AT&T is trying to force customers into arbitration in order to avoid a class-action complaint over the telecom's former practice of selling users' real-time location data.
[...] The class-action complaint [(pdf)] was filed in July against AT&T and two location data aggregators called LocationSmart and Zumigo. "AT&T used LocationSmart and Zumigo to manage the buying and selling of its customers' real-time location data," the lawsuit said. The lawsuit seeks monetary damages for customers, an injunction preventing AT&T from selling location data, and certification of a class including all AT&T wireless subscribers between 2011 and the present "whose carrier-level location data AT&T permitted or caused to be used or accessed by any third party without proper authorization."
The lawsuit says:
Despite vowing to its customers that it does not "sell [their] Personal Information to anyone for any purpose," AT&T has been selling its customers' real-time location data to credit agencies, bail bondsmen, and countless other third parties without the required customer consent and without any legal authority. AT&T's practice is an egregious and dangerous breach of Plaintiffs' and all AT&T customers' privacy, as well as a violation of state and federal law.
AT&T previously denied that selling phone location data was illegal, even though Section 222 of the Communications Act says phone companies may not use or disclose customer location information "without the express prior authorization of the customer." The lawsuit alleges that AT&T violated the Communications Act, the California Unfair Competition Law, the California Constitution's right to privacy, and the California Consumers Legal Remedies Act.
A series of reports by Motherboard beginning in January 2019 showed that T-Mobile, Sprint, and AT&T continued selling customers' real-time location data after all the major cellular carriers promised to stop doing so. The data "end[ed] up in the hands of bounty hunters and others not authorized to possess it, letting them track most phones in the country," Motherboard reported at the time. The news site also wrote about AT&T's motion to compel arbitration yesterday.
Personally, I think sale of said data is a serious invasion of privacy and hope AT&T gets hurt where it counts ($$,$$$,$$$,$$$).
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday September 24 2019, @12:35AM (5 children)
After 9/11/01 all the telcos were recruited by the US intel community to spy on everyone, everywhere. All that immunity tossed around to them simply corrupted them to the core. Telco's today believe that they are ENTITLED to harvest and sell every bit of data they can get.
They all need to be hammered pretty severely. Telco's need to return to the status they had when AT&T and Ma Bell were a duopoly, and they clearly understood that interfering with customer's activities was VERBOTEN!! Eavesdropping or any kind should be punished severely. And "severely" doesn't mean a fifty dollar fine, or some such nonsense. A single act of unauthorized tracking should cost the telco about as much as a senior manager makes in a year. An established history of tracking an individual should cost them more than their top CEO's make in a year - including all those plush bonuses. It should hurt so bad to collect and sell data that no telco would even dream of doing so.
And, if they can't learn that simple lesson, then they need to be bankrupted and put out of business.
(Score: 2) by jmichaelhudsondotnet on Tuesday September 24 2019, @09:04AM
Hmm, so cogent in comparison to many of your other posts.
I don't think we should see the 'duopoly' age as any sort of good ole days. Even then if the companies were spying the government would not be able to prove it and regulate it, I'm not even sure how this could be done from a technical standpoint. If I own the wires in the city and the huge processing complexes, I am quite certain I could find a way to copy traffic en bulk without anyone knowing unless idk some harry potter security government apparatus, and then all it would still take is one spy to walk off with a hard disk and disappear with a fortune.
I worked for a company that handled tier 1 support calls for small ISP's and I had to take 2 weeks of training classes with the senior staff who were actually pretty knowledgeable. One of the staff, who was kindof a soft spoken round guy with glasses, a family guy, not in any way some wingnut with an agenda, dropped this nugget one day in class and my jaw is still dropped:
"I had to train for several months after I was hired as a Verizon engineer, and I can promise you that every call in this country has been recorded since January 1, 1964.'
If it had been any other date, I might have called bullshit. But that is how they got away with killing John F. Kennedy, and any semblence of rights has been a joke played on a completely gaslit population since long before I was born. And now all that traffic and nsa data is shared with israel, who is clearly using it to establish domination, and sees the united states not as an ally but as a chump puppet. I know this is fourth hand, but if I had to I can confirm aspects of my story, I sure can.
