            • (Score: 0, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @06:45PM (5 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @06:45PM (#1139793)

              So even those who got COVID and recovered must take the vaccine? You don't even make sense; you are a vaccine fetishist because taking it is a sign of allegiance to your political tribe, not a matter of immunology.

              • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @07:27PM (4 children)

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @07:27PM (#1139807)
                We have logs of every administration of vaccines, but not not of people who have caught and kicked COVID. (you could be contributing to solving that problem instead of crossing your arms and shaking your head.)

                you are a vaccine fetishist because taking it is a sign of allegiance to your political tribe, not a matter of immunology.

                Coming up with an inconsistent myriad of reasons to be anti-vax or anti-mask is about being part of a poltical tribe. WTF'ing over moronic self destructive behavior... isn't.

                • (Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:24PM (3 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:24PM (#1139820)

                  So you are going to demand proof-of-vaccination from everyone, forcing them to get a vaccine whether they need it or not. Sorry, but NO.

                  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:35PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:35PM (#1139824)

                    For certain activities and hopefully for a limited time, yes. Or is the concept of a pandemic beyond your ability to understand? If the disease sticks around then expect it to become another vaccination requirement for public schools. Once enough people are vaccinated and the case load becomes insignificant I expect vaccination requirements will go back to pre-COVID levels.

                  • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:46PM (1 child)

                    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:46PM (#1139829)

                    So you are going to demand proof-of-vaccination from everyone, forcing them to get a vaccine whether they need it or not.

                    You see... if you had been thinking about this undipshittedly you'd be making suggestions like: "What about getting waivers for the vaccine?" or asking questions like: "What can we do about these practical considerations that won't survive a one-size fits all solution?", and we'd be talking about how to minimize pandemic-related-causalities. But, no, we're gonna shake our heads cos we don't like who's coming up with the life-saving ideas.

                    Here's something for you to ponder: Every single news personality you're parroting your hard-nosed opinion from on has already been vaccinated. They have also not once mentioned vaccine requirements for attending public schools... which you've benefitted from.

                    Lots of 'adults' are going to be siting at the kids table this Thanksgiving.

                    • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:42PM

                      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:42PM (#1139851)

                      I try to keep those "adults" away from the children, thank you very much. I don't need another round of them being told the Muslims are going to bomb their school or the "socialist demonrats" are going to steal their teddy bears.

            • (Score: 3, Informative) by ElizabethGreene on Friday May 28 2021, @10:44PM (2 children)

              by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Friday May 28 2021, @10:44PM (#1139870)

              Please be specific about the cherries I picked. I cited more credible sources than you.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:15AM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:15AM (#1139945)

                Next time you should read them then. "The quality, quantity, and durability of protective immunity elicited by natural infection with SARS-CoV-2 are poor relative to the much higher levels of virus-neutralising antibodies and T cells induced by the vaccines currently being administered globally." And the conclusion sentence is "These data are all confirmation, if it were needed, that for SARS-CoV-2 the hope of protective immunity through natural infections might not be within our reach, and a global vaccination programme with high efficacy vaccines is the enduring solution."

                • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:14AM

                  by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:14AM (#1140168)

                  I did read them, and I read the underlying reference as well. You're right, I did pick a cherry.

                  The authors assert that the level of immunity is correlated with circulating antibody levels, that those levels vary widely post infection, and that the levels decline as a function of time. Those are completely reasonable assertions.

                  The cherry I picked is in the prior paragraph:

                  they determined from that, in general, past infection confers 80·5% protection against reinfection, which decreases to 47·1% in those aged 65 years and older. Hansen and colleagues acknowledge the many limitations of their analysis being restricted to only PCR data, including the possibility that people might change their behaviour after a positive PCR test. This confounder is addressed by noting that the findings are similar in a sensitivity analysis of nurses, doctors, social workers, and health-care assistants who were tested regularly due to their profession.

                  If you go to the underlying citation on the efficacy testing of the vaccine candidate (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31604-4/fulltext) Figure 4 graphs A and B the circulating antibody levels for PCR confirmed COVID patients is higher than 14 days post one-shot and lower but not dramatically so after the booster. That leaves a quandary. Did that study (n=5) randomly pick people only with very high levels of antibodies?

                   

          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @06:24PM (2 children)

            by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @06:24PM (#1139781)

            mRNA has been studied for years. It's nothing new. What is new is using it to deliver a vaccine.

            • (Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:31AM (1 child)

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:31AM (#1139966)

              It is new in fact, everything we know is new. Humans have been plodding along for millennia, you're speaking on a mechanism underpinning biology that has only been around for 60 years. The world as we know it is about 100 years old. We don't know shit.

              • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 01 2021, @02:52AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 01 2021, @02:52AM (#1140639)

                Better not use Wi-Fi. Who knows what could happen, the technology is just too new.

          • (Score: 5, Informative) by sjames on Friday May 28 2021, @07:38PM (2 children)

            by sjames (2882) on Friday May 28 2021, @07:38PM (#1139810) Journal

            You would have personally received vaccines with MUCH shorter safety records (the very same ones you mention). Plenty of people here on Soylent didn't get MMR because they started school before the combination was approved (but would have gotten measles and mumps vaccine separately). You probably got MMR only a year or two after it was approved.

            Note that all of the vaccines you mentioned are intrinsically riskier than an mRNA vaccine.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:43PM (1 child)

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:43PM (#1140019)

              COVID vaccines have not yet even been officially approved. The emergency use authorization is a means of temporarily bypassing normal safety requirements.

              So no, nobody would have ever been forced to get vaccines like this. The COVID vaccines are literally experimental.

              • (Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday May 30 2021, @12:14AM

                by sjames (2882) on Sunday May 30 2021, @12:14AM (#1140136) Journal

                The difference between the emergency use authorization and full approval is a metric assload of paperwork and the final efficacy studies. They have made it through the safety studies and the mass distribution has borne that out.

                Much of that metric assload of paperwork and some of the testing only became required after the typical childhood immunizations were approved.

                So realistically, people my age and a little younger were required to be vaccinated with vaccines that were roughly as well tested as the COVID vaccine.

      • (Score: 1, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:41PM (8 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:41PM (#1139672)

        Tend to agree that big pharma can be corrupt, but they aren't making their money on vaccines, which are generally pretty low cost. Pharma makes their money on boner drugs, chemo and a number of other very expensive medications--that's where the corruption risk lies.

        • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:16PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:16PM (#1139697)
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:28PM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:28PM (#1139711)

          > boner drugs, chemo and a number of other very expensive medications

          That sounds like the contents of Rush Limbaugh's suitcase on a trip to the Dominican Republic

          • (Score: 2) by DannyB on Friday May 28 2021, @05:41PM

            by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 28 2021, @05:41PM (#1139753) Journal

            Rush would also include opioid narcotics in his briefcase.

