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fustakrakich (6150)
fustakrakich
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All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy. Messages [soylentnews.org]
(email not shown publicly)
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy. Messages [soylentnews.org]
Journal of fustakrakich (6150)
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Thursday July 15, 21
07:43 PM
Who's spreading more "outrage" about this CRT bullshit?
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Dying is one of the few things that can be done as easily lying down.
-- Woody Allen
(Score: 2, Redundant) by aristarchus on Thursday July 15 2021, @07:49PM (8 children)
As usual, you are missing the point and changing the topic, fusty! The question is, who is trying to pass legislation to censor teachers? Outrage about that is certainly justified.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @07:58PM
He wants us stuck arguing over who is worse, not talking about the specific bad things being done to subvert democracy.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:04PM (1 child)
Whatever you say, it's just another fight over textbooks, sex ed, etc... (I once heard a rumor they can't teach yoga either) You're still doing it wrong, not resolving a thing
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 24 2021, @03:17AM
You raise an interesting point about how others are using the sex ed comparison to deflect criticism.
Unless policy has changed in recent years in the US then obtaining parental consent is required before students are permitted to attend sex ed.
By all accounts I have seen the CRT re-education camps are mandatory even when the parents diametrically oppose it.
I am sure there would be much less opposition if people were given an option to opt-out -- let alone having to opt-in to it *gasp* -- but nope, individual consent is not required when they do it.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:11PM (2 children)
Sane people are trying to remove state sponsored racism from schools. That's who!
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:16PM (1 child)
Found the whit supremerist!!
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:29PM
I don't do Pentecost and you're certainly no wit supremacist.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:41PM (1 child)
Aristarchus is outraged [theguardian.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @08:59PM
May you be touched by His Noodly appendage! Sauce be upon you! Ramen!
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday July 15 2021, @09:18PM (16 children)
Let's step back and tally what we're hearing:
The Left:
We're not teaching critical race theory, it's an obscure academic thing some legal scholars dreamed up about analysis for equity in jurisprudence.
The Right:
They wanna teach our kids white people are all racist and evil and black people are all oppressed and dispossessed!
Obviously, the right wing is crazier - until you turn around and actually look at what's going on in the public discourse. Then we have folks like Kendi and Hannah-Jones and Coates who are spreading a nest of ideas that, taken together, are thoroughly based in the same bedrock principles that the lawyers were talking about; systemic racism, inequitable outcomes, reshaping the practice of government and collective responsibilities and debts. Drawing a bright line between them is possible - but then we'll need a new word for what these people are talking about. Kendism? 1619 theory? It hardly matters. For the sake of this post I'll call it 1619 theory.
Then you look at what the republicans are complaining about in the light of what's going on in public discourse, and you realise that not only has it been cooking for decades, but a number of public events have taken it way beyond dusty corners of law libraries. Ignore the law schools entirely, and you still had folks like Kaepernick taking public positions on topics such as oppression. Even if you think that Kaepernick had a point about racially disparate policing (although the statistics on that are ambiguous once you take the totality of events into account) that doesn't translate into a message declaring that every pale-skinned grade school kid is responsible for something that happened before their grandparents were born - unless you buy into 1619 theory.
And here we come to the heart of the matter: that a lot of people, out in public, are loudly pushing for the idea that the whole system is racist, that white people (by some rather squishy definition) are collectively guilty and responsible for the situation regardless of their personal views and conduct, that the measure of the system is equity of outcome rather than equality of standing, and that the system underlying it all should be changed or demolished.
Now all of a sudden the right's concerns look a little better-founded, because they actually relate to things that are being bruited about whether or not you want to call it CRT, or 1619 Theory or whatever.
To muddy the waters further, critical race theory is a rather clumsy transplant from critical theory as per the lineage of marxist thought, rather to the dismay of the few marxists still out there. This doesn't make it any dearer to the hearts of the right, but it hardly matters what the genesis of the system is. It is a bone of contention as it stands, and complaining about nomenclature is a clumsily transparent attempt to avoid the core issue: that a wide range of americans want nothing to do with it and most definitely don't want their government schools pushing it.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @12:36AM (15 children)
Used to be black people were collectively guilty, especially thos rapey black males but there were also the welfare queens.
Why shouldn't whites pay for their crimes by experiencing the same things?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @12:51AM (12 children)
Which whites? Which crimes? The kid who just turned nine and doesn't know what "separate but equal" or "Jim Crow" was all about? That one? What precise payment does that kid owe, to whom, and what would it fix? Who would receive this payment, and what would the measure of it be? When would it be enough? Who gets to measure that?
Unless you can answer those questions in detail, to general satisfaction, you should expect implacable resistance to your proposal. And I have to admit that that would be quite a case to have to make.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Azuma Hazuki on Friday July 16 2021, @01:05AM (4 children)
If we're bringing kids into this, Emmet Till has a few words for you...
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @08:56PM
It is common sense to not murder anyone, full stop, let alone because of race.
It is also common sense to not jump to a conclusion in favor of either side when there is a rape allegation without any evidence.
(Score: 2) by Mykl on Monday July 19 2021, @02:07AM (2 children)
Cute, but non-sequiter. The question was - How are today's kids responsible for what happened in 1955? The answer is - they're not.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Monday July 19 2021, @04:23PM (1 child)
And no one says they are. There is a difference between "you are responsible for what your great grandparents did" and "the things done by your great grandparents have distorted society and, since they're dead and we're alive, it's up to us to fix this."
That you cannot or will not understand this does not reflect well on you.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2) by Mykl on Monday July 19 2021, @10:35PM
But unfortunately they [christopherrufo.com] are [theaustralian.com.au] (the second one is about gender rather than race, but the same principle).
The problem we have is that CRT adherents are a "broad church" and you are bound to have some edge-cases under that scenario. I agree that most CRT adherents would not force children to apologise for the behaviour of previous generations, but some are. We need to be mindful of that before that aspect takes root and becomes more common.
That you cannot or will not understand this does not reflect well on you.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @02:04AM (2 children)
It doesn't matter. White people who have power have decided that whites are now collectively guilty.
What are you going to do about it?
(Score: -1, Redundant) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @03:27AM (1 child)
White boy!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @04:32AM
Yes that's correct. Now pay your reparations! If I let you off the hook, it wouldn't be fair to the other whites.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @03:18AM (3 children)
Outrageous, this amounts to child abuse.
It is a crime for anyone to not have been taught the virtues of racially exclusive "safe spaces" by the age of nine years.
Oh, and by the way, we have reserved a special "safe space" just for you. At the back of the bus.
(Score: 1, Redundant) by aristarchus on Friday July 16 2021, @03:29AM (2 children)
At least they didn't lynch the poor little white boy.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @06:15AM
No, they shot the 5-year old white boy as he was riding his bicycle instead. [thesun.co.uk]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @06:18AM
https://thenewamerican.com/black-man-executes-5-year-old-white-boy-in-front-of-his-sisters-national-media-ignore-story/ [thenewamerican.com]
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @03:11AM (1 child)
>> Why shouldn't whites pay for their crimes by experiencing the same things?
Agreed. Every single white person is guilty, including the ones not even born yet.
There can be no equality until the rural Appalachian whites have finished paying reparations to Oprah.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday July 16 2021, @04:19AM
They need to get their reparations from that "Hillbilly Elegy" guy. Really made all hillbillies look bad, even the Ozark ones.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday July 17 2021, @04:13AM
Not even sure what the point is of arguing anything on this site anymore. Its all one big echo chamber. Good on you for sticking to it I just don't understand why.