That is also how they knew they could get away with the kennedy assassination, if any actual movement of people or information was about to come out that would hurt them, they would pick it up on the wires and that person wouldn't get very far. It makes so much more sense than thinking that they waited until 9/11, the day on which all of the evidence against the same peoples' other crimes was also destroyed.
So waiting for any of these companies and institutions to save us is not going to work, like usual. The companies are there to enforce power, not help us have any.
If we want any freedom, it is going to have to rely on our personal computers and personal encryption software, which is something we can actually work on rather than rallying for some or another board of directors to rescue us.
thesesystemsarefailing.net
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @02:11PM (2 children)
I don't know - a fifty dollar fine seems perfectly reasonable... as long as it's $50 per customer, per call. To be really nasty, I suppose you could apply incremental penalties for each subsequent infringement after the first one. Exactly how many phone calls have they handled since they started? The incremental penalties might be overkill.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday September 24 2019, @02:50PM (1 child)
Doing the research, in order to do the math, would be a killer.
Want to go one step nastier? Force AT&T to research how much money they made off of each customer's data, and REFUND to the customer all of that money. That would be sweeter than a class-action lawsuit, in which you might see $6.80 after the lawyers get their cuts. If AT&T profited by $1.50 off of your data, personally, they cut a check for $1.50 and mail it to you. If they made $17,000 off of your data, they cut a check for $17,000 and mail it to you. The research will be expensive if done right, cutting checks adds insult to injury, postal fees adds a bit more insult, and they are out all of their incentive for snooping on you.
All of that IN ADDITION TO fines, penalties, and various suits.
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Wednesday September 25 2019, @06:24PM
Now, that seems much more like justice to me. Though, it would probably constitute cruel and unusual punishment.
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @02:48PM
"After 9/11/01 all the telcos were recruited by the US intel community to spy on everyone"
Actually if you read about the history of the NSA, the telco's were co-opted almost immediately after the very first trans-atlantic cable was laid. There has been a cozy relationship ever since. Worth noting that during wartime they usually play both sides against the middle since they are international companies co-opted by both of the warring states.
Certainly the arbitration clause should be thrown out. AT&T will just pass the expense on to its customers and probably just keep doing what it is doing. (just maybe hide it better) They have always sold your data to the intelligence agencies. Always have, always will. While this is a crime, they are usually better at concealing it. And that is how they will view it: "Damn, we better improve our security!, We got caught!"
(Score: -1, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @12:51AM (9 children)
If you haven't done anything wrong who cares who knows where you are. As Benjamin Franklin said, most eloquently, "An investment in knowledge pays the best interest", and telcos have invested a lot on knowing where we are so let them profit.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @01:07AM (3 children)
As your car insurance company, we see you've been out late on Fri and Sat evenings, and have spent time in parts of town with bars and restaurants. We're going to raise your rates because statistically we presume you are drinking and driving.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @01:19AM (1 child)
OP said "If you haven't done anything wrong...". In your example, a person is imbibing alcohol which the Quran tells us is haram. Higher insurance rates are justice for the sin of disobeying Allah.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday September 24 2019, @02:54PM
Actually, the dude under surveillance doesn't drink. He works as a bouncer at a bar, but he doesn't drink a drop of alcohol. But, he's going to be penalized for drinking anyway.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @08:51AM
Then I'll go to a different insurance company...
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @01:17AM (2 children)
I was going to just mod you down, but I'll assume you aren't a telecom shill for the moment.
Here's an example [nwsource.com] where your naivete shows through quite clearly:
The article above is from 1994(!). Imagine what abusers can do 25 years later, when they can track their victims in real time.
Please explain to me how a victim of domestic abuse who flees from their abuser has "done something wrong."