            --
            This Christmas season is the most likely to see Missile Tow instead of large artillery pieces being toed.
        • (Score: 1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:31PM (4 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:31PM (#1139712)

          Moderna stock [yahoo.com] (MRNA - cute huh?) is up more than 900% since the plague began. Novvax [yahoo.com] is up a whopping 3700%.

          Pfizer has stated they expect to sell a gross of $15 billion [qz.com] worth of COVID vaccines in 2021 with a profit margin of 25-30% (expected to increase over the coming years). That will make their COVID vaccine, alone, the second highest annual grossing drug - ever. For some contrast, Viagra (also made by Pfizer) generated about $0.5 billion in revenue in 2019. The reason their stock isn't seeing the same insane growth is largely because even though they're making money hand over fist with these vaccines, they were already a very large and profitable company whereas MRNA and NVAX show the profit effects of the virus more in a vacuum of companies that didn't have much else going for them.

          But suffice to say vaccines are making a lot of people very very rich. The messaging about "oh they're not profiting off the vaccines" is being pushed primarily by corporate media, and it is a lie.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:47PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:47PM (#1139852)

            Have you seen their SEC and other regulator reports? Those numbers are child's play in comparison, as are the profit margins.

          • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:07AM (2 children)

            by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:07AM (#1139943) Journal

            a profit margin of 25-30% (expected to increase over the coming years)

            Why expected to increase? It is today that the COVID-19 vaccine is in high demand, one year or so from now the demand will lower down to the volumes we are seeing now for flu vaccines.
            Are you saying that shitloads of competition on a lower demand market will increase the profit margin?

            --
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:18AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:18AM (#1139946)

              Don't you know how this works? You lose money on every sale, but make up for it in volume!</sarcasm>

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:52PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:52PM (#1140022)

              They offered two reasons:

              1) They can increase prices once we're out of pandemic status. They are accepting "only" a 25-30% profit margin while we remain in a pandemic status.

              2) Increased efficiency and scale in production, transport, and so on.

              Don't conflate profit margin (how many cents I earn per dollar of costs) with profit (total revenue - total costs). Profit margins can increase while profits decrease.

      • (Score: 5, Informative) by Tork on Friday May 28 2021, @04:37PM

        by Tork (3914) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:37PM (#1139718)

        This bill is not about prohibiting vaccines, but about prohibiting the requirements of such. It is anti-authoritarianism.

        It's contrarianism and you know it.

        --
        Slashdolt Logic: "24 year old jokes about sharks and lasers are +5, Funny." 💩
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @10:56AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @10:56AM (#1140220)

        Bovine excrement.

    • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:50PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:50PM (#1139646)

      What you're doing is anti-intellectualism. Censure of thought and restrictions of liberty. But you're right, we should submit to science, which by its very nature makes far more errors than it does conclusions. We should submit to modernity which does little more than shape humanity into consumer cogs, into machines. We should supplicate ourselves to the religion of our government, the highest bastion of good thinking and virtue.

      • (Score: 4, Touché) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @03:24PM

        by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @03:24PM (#1139662)

        Oh this is a good one. What genius free thinker you are. Smarter than the thousands of doctors and scientists who created this vaccine. I look forward to reading your published research on how they are all wrong. Nobody is censuring your thoughts, your smooth brain is doing a good enough job on it's own.

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:32PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:32PM (#1139713)

        Look out your window. See the open sewers? The dead lying in the gutter? Armed men watching over their property? Shit, you can't even see the civilization being supported by our collective decision to govern ourselves. Wooooh!!!! Gubmint off my medicare. Waaaaah!!

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:45PM (4 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:45PM (#1139675)

      So... asserting the right of human beings to refuse to be treated like cattle... bothers you.
      Got it.

      • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:41PM (3 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:41PM (#1139825)

        Who is killing your family? Cannibals? Humanburgers??

        Your hysterical hyperbole is what bothers us. No one is forcing you to get vaccinated, no one is forcing you to wear a mask in your own home or when you walk down the street.

        You are free to reject vaccination, but don't whine when you're barred from certain activities or travel abroad. What's that? Consequences for your own choices? Womp womp

        • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:08PM (2 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:08PM (#1139841)

          And if you have your way, ignoring facts like herd immunity was achieved late last year (oh, God forbid you listen to any M.D. or scientist that doesn't get air time on CNN), we'll end up with a two-tiered society where some of us are more equal than others. How "Animal Farm" of you! So enlightened!
          BTW, it shows that you're doing a really poor job of "Knowing your enemy".
          How about you spend 15 minutes outside you echo chamber and see for yourself what "the other side" is saying.
          The side that is not allowed on mainstream media?
          I recommend the short video of Dr. Peter McCullough from Texas A&M. You can find it on Bitchute.

          • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:20AM

            by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:20AM (#1139947) Journal

            ignoring facts like herd immunity was achieved late last year (oh, God forbid you listen to any M.D. or scientist that doesn't get air time on CNN)

            Herd immunity would result in the number of infections going down. Because, see, it's sort of an immunity.

            Let's give it a check [worldometers.info]. Whoops, the maximum number of new infections is around Jan 08 2021. And the going down after can be attributed to many other causes, mask and distancing included.

            I recommend the short video of Dr. Peter McCullough from Texas A&M.

            If you spouted the non-sense above based on that one, I recommend you take that recommendation and stick it up your ass - at least you may derive some pleasure in doing something with an otherwise worthless piece of stuff.

            --
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
          • (Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:25AM

            by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:25AM (#1140609) Journal

            ignoring facts like herd immunity was achieved late last year

            You need a better class of facts.

            we'll end up with a two-tiered society where some of us are more equal than others.

            It's the typical structure of willing ignorant versus not. Your choice which tier you choose to belong to.

            Your right to not be injected with stuff is matched by our right not be infected by preventable diseases. And there's more of us.

    • (Score: 2, Interesting) by STDOUBT on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:09AM (1 child)

      by STDOUBT (4634) on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:09AM (#1139908)

      Think you're smart huh?
      You smarter than this guy?
      https://rumble.com/vhp8e1-massive-world-renowned-doctor-blows-lid-off-of-covid-vaccine.html [rumble.com]

      --
      We must not say that every mistake is a foolish one.~Marcus Tullius Cicero
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:48AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:48AM (#1139951)

        That is a new approach, instead of puffing up credentials just lying about them is so much better. And why not get your coronavirus advice from a cardiology specialist. I'll take my advice from the people listed at the place he works that are actually listed as experts in Coronavirus, a list that excludes him by the way. I'll also take the advice of the other, actually qualified experts in the area.

        I also appreciate how the third suggested video on the list offered the opportunity to learn the "TRUTH" about the "Thousand Year Reich."

  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by WizardFusion on Friday May 28 2021, @12:03PM (95 children)

    by WizardFusion (498) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 28 2021, @12:03PM (#1139601) Journal

    What the fuck are you people doing over there?

