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The disproportionately high number of motorcycle-related traffic accidents may be linked to the way the human brain processes—or fails to process—information, according to new research published in Human Factors, "Allocating Attention to Detect Motorcycles: The Role of Inattentional Blindness." The study examines how the phenomenon of inattentional blindness, or a person's failure to notice an unexpected object located in plain sight, might explain the prevalence of looked-but-failed-to-see (LBFTS) crashes, the most common type of collision involving motorcycles.
According to human factors/ergonomics researchers Kristen Pammer, Stephanie Sabadas, and Stephanie Lentern, LBFTS crashes are particularly troublesome because, despite clear conditions and the lack of other hazards or distractions, drivers will look in the direction of the oncoming motorcycle - and in some cases appear to look directly at the motorcycle - but still pull out into its path.
The study authors suggest training drivers to be more alert for motorcycles.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by ataradov on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:56AM (30 children)
It totally has nothing to do with the fact that they drive like like crazy, speeding and lane splitting.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Snotnose on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:01AM (12 children)
I dumped coffee grounds on a lane splitting guy. Mid 80's, traffic was backed up for some reason, the coffee that usually lasted me halfway into my day got drained on I-8 westbound between College and Waring. Took the top off, tossed the grains out the window, and nailed some dude lane splitting at speed (I was at a dead stop). I'd checked my mirrors first, never saw the guy. Somehow I felt guilty, but never felt bad over that.
When the dust settled America realized it was saved by a porn star.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:08AM
That little toy that masqueraded as a kind little man finally made it through the smallest doorway in your ass maze! He forcibly pulled the sack he was carrying through it, sending him flying into the deepest reaches of the mazes of your ass! Major tickle on ass! Major tickle!
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:17AM (1 child)
Alim tsk tsk, alim tsk tsk! Alim tsk tsk, alim tsk tsk! Alim tsk tsk, alim tsk tsk!
Oh, my! That invisible toy is going to slurp off every single spec of graveyard fog off of your cheeks, and there's nothing you can do about it since not a single cheek of you ares is capable of movement! You will rue the day you danced with your bootyass in that foggy graveyard! Wow! It just reached your snappyhole...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:47PM
I want more weather war. :(
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:34AM (7 children)
My boss at Chevron had acquired one of the big old F350 refinery trucks. No sooner than he had it on the freeway, some motorcyclist took his mirror off. Lane splitting.
Pissed, my boss took the truck over to the welding shop and one of the guys put the mirror back on so good you could pick the truck up by the mirror if you wanted to. I mean he built that thing to last.
About a week later, boss came in, this time, smiling.
Same thing happened. Different outcome. FwanG! The truck shook a bit, but the mirror didn't move. Bounced the motorcyclist into the ditch off the side of the freeway, safely away from the other traffic.
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:46AM
I've unilaterally decided to chew your rectum like bubble gum as I please like corn on peas. What's this...? Pinworm goodies!? Ah, too good!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:28PM (5 children)
I call bs -- F350 mirrors are well above motorcycle handlebar height.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:00PM
Ape hanger height? Browse the images - https://duckduckgo.com/?t=palemoon&q=chopper+ape+hanger&iax=images&ia=images [duckduckgo.com] Most of them range from weird, to strange, to kinda cool. Look at that preposterous bastard on the yellow machine. http://www.dpccars.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Extreme-Motorcycle-Ape-Hangers-5.jpg [dpccars.com]
when that boy was born, the doctor slapped his mama.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by toddestan on Saturday January 06 2018, @11:32PM
Depends on how old the truck is. Used to be that the the F350 was basically a beefed up F150, and back then the F150 was not as gigantic