And how is paying a few hundred bucks to a PI or a telecom to get that info any different from this kind of thing?
https://stories.avvo.com/crime/domestic-abusers-use-technology-track-partners-protect.html [avvo.com]
https://www.wired.com/story/common-apps-domestic-abusers-stalk-victims/ [wired.com]
https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2014/09/15/346149979/smartphones-are-used-to-stalk-control-domestic-abuse-victims [npr.org]
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jan/25/spyware-smartphone-abusive-men-track-partners-domestic-violence [theguardian.com]
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/19/technology/phone-apps-stalking.html [nytimes.com]
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/11/05/victims-of-domestic-violence-challenged-by-abusers-using-technology.html [cnbc.com]
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/spyware-the-online-tool-of-stalking-domestic-abuse/ [cbsnews.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @12:37PM (1 child)
Thank you for this story, I think it puts the importance of privacy into the proper context.
That being said, I am about 98% sure the GP was writing with maximum sarcasm.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @09:40PM
AC you replied to here. You're welcome. There are other compelling arguments for privacy, but victims of abuse are particularly poignant.
That's as may be. Poe's Law [wikipedia.org] is a bitch. At the same time, I usually apply Hanlon's Razor [wikipedia.org] before considering Poe's Law.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @01:23AM
Of course, good to hear you say so. I believe in investing in knowledge myself. I'm a burglar, and I really do want to know where you are, to avoid a chance meeting at your home.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @04:59PM
"If you haven't done anything wrong who cares who knows where you are."
Not sure about you, but I'm pretty sure the Jews would have disagreed circa 1939.
(Score: 1) by fustakrakich on Tuesday September 24 2019, @12:52AM
I know corporations are people, but do they have buttholes? Yeah yeah, plenty of them in the boardroom, but work with me, ok?
You know, because money... pffft! Please...
La politica e i criminali sono la stessa cosa..
(Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday September 24 2019, @01:32AM
Back in the days of paper service agreements, I had a dispute with AT&T where I challenged them: "show me the agreement I signed that said you can triple my rates from one month to the next with no notice other than the bill." They didn't, probably couldn't - this was back around 1995-ish. A few years later, I still hadn't paid the $35 bill that should have been $10, but they did send me a new agreement more or less stating "AT&T may change your rates from time to time with no other notice than our current rates webpage, to agree to these new terms simply pay your current bill." Well, that's easy, I haven't paid for years, I don't need or want any of your services, and I strenuously object to this customer - overbearing pompous greedy inept annoying service provider relationship, so consider it terminated by me continuing to not pay my bill.
Of course, being AT&T, I ran into them again - they were the only decent cell service provider in the particular nick of the woods where we needed service, so when signing up for a new wireless account around 1999 the shop told me: "we're going to require a deposit of $700 to activate your account" to which I said: "let me talk to the person on the other end of that line... what's this all about? Outstanding unpaid AT&T bill. Oh, yes, I know all about that one, $35 right? Yes, sir. Well, for a $35 unpaid bill you are willing to forgo a new wireless customer, because hell will freeze over before I give you a $700 service deposit. Um, you know what, sir, please do sign up for our wireless service, no deposit required. Thank you." and "I thought so."
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 4, Informative) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday September 24 2019, @03:07AM
That's the clue about what is going on right there.
Privatising the legal system will be every big business' total wet dream. Imagine a world in which the courts are owned by a corporation, and the judges and lawyers owe their livelihoods to the owners of the courts.
This "arbitration" is just the thin end of the wedge. Once people are used to being forced into this, it will become common, then normal.
AT&T may well lose this, but it won't stop them having another go. Every other big company in the US will be watching on with interest.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by hwertz on Tuesday September 24 2019, @05:41AM (2 children)
Throw the book at them! A company violated multiple federal laws, knowingly, and things they can force those calling them out for it into binding arbitration? Fuck that.
"After 9/11/01 all the telcos were recruited by the US intel community to spy on everyone, everywhere"
Actually, funny story about that (well not really funny). Qwest (who is now part of CenturyLink), when the feds came to them to ask to implement their illegal and unconstitutional spying program, the CEO of Qwest (Joseph Nacchio) REFUSED, pointing out his legal council advised him it could not possibly be legal, so they were not going to do it. So, what was the response? The feds cancelled some large contract they had with Qwest (greasy but whatever) then trumped up insider trading charges against the CEO, claiming the CEO somehow knew MONTHS ahead of time this contract would be cancelled, and sold stock then to make an extra $10,000. Yeah, a CEO making millions a year is going to insider trade to make 10 grand. Right. In court, he tried to bring up the whole illegal spying program, and with a straight face the feds claimed the info (INCLUDING New York Times articles and such) were classified. Yup, published newspaper articles are classified and so inadmissable in court. He got out of prison some time last year.