    There are people that want the vaccine but can't get it, the US has it but actively doesn't want it.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by epitaxial on Friday May 28 2021, @12:09PM (47 children)

      by epitaxial (3165) on Friday May 28 2021, @12:09PM (#1139603)

      It's mostly the republican party moving further to the right. At some point they will reach parity with Sharia law and the Taliban. Make no mistake they would write the literal interpretation of the bible into law if they could. Which would be pretty amusing when all the women teachers would be forced to quit as the bible forbids that. Wait is that the old or new testament?

      • (Score: 3, Informative) by zocalo on Friday May 28 2021, @01:31PM (1 child)

        by zocalo (302) on Friday May 28 2021, @01:31PM (#1139618)
        The most Sharia-like rules and judicial stuff in the Bible is in Leviticus, which is the old testament. If you're familiar with Gilead in "The Handmaid's Tale", it goes even further than that in what people (mostly women, not not always) are not allowed to do, and is also quite specific about specific. There's a lot of stoning, IIRC.
        --
        UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
        • (Score: 5, Funny) by sjames on Friday May 28 2021, @07:41PM

          by sjames (2882) on Friday May 28 2021, @07:41PM (#1139813) Journal

          Interestingly, it's the Republicans that want to stone people for getting stoned.

      • (Score: 3, Informative) by HammeredGlass on Friday May 28 2021, @01:55PM (8 children)

        by HammeredGlass (12241) on Friday May 28 2021, @01:55PM (#1139623)

        If Christians wanted to be pedants about what should be considered an obsolete covenant per Hebrews 8:13, then the only limitation on teaching that women are bound by would be from Timothy 2:12 and it states that a woman will merely not teach men. Boys under the age of manhood can be taught by women.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:57PM (5 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:57PM (#1139856)

          17 Do not suppose that I came to throw down the Law or the Prophets—I did not come to throw down, but to fulfill; 18 for truly I say to you, until the heaven and the earth may pass away, one iota or one tittle may not pass away from the Law, until all may come to pass. 19 Therefore whoever may loose one of these commands—the least—and may teach men so, he will be called least in the kingdom of the heavens, but whoever may do and may teach [them], he will be called great in the kingdom of the heavens. 20 For I say to you that if your righteousness may not abound above that of the scribes and Pharisees, you may not enter into the kingdom of the heavens.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:10PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:10PM (#1140008)

            above that of the scribes and Pharisees

            Interesting... even in Biblical times, bureaucrats were considered pariahs?

          • (Score: 1) by HammeredGlass on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:06PM (3 children)

            by HammeredGlass (12241) on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:06PM (#1140300)

            Masoretic apologia

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday May 31 2021, @05:13AM (2 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Monday May 31 2021, @05:13AM (#1140440)

              The words out of his mouth vs the words of a guy who never met him in an antilegomena outside the biblical canon of a surprisingly large percentage of Christians.

              • (Score: 1) by HammeredGlass on Monday May 31 2021, @02:40PM (1 child)

                by HammeredGlass (12241) on Monday May 31 2021, @02:40PM (#1140498)

                Acts 15

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 01 2021, @03:45AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 01 2021, @03:45AM (#1140643)

                  His own words vs. an anonymous author who never met him, who claimed to be an accomplice of Paul despite repeatedly contradicting Paul and his writings.

        • (Score: 2) by PinkyGigglebrain on Friday May 28 2021, @10:12PM (1 child)

          by PinkyGigglebrain (4458) on Friday May 28 2021, @10:12PM (#1139860)

          Thanks for the pointer to Hebrew 8:13

          Now I have something I can throw back at members of my Aunt's family when they start justifying their bigotry and prejudice by spouting off Leviticus and other Old Testament based bullshit.

          If I ever talk to any of them again that is.

          --
          "Beware those who would deny you Knowledge, For in their hearts they dream themselves your Master."
      • (Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:27PM (7 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:27PM (#1139633)

        Think about what you're saying for a minute, instead of just enjoying the circle jerk. Religion is generally not big on individual liberty. This act says that the government cannot force you to inject substances into your body without your consent. It is religion that always insists it knows what is good for you, and if you don't abide - then it's time for force.

        Part of the reason I've moved away from modern liberalism is because of things like this. Liberalism derives from liberty. Having the highest ranking figures in society decide what is best for people and then forcing that upon them with intolerance for differing views is the literal definition of authoritarianism, and is a just a hair's width away from fascism.

        This is also why, increasingly, I think that left and right are no longer the main divides in society. But rather libertarianism vs authoritarianism. On the left/right stuff, I think the bulk of society is mostly pretty closely aligned (even if the extremes get 95% of media coverage). But I think on the authoritarianism vs libertarianism, there is a growing divide right in the middle of society that is completely independent of left vs right.

        • (Score: 0, Flamebait) by EJ on Friday May 28 2021, @02:49PM (2 children)

          by EJ (2452) on Friday May 28 2021, @02:49PM (#1139645)

          Be careful with your wrongthink. You aren't allowed to say such things out loud.

          • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:23PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:23PM (#1139743)

            It's not just the Republican party. Both sides have gone batshit insane. There is a method to their madness, though. They are playing both sides against the middle. The left and the right don't want unity. They don't want us to come together because then they lose their control over us.

            Be careful with your wrongthink. You aren't allowed to say such things out loud.

            Criticizes both sides for not wanting unity, purposefully misstates the the views of the opposition.

          • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:50PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @08:50PM (#1139831)

            Funny how simple criticism gets you all up on your "wrongthink" pedestal, along with the cancel culture freakouts, etc. Turns out conservatives are the cancel culture cheerleaders and for wrongthink all I have to do is say the world "socialism" and watch the death threats come in.

            You lot are so far off your rockers with this imagined persecution complex simply because people don't like your ideas or your attempts to infringe on the rights of others because MuH FrEEdUmS. Spinning yourselves as the true liberty loving libertarians just belies your ignorant selfishness that is quite unhinged from reality.

            The US has plenty of authoritarian issues and bad policies, but freaking out over the rules during a pandemic instead of the truly police-state stuff makes you look really really bad. To those of us not in the qult it is quite obvious how politically driven the mask/vaxx issue is, but a good chunk of pandemic freakout catches even more of you. What a perfect storm for rubes. Don't get vaccinated if you don't want, just stop whining about people thinking you're an idiot.

            True FREEDOM is anarchy, and we already know that shit doesn't work. Maybe in a few millenia once humans have evolved a little further from their base instincts.

        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday May 28 2021, @04:34PM

          by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:34PM (#1139714) Journal

          This act says that the government cannot force you to inject substances into your body without your consent.

          Nope. This act PROHIBITS the free market from deciding that endangering their customers is a bad idea. You are encroaching on my property rights by saying I can't keep dangerous fuckwits off my property.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:37PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:37PM (#1139716)

          How's the Freedom is not Free argument working when it's on the other boot? You're free not to take a vaccine so then you are Free to home-school your kids.

        • (Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:32AM

          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:32AM (#1140612) Journal

          This act says that the government cannot force you to inject substances into your body without your consent. It is religion that always insists it knows what is good for you, and if you don't abide - then it's time for force.

          What those dangerous, preventable diseases that vaccines vaccinate against? Do people have a right not to be infected by others without their consent?

        • (Score: 2) by hendrikboom on Wednesday June 02 2021, @12:03PM

          by hendrikboom (1125) on Wednesday June 02 2021, @12:03PM (#1141012) Homepage Journal

          Religion is generally not big on individual liberty.

          True of organized religion.

      • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Sourcery42 on Friday May 28 2021, @02:33PM (12 children)

        by Sourcery42 (6400) on Friday May 28 2021, @02:33PM (#1139635)

        We're just furthering our transition from United States of America into Dumbfuckistan. Fascists and the religious right have siezed control of our ultra-conservative party and are hellbent on imposing their will on others. All but the most progressive leaning of our "Liberal" party would be considered at best centrist in most developed nations.

        Asimov said it better, "Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."

        • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:21PM (4 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:21PM (#1139659)

          As our country moves further and further towards extremism, the meme that our ostensibly "liberal" agendas would be considered normal in "most developed nations" is becoming more and more out of touch. This [jhu.edu] is a list of countries by vaccination percents. You might notice that "most developed nations" have dramatically lower vaccination rates than the US. And it's not because they don't have access to said vaccines, but because personal liberty tends to be a bigger factor. I currently live in the developing world, and even over here you can trivially get vaccinated if you want to (and for free). In fact they're even doing the exact same thing over here where they're giving away chances to win free gold necklaces and other things to people that agree to get vaccinated. Suffice to say the "problem" is not a lack of vaccines, much as I expect your media may have convinced you otherwise.

          Even governments in "most developed nations" are vastly more cautious. For instance the AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson vaccines have been banned or many of the "most developed nations" including Denmark, Norway, Sweden, and others. Yet over here, we actively work to censor even the discussion of a negative risk:reward for *any* vaccine, and suggesting as much is seen as justification for digital lynch mobs to try to destroy people's lives.

          The problem is not our liberalism, but our authoritarianism and self delusion. You are here literally arguing that somebody saying the government should not be able to *force* people to inject things, without their consent, is somebody "imposing their will on others." It makes no sense whatsoever, and I suspect 10 years from now you'll convince yourself you never even held such beliefs. Because right now we're headed down a very dark road, that's been traveled many times before. And that road, in spite of how awful a place it leads to, is paved with nothing but good intentions.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:40PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:40PM (#1139720)

            Got it, vaccines are like Zyklon-B.

          • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:31AM (1 child)

            by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:31AM (#1139948) Journal

            This [jhu.edu] is a list of countries by vaccination percents. You might notice that "most developed nations" have dramatically lower vaccination rates than the US.

            Did it cross your mind that there can be heaps of causes to explain it?
            Including US hoarding the vaccine supplies for itself, to the point of other developed nations having to beg for help [ctvnews.ca]?

            --
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:55PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @01:55PM (#1140023)

              In this day and age of suggesting the headline of an article explains it all, some forget that elaboration and details are often proffered just beyond the first sentence.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:21AM

            by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:21AM (#1140199)

            I moved from the Netherlands to Sweden one month ago. Both the Netherlands and Sweden currently prioritize elderly, and behind that the at-risk groups for getting the vaccine. I am in an at-risk group myself due to asthma.

            I only just received an invitation to come get the vaccine from the dutch gov just one week ago. (It was forwarded to my new Swedish mail address by the dutch post company.)

            In other words: I would like to get the vaccine but simply haven't been able to yet due to shortages/rationing in the past few months before I moved.

            So please do not use currently vaccinated numbers in Europe as some kind of evidence for widespread anti-vaccin sentiment. Me and many others want to get it, once we get our turn.

            I expect the numbers will improve drastically as vaccines before more widely available.

        • (Score: 0, Insightful) by ChrisMaple on Friday May 28 2021, @03:22PM (6 children)

          by ChrisMaple (6964) on Friday May 28 2021, @03:22PM (#1139660)

          There is no significant "ultra-conservative" party in the U.S.. If there were, you would hear widespread calls for the end of the income tax, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare, antitrust laws, mandatory insurance laws, and many others. Religious conservative politicians would be proposing that Sunday closing of retail businesses be mandatory.

          People in the center and non-religious right just want to be left alone by government, so that they can go about living and enjoying their own lives. This means that they don't seek government jobs. Leftists and other authoritarians want to order people around and take their stuff, so they seek government employment. That employment includes teaching, so that they corrupt the minds of youngsters and push a leftward agenda, which results in an increasingly leftist population. What Europe and the US accept now as normal would have been viewed as absurd 60 years ago.

          In a 1967 or 1968 speech at MIT, Asimov said "I voted for Johnson but I got Goldwater", meaning he thought he was voting to end unnecessary military action. That Asimov did not realize what Johnson was illustrates Asimov's complete and utter incompetence in political and cultural judgement.

          • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:00PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:00PM (#1139682)

            > Leftists and other authoritarians

            From where I sit, these are orthogonal--authoritarians come in every political stripe.

            Many people like to be told what to do, sometimes I think this is intellectual laziness, they just don't want to take the time to do their own thinking. Another weakness (extremely common, I've caught myself in this one) is succumbing to repetition--if you hear something enough times (or in early life) why then, it must be true[NOT]. Anyway, for whatever reason, this portion of the population is ripe for the picking by the small group of people that make up the "charismatic" leaders.

            I'm automatically leery of anyone promising easy answers.
             

          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday May 28 2021, @04:42PM

            by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:42PM (#1139723) Journal

            There is no significant "ultra-conservative" party in the U.S.

            If there were, you would hear widespread calls for the end of the income tax,

            Republican States Struggle With How to Replace Income Taxes [bloombergtax.com]

            Social Security,

            Trump's Second-Term Plan For Social Security: Starve The Beast [forbes.com]

            Medicare, Medicaid,

            GOP takes aim at Social Security, Medicare [fayobserver.com]

            welfare

            LOL!!!!!

            antitrust laws

            Bush administration abandons court fight for Microsoft breakup, seeks lesser penalty [tahoedailytribune.com]

            mandatory insurance laws

            Yep, they're HUGE fans of Obamacare

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:43PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:43PM (#1139724)

            > People in the center and non-religious right just want to be left alone by government

            I mean... WTF? You might as call them Good Guys and Bad Guys. Dipshit.