(Score: 2) by hwertz on Tuesday September 24 2019, @05:56AM
Two additions to this...
First, to clarify, Qwest wasn't asked to implement this illegal program nationwide, this was the same "request" AT&T, Verizon, etc. got to install data-slurping equipment at their switching points that the CEO refused until he was removed and replaced.
Second, based on info at the time, several telecoms other than Qwest went along with this illegal spying program, but reluctantly. AT&T, on the other hand, not only went along with it but told the feds about this great new (at the time) language "R" (used for statistical analysis) and provided assistance on how to use it to analyze the info the feds were illegally and unconstitutionally obtaining. AT&T is truly a despicable company.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 24 2019, @12:45PM
God I miss Qwest.
They were one of the few telecoms that actually treated their customers as people rather than revenue streams.
Example: I know everyone hates calling customer service and getting a recording. Except Qwest got it right. My internet was down, so I called them on the cell phone, the immediate response was a recording, "This phone is associated with an account that is currently experiencing an internet outage, we expect to have things back up in about an hour. If this is not the reason for your call, please stay on the line." In less than 30s, I had exactly what I wanted, acknowledgement that they had an issue, and a estimate for when it will be fixed. Now with Century Link, I call, have to enter my account number, walk down a phone tree and get a person that will eventually tell me that it should be fixed in 3 hours. Then I call 5 hours later and get told 6 hours. Then 12... argggg...
(Score: 2) by jmichaelhudsondotnet on Tuesday September 24 2019, @09:09AM
I worked for a company that handled tier 1 support calls for small ISP's and I had to take 2 weeks of training classes with the senior staff who were pretty knowledgeable. One of the staff, who was kindof a soft spoken round guy with glasses, a family guy, not in any way some wingnut with an agenda, dropped this nugget one day in class and my jaw is still dropped:
"I had to train for several months after I was hired as a Verizon engineer, and I can promise you that every call in this country has been recorded since January 1, 1964.'
If it had been any other date, I might have called bullshit. But that is how they got away with killing John F. Kennedy, and any semblence of rights has been a joke played on a completely gaslit population since long before I was born. And now all that traffic and nsa data is shared with israel, who is clearly using it to establish domination, and sees the united states not as an ally but as a chump puppet. I know this is fourth hand, but if I had to I can confirm aspects of my story, I sure can.
That is also how they knew they could get away with the kennedy assassination, if any actual movement of people or information was about to come out that would hurt them, they would pick it up on the wires and that person wouldn't get very far. It makes so much more sense than thinking that they waited until 9/11, the day on which all of the evidence against the same peoples' other crimes was also destroyed.
So waiting for any of these companies and institutions to save us is not going to work, like usual. The companies are there to enforce power, not help us have any. Lawsuits may help, I'll support that effort.
If we want any freedom, it is going to have to rely on our personal computers and personal encryption software, which is something we can actually work on rather than rallying for some or another board of directors to rescue us.
thesesystemsarefailing.net
(sorry for 2x, but decided this ended up being a top level comment)
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DutchUncle on Tuesday September 24 2019, @07:34PM
Maybe they should be called "service agreements" rather than "contracts", not that you really have a choice about agreeing to a deal in which the other side states that the deal can change whenever they want it to. Arbitration sounds reasonable and efficient, avoiding the cost and complexity of the legal system, until everyone realizes that it also avoids the RECOURSE and ACCOUNTABILITY of the legal system. Unfortunately the big services have also bought enough government support that one can't do much about it individually, and it's only natural that they work with government because they legitimately need access to put up the poles and wires and towers ... until they also put up a tower on what you thought was private property for minimal rental, or worse on public property for minimal rental which suddenly gets fenced off and becomes their property, even if it is (was?) in the middle of a town park.