          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by edIII on Friday May 28 2021, @11:42PM (2 children)

            by edIII (791) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 28 2021, @11:42PM (#1139883)

            None of that has anything to do with vaccines and safety. Medicine is not political. Vaccines are not political. Face masks are not political. They're about FUCKING SURVIVAL.

            Reduce America down to a single town of a few thousand people. Introduce a deadly biological pathogen. 500 years ago we would be burning some people at the stake out of ignorance having made it religious. That God was punishing us for some reason. There would be fervent and unanswered prayers about why it was happening. Evil sociopaths would use it as a tool to consolidate or take power.

            Look at today. We're blessed with advanced science and medical. There is no ignorance. We even have pictures of the pathogen and sophisticated understanding of its workings. Within 12 months we've developed an effective treatment.

            If you're refusing to get the vaccine, you're a danger to society. Period. Those few dozen or hundred people in the town will be expelled by the rest because they're a danger. You've seen plenty of movies, and read plenty of books I'm sure, that outline how that shit plays out. Those that argue and refuse to take the steps necessary get their brains eaten by the zombies after being shoved outside. Or shoved out an airlock, or shoved off the boat. Those that did weren't being unreasonable, it was those that were being shoved out that were the unreasonable parties.

            It's a fucking face mask and injection. To stop a deadly pathogen. It's about survival period, and if you're not cooperating, your're objectively a danger to yourself and those around you. Then it's completely reasonable to take action against you. There is nothing political about it. There is no reasonable discussion of freedoms and rights, when those freedom and rights are directly, objectively, and profoundly endangering the rest of the people in the town. Nobody agrees to that social contract, that you get fundamental rights to put the rest of us at serious risk. If you want those rights so bad, then leave our society.

            The only reasonable question you can raise is if the vaccine causes you harm, and the only reasonable doubt you can have is if the purveyors of the vaccine are operating in a correct fashion. Those both have answers. Universal Health Care and the Death Penalty.

            If the vaccine causes you harm, you will be taken care of medically regardless. There shouldn't be any harm because those responsible for the creation and manufacturing are monitored and strictly regulated. If they do anything, especially in the name of Capitalism and Profits, that knowingly causes harm and death to thousands or worse.... well then that is prison time and penalties up to and including death.

            I'm tired of hearing this bullshit about leftism, the extreme far right, and civil rights. This is about surviving a profoundly deadly biological war waged upon us by nature. Science and reason is asking for so very little. Not your firstborn, not prima nocta, not indentured servitude. Just a fucking mask, some soap and water, and taking a vaccine that can finally bring us back to some normalcy. Assuming we ever had it.

            It is not totalitarianism to ask you to not be a danger to society if you want to be in it.

            --
            Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:04PM (1 child)

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:04PM (#1140025)

              In times past, they wouldn't have even noticed less than 1% of people dying slightly faster than expected. Note the median age of death for COVID is 83 [ons.gov.uk]. They'd have seen folks catching cold, some passing, and moved on with their lives.

              As an aside, this is also why the fear mongering about Africa ended up being completely absurd. COVID was supposed to wreak a trail of death and destruction through Africa unless they all got vaccinated, locked down, etc.. They ended up neither vaccinated nor locked down (with some exceptions like South Africa). And the result? Basically nothing. The median age in countries throughout Africa tends to be *extremely* low, and as COVID has next to no effect on the young, their resultant deaths from COVID have been non-existent.

              You probably won't realize this for many years to come, but you're the sort of person that would have been cheering on the burning of witches in one era, or hunting of heretics in another. You know, dangers to society.

              • (Score: 1) by khallow on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:36AM

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 01 2021, @12:36AM (#1140613) Journal

                In times past, they wouldn't have even noticed less than 1% of people dying slightly faster than expected.

                We have better knowledge and technology than they had. We notice what they would have ignored.

      • (Score: 0, Insightful) by EJ on Friday May 28 2021, @02:39PM (12 children)

        by EJ (2452) on Friday May 28 2021, @02:39PM (#1139639)

        It's not just the Republican party. Both sides have gone batshit insane. There is a method to their madness, though. They are playing both sides against the middle. The left and the right don't want unity. They don't want us to come together because then they lose their control over us.

        If either side becomes more moderate, then the majority might realize that the vocal minority of both parties are the real problem, and the rest of us have much more in common than the news media would like you to believe.

        • (Score: 1, Insightful) by fustakrakich on Friday May 28 2021, @04:02PM (11 children)

          by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:02PM (#1139685) Journal

          There is no "both sides". The DNC/GOP is a power sharing coalition, working together to keep the competition out. The "opposition" is theater. They are very successful, receiving 98% of the vote every time. Xi, in China, only got 75% of the vote

          --
          Ok, we paid the ransom. Do I get my dog back? REDЯUM
          • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Friday May 28 2021, @04:20PM (6 children)

            by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:20PM (#1139702)

            For reasons I don't understand I can't mod parent up, but they've got a very sharp point worth considering.

            There is no "both sides". The DNC/GOP is a power sharing coalition, working together to keep the competition out. The "opposition" is theater. They are very successful, receiving 98% of the vote every time. Xi, in China, only got 75% of the vote

            OOF!

            • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:39PM (5 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:39PM (#1139749)

              Uh... never mind Fusty. He is forever and always trying to incite a class war. It's his shtick. It's the same sharp point over and over and over. His world is monochrome.

              --
              He'll never tell you why its wrong, or what else might be better - only that you should hate it.

              • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Friday May 28 2021, @06:42PM (4 children)

                by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday May 28 2021, @06:42PM (#1139790) Journal

                always trying to incite a class war

                Vive la révolution!

                --
                Ok, we paid the ransom. Do I get my dog back? REDЯUM
                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:35AM (3 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:35AM (#1139950)

                  High RPM, yes.

                  • (Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:57AM (2 children)

                    by fustakrakich (6150) on Saturday May 29 2021, @04:57AM (#1139953) Journal

                    331/3

                    --
                    Ok, we paid the ransom. Do I get my dog back? REDЯUM
                    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @05:05AM (1 child)

                      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @05:05AM (#1139955)

                      Raise you to 45, better tone dynamics.

                      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:50AM

                        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:50AM (#1139976)

                        Ah who can forget the raspy tones of 45.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:47PM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:47PM (#1139728)

            I know right? It's the pits. Happy to hear your alternative, better form of self-governance.

            • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:20AM (1 child)

              by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:20AM (#1140170)

              I have a strong libertarian bent. With that as background, my slipshod understanding of history leads me to believe that Humans aren't good enough people to thrive under either pure libertarianism or communism.

              Representative Democracy isn't much better at compensating for human fallibility, but it's the best we've found so far.

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @11:06AM

                by Anonymous Coward on Sunday May 30 2021, @11:06AM (#1140223)

                Representative Democracy isn't much better at compensating for human fallibility, but it's the best we've found so far.

                Real pity it doesn't exist in the US then.

          • (Score: 2, Interesting) by khallow on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:23AM

            by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:23AM (#1139912) Journal
            Xi never had competition. The two major political parties have each other. There is a significant difference between a monopoly and a duopoly.
      • (Score: 2) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Friday May 28 2021, @05:51PM (1 child)

        by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Friday May 28 2021, @05:51PM (#1139759)

        Given something that's working, like vaccination programs, a classic conservative would be reluctant to change it.

        A fear-based conservative would prioritize public safety measures.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:52AM

          by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @06:52AM (#1139977)

          A dipshit online would post a bunch of bullshit.

    • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:09PM (11 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:09PM (#1139627)

      What the fuck are you people doing over there?

      What the fuck are you people doing over there? Wishing for laws where the government can compel you to do anything and rushing headlong into a papers please society?
      I got my jabs but I sure as fuck wouldn't want to be compelled to by law.

      • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:50PM (10 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @03:50PM (#1139677)

        The shots are largely pointless if most people don't get them and we've seen what happens with exemptions. Childhood illnesses that had been virtually eradicated from the country are coming back and causing real harm.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:02PM (9 children)

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:02PM (#1139686)

          >. The shots are largely pointless

          I'm over 65, the covid vaccine doesn't seem pointless to me. Based on the data I've read, even if I do catch covid (still a possibility) my chances of getting a severe case are greatly reduced.

          • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Friday May 28 2021, @04:25PM

            by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:25PM (#1139707)

            For people in your age cohort and older you are spot on. Vaccination replaces a very real risk of severe COVID impact with a relatively trivial risk of living long enough to discover there is some currently-unknown long-term side effect.

          • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:25PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:25PM (#1139744)

            Only for covered strains and of enough other people don't get vaccinated, the likelihood of mutations that defeat the vaccine increases.

          • (Score: 4, Insightful) by VLM on Friday May 28 2021, @05:37PM (6 children)

            by VLM (445) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 28 2021, @05:37PM (#1139748)

            Another advantage of being old, is it seems inevitable in a decade or two we're going to hear TV commercials along the lines of "If you or a loved one took a covid vaccine in the early 2020s, you may be entitled to compensation, please call 1-800-whatever"

            If you're over 65 and it turns you sterile or gives you cancer in 40 years its like ... well ... nothing personal bro but you weren't going to make it that far anyway. I'm just saying if the vaccine gives you Alzheimer's in 50 years and you make it 50 years that sucks but statistically you're not gonna make it 50 years from now anyway. If the vaccine would have made you hideously ill twenty years after you died naturally of a stroke, it don't matter does it?

            Now give the vaccine to a kid who's 5 and essentially immune to covid anyway due to youth, and now they're sterile or have some awful autoimmune disease or cancer in 30 years and they get killed around the peak of their life, its a real tragedy. Not much potential upside and huge potential downside.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by crafoo on Friday May 28 2021, @06:16PM (3 children)

              by crafoo (6639) on Friday May 28 2021, @06:16PM (#1139777)

              COVID put real fear of mortality into the boomers. There is no amount of damage they won't do, no insane requirement they won't make the younger generations pay, to avoid: responsibility, death, paying the tab.

              • (Score: 2) by Barenflimski on Friday May 28 2021, @06:30PM

                by Barenflimski (6836) on Friday May 28 2021, @06:30PM (#1139787)

                Maybe. Where I'm at though, the millennials are at least as worried and at least as over the top as any other group. In other words, I don't see a big difference in thinking between the millennials, the Xers and the Boomers.

                From my experience, the folks I've talked to that haven't completely lost their minds are fairly well distributed among all of the groups.

              • (Score: 3, Insightful) by khallow on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:31AM

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:31AM (#1139920) Journal

                COVID put real fear of mortality into the boomers. There is no amount of damage they won't do, no insane requirement they won't make the younger generations pay, to avoid: responsibility, death, paying the tab.

                I find it interesting how responsibility is evoked to avoid your responsibility. Here's my take. I respect the Boomer generation. They did a lot for us. I don't respect someone who evokes imaginary generational conflict to avoid doing the responsible thing. Be a man. Get the damn vaccine so you aren't helping spread covid.

              • (Score: 2) by ElizabethGreene on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:23AM

                by ElizabethGreene (6748) on Sunday May 30 2021, @03:23AM (#1140172)

                This does not match my non-scientific anecdotal observations. My Boomer friends were the ones pushing back hardest against the lockdowns extending into the fall, mask mandates, store closures, etc. Are you seeing something different on the ground?

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by sjames on Friday May 28 2021, @09:07PM

              by sjames (2882) on Friday May 28 2021, @09:07PM (#1139840) Journal

              Unless, of course, it means that in 20 years or so the now 25 year old is diagnosed with post-COVID syndrome. Or Grandpa dies of COVID and a few years later the kid realizes he might have been the asymptomatic carrier that gave it to him...

            • (Score: 2) by c0lo on Saturday May 29 2021, @05:03AM

              by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @05:03AM (#1139954) Journal

              essentially immune to covid anyway due to youth

              May seem pedantic, but the kids are not inherently immune. They are less likely to die or suffer complications from it.
              I bet the premature born ones are a lot more likely to get a nasty form of it than those brought to term.

              --
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0
    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by RedGreen on Friday May 28 2021, @02:20PM (27 children)

      by RedGreen (888) on Friday May 28 2021, @02:20PM (#1139630)

      "What the fuck are you people doing over there?

      There are people that want the vaccine but can't get it, the US has it but actively doesn't want it."

      Republicans are racist fascist fucking morons and Democrats are spineless bastards who want to sit around and do nothing with the murdering thugs. A four decade long at least quest by the right wing garbage to undermine democracy at every turn yet they continue to put up with it, Eisenhower warned of the signs of it in the 1950s. Along with the Russians and now the Chinese who have long manipulated them into a cycle of self-destructive BS and they just lap it up. Showing their lies about freedom and equality they lived all the country's existence, we are in a war without a shot being fired by them. Sadly the west loses badly as that infection has taken hold in all the democracies of the world too, these weak slimy bastard politicians of all stripes going for power above all else at the expense of the people of this planet. I expect that behaviour from the dictators it is nothing new to history for them, the good governments used to at least try to be different now unless we have massive turn around it looks grim.

      --
      "I modded down, down, down, and the flames went higher." -- Sven Olsen
      • (Score: 3, Insightful) by ChrisMaple on Friday May 28 2021, @03:32PM (25 children)

        by ChrisMaple (6964) on Friday May 28 2021, @03:32PM (#1139667)

        In 1830 Andrew Jackson and Martin van Buren formed the Democratic Party for the purpose of protecting, promoting, and preserving race-based chattel slavery. In 1896 William Jennings Bryan added theft to the Democratic Party agenda. Nothing significant has changed since then.

        The Republican Party was formed in 1854 with the abolition of slavery as its primary goal. That has not changed, either.

        • (Score: 0, Flamebait) by fustakrakich on Friday May 28 2021, @04:04PM

          by fustakrakich (6150) on Friday May 28 2021, @04:04PM (#1139688) Journal

          And now (ok, 53 years ago) they have merged

          --
          Ok, we paid the ransom. Do I get my dog back? REDЯUM
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Beryllium Sphere (r) on Friday May 28 2021, @05:54PM (21 children)

          by Beryllium Sphere (r) (5062) on Friday May 28 2021, @05:54PM (#1139762)

          They switched sides in the 20th century. Extensively documented.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy [wikipedia.org]

          • (Score: 0, Troll) by crafoo on Friday May 28 2021, @06:21PM (20 children)

            by crafoo (6639) on Friday May 28 2021, @06:21PM (#1139779)

            A lie, told often enough, doesn't make it true. No one switched sides. The left still openly and gleefully promotes slavery. I mean, they are too stupid to realize communism = slavery, but then democrats have never been all that intelligent.

            • (Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @06:57PM (15 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @06:57PM (#1139797)

              Slavery is where you can't leave your job because you will wind up homeless, pennyless and without health care for anyone in your family. There is a reason why the RWNJ's try to destroy every safety net ever legislated - they do the bidding of the slavers whose aim is to indenture everybody.

              • (Score: 2) by sjames on Friday May 28 2021, @09:14PM (10 children)

                by sjames (2882) on Friday May 28 2021, @09:14PM (#1139843) Journal

                In support of your statement, low wage employers have been wringing their hands over not enough people applying for their really shitty jobs. It's the Republicans that want an early end to enhanced unemployment benefits to force people to stop looking for a decent job and accept a crappy McJob now.

                • (Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday May 30 2021, @05:38AM (9 children)

                  by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Sunday May 30 2021, @05:38AM (#1140190) Journal

                  an early end to enhanced unemployment benefits to force people to stop looking for a decent job

                  Sounds like those recipients aren't looking for jobs at all, much less the elusive decent job. Not a good argument for UBI or the OP's "statement", let us note.

                  And of course, it's more important to get tribal and thwart them evil Republicans, rather than doing something good.

                  The obvious rebuttal is that a crappy McJob gives you more freedom than than temporary government benefits that can be turned off at any time. You can always get another McJob at the drop of a hat. You can't always get another government.

                  • (Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday May 30 2021, @08:27AM (8 children)

                    by sjames (2882) on Sunday May 30 2021, @08:27AM (#1140212) Journal

                    OTOH, it's a bit hard to go job hunting and interviewing if you're too busy asking "Want fries with that?".

                    There are actually stats showing that employers a level or two above McJobs are having little to no difficulty recruiting. The potential employees are out there and they can be hired without bending them over a barrel, it's just that the McEmployers aren't willing to do what it takes.

                    Many of the very same employers who were crying poverty in 2019 when raising minimum wage was being debated seem to have come up with the money to offer $15/hour now (in spite of a terrible year). They too are managing to find new employees.

                    • (Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday May 30 2021, @11:57AM (7 children)

                      by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Sunday May 30 2021, @11:57AM (#1140230) Journal

                      OTOH, it's a bit hard to go job hunting and interviewing if you're too busy asking "Want fries with that?".

                      Is it too much to expect people to do things that are a "bit hard"?

                      There are actually stats showing that employers a level or two above McJobs are having little to no difficulty recruiting.

                      Why again is that supposed to excuse screwing over McJobs employers and McJobs workers? How is someone supposed to get employers a level or two above McJobs when one's recent work history has a year or two gap?

                      • (Score: 2) by sjames on Sunday May 30 2021, @04:06PM (6 children)

                        by sjames (2882) on Sunday May 30 2021, @04:06PM (#1140269) Journal

                        How are McJobs workers being screwed over by getting a chance to look hard for something better? The McJobs employers have been screwing the workers over for years and now the chickens are home to roost. Note that the ones that started offering better pay started getting applicants.

                        The employers a level or two above have a year long gap themselves, they're not going to look too hard at that right now.

                        • (Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday May 30 2021, @09:58PM (5 children)

                          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Sunday May 30 2021, @09:58PM (#1140335) Journal

                          How are McJobs workers being screwed over by getting a chance to look hard for something better?

                          They already have the chance. Now, they're getting paid to slack off. Some will make those bad choices. And since the earlier poster was equating bad choices with slavery, this is more such bad choices that they can equate with slavery, should they choose to be fair.

                          The McJobs employers have been screwing the workers over for years and now the chickens are home to roost.

                          In rhetoric not reality.

                          The employers a level or two above have a year long gap themselves, they're not going to look too hard at that right now.

                          Because? It's always an issue.

                          • (Score: 2) by sjames on Monday May 31 2021, @01:45AM (4 children)

                            by sjames (2882) on Monday May 31 2021, @01:45AM (#1140396) Journal

                            So you're saying people will be happier if a central authority takes excessive choices away from them for their own good?

                            Arbeit macht frei perhaps?

                            • (Score: 1) by khallow on Monday May 31 2021, @02:06AM (3 children)

                              by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Monday May 31 2021, @02:06AM (#1140402) Journal

                              So you're saying people will be happier if a central authority takes excessive choices away from them for their own good?

                              No. I'm saying we'll all be better off, if government stops paying people to be bums.

                              • (Score: 2) by sjames on Monday May 31 2021, @02:50AM (2 children)

                                by sjames (2882) on Monday May 31 2021, @02:50AM (#1140411) Journal

                                But apparently they're not being bums, they're looking for decently paying work. Employers willing to pay decently are not having any problem hiring.

                                • (Score: 1) by khallow on Monday May 31 2021, @05:05AM (1 child)

                                  by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Monday May 31 2021, @05:05AM (#1140438) Journal

                                  apparently

                                  No evidence for this "apparently". It sure doesn't appear to me that way.

              • (Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:36AM (3 children)

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 29 2021, @02:36AM (#1139921) Journal

                Slavery is where you can't leave your job because you will wind up homeless, pennyless and without health care for anyone in your family.

                Fortunately, the real world is not like slavery because you can get another job and thus not end up homeless, penniless, and without health care for anyone in your family.

                • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @03:27PM (2 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @03:27PM (#1140042)

                  Not necessarily. It's a big gamble. It's an even bigger gamble if you've elected to leverage your poverty-tier savings buying something like... Let's say a massively inflated vehicle so you can get to work. Lest we forget that means paying for full coverage auto insurance, which is incredulously expensive. But you don't have to be impoverished to be a slave to debt it's a question of lifestyle. Your oil rigger swine will hyper-leverage in good times and slave unquestioningly to keep his two 4x4's, RV, RAM 2500, and boat paid for. Even modest people who just want a reasonable house can be made slaves if the proportions are correct.

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:17PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:17PM (#1140077)

                    Slavery is not about pleasant or unpleasant experience but about the direct prevention of liberty.

                    A man who works in a palace, lavished with concubines, and treated generally like royalty is, nonetheless, a slave if he would be directly prevented from ever abandoning said life if he sought to do so. That "you" (a major problem with internet discourse is people speaking for people they know nothing about, but alas) feel coerced to work to maintain your lifestyle does not make you a slave. If you want to give it all up tomorrow and see if you can make it out in the wilds, start pan handling on the streets, or make your way to France and join the Foreign Legion, then you are 100% free to do so. A slave is not and would immediately sought out, and generally reprimanded.

                  • (Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday May 30 2021, @02:36AM

                    by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Sunday May 30 2021, @02:36AM (#1140155) Journal

                    Not necessarily. It's a big gamble.

                    Compared to "homeless, pennyless and without health care"?

                    It's an even bigger gamble if you've elected to leverage your poverty-tier savings buying something like... Let's say a massively inflated vehicle so you can get to work.

                    If you're buying expensive bling like that, then you have a different opinion of the relative odds of the big gamble. Who am I to disagree?

                    But you don't have to be impoverished to be a slave to debt it's a question of lifestyle. Your oil rigger swine will hyper-leverage in good times and slave unquestioningly to keep his two 4x4's, RV, RAM 2500, and boat paid for. Even modest people who just want a reasonable house can be made slaves if the proportions are correct.

                    Making bad choices or having an expensive lifestyle is not slavery. Words have meaning.

            • (Score: 4, Insightful) by DeathMonkey on Friday May 28 2021, @08:27PM (3 children)

              by DeathMonkey (1380) on Friday May 28 2021, @08:27PM (#1139821) Journal

              Those aren't lefties toting around Confederate Flags...

              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:36PM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:36PM (#1139849)

                No, they are the ones burning the American flag.

                • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:47PM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:47PM (#1139853)

                  Which is freedom of speech. Why do you hate freedom bro? Liberals win again, you must be hurtin. How did assaulting democracy work out for you? Seems like blue lives no longer matter to conservatives.

                  What do you people actually stand for now?

              • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:41PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @09:41PM (#1139850)

                and literal Nazi flags . . .

        • (Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:58PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @05:58PM (#1139767)

          > Nothing significant has changed since then.

          Beginning in 1936, the Democrat and Republican parties swapped platforms. This was the beginning of the current racist, far-right, fascist, religious extremist Republican party that we all know today.

          Unfortunately, while the Republican party went full retard extreme "heil hitler" far-right. The Democratic party remained a right-leaning party, so we live in the dysfunctional hellscape* of a nation ruled from the right.

          https://www.livescience.com/34241-democratic-republican-parties-switch-platforms.html [livescience.com]

          *Shit for profit health care system where US does worse than any 1st or second world nation in metrics like infant mortality-- in fact worse than many poor 3rd world nations. We have a partially private for-profit prison system that imprisons more people both as a percentage of population and as absolute numbers than any other nation. Where judges have been convicted for taking bribes to send innocent children to private prisons destroying their lives. Where the military and the police are well funded, regularly commit atrocities, and are unaccountable. Etc.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @07:38PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @07:38PM (#1139811)

          And today the Democrats are fighting tooth and nail to keep statues of slaveholders up to preserve history. 🙄

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:49PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:49PM (#1139730)

        lol dude put down teh meth pipe and take some rest

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:50PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @02:50PM (#1139647)

      What people have been doing, is thinking Dominionists aren't a thing. Their error leads them to think candidates for office are interested in governing a modern society.

      Dominionists have gotten *VERY* organized internationally in the past few decades, work on packing candidate slates with dominionists, and fund all of them. Non-dominionists have an uphill battle. It's not a problem that a lot of money is wasted pitting seven dominionists against each other in a convention, as long as non-dominionists don't get traction. It's safer, in their view, to fund seven dominionists in a primary and have six of them and one non-dominionist lose, than to fund one big campaign and risk coming in second when actual policy debates come up. If reporters bother reporting, there's enough noise on the channel to distract from the reality.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:51PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @04:51PM (#1139732)

        please dude - the meth? stop sucking for a minute

    • (Score: 5, Informative) by Thexalon on Friday May 28 2021, @05:41PM (1 child)

      by Thexalon (636) on Friday May 28 2021, @05:41PM (#1139755)

      I live in Ohio, in a fairly conservative area, so I'm fairly directly affected by all this nonsense. For instance, there are still signs up announcing support for the former president, and in one case there were briefly swastikas shown on it. Back last year, I noticed that local churches were holding events with large groups of people, all unmasked, who probably believe they were perfectly safe because Jesus.

      The nutjobs in my state got the public health director to quit with a combination of online threats to rape and / or murder her or her family, a group of allegedly-disconnected guys walking around in front of her house with guns 24 hours a day 7 days a week, and law enforcement agencies deciding that no crime was occurring in any of this. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the people involved in that were also busy being totally-not-violent-just-beating-up-cops "tourists" in Washington DC on January 6.

      Since then, their allies in the state legislature have stripped the governor from having pandemic-response powers. This kind of attempt to ban public health response to the pandemic is completely in character.

      --
      The inverse of "I told you so" is "Nobody could have predicted"
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:00AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 29 2021, @07:00AM (#1139978)

        > I live in Ohio

        If you don't like it, go live in North Korea if you hate America so much.

    • (Score: 2) by slinches on Friday May 28 2021, @10:10PM (2 children)

      by slinches (5049) on Friday May 28 2021, @10:10PM (#1139858)

      We were prioritizing getting the US population access to the vaccines developed here and produced them quicker and in greater quantities than most other countries. Now that the demand here is mostly satisfied, you should expect to see more US developed vaccines becoming more widely available elsewhere.

      • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @10:42PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 28 2021, @10:42PM (#1139869)

        Yes and no. We used IP laws to prevent other countries from producing their own shots. One of the companies was even planning to open source their vaccine but Bill Gates convinced them not to do it. Great humanitarian that guy...

        So now that we've vaccinated the American population that wants it, we have shots to sell to other countries. Those countries could have been making their own shots this entire time, but we wouldn't get paid if they did that so it wasn't allowed. We could have licensed the IP, but that also didn't happen because if they made their own manufacturing centers then in the future they might make their own other medications as well. CEOs can't risk any control slipping their company's clutches. The upper levels of USA is all mid-term profit based, morality has no baring on any decisions. They've got theirs and you didn't get yours because you're too stupid to take it like they did.

        • (Score: 1) by khallow on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:02AM

          by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Sunday May 30 2021, @06:02AM (#1140197) Journal

          We used IP laws to prevent other countries from producing their own shots.

          If they can produce their own shots, then they can develop their own IP.

(1) 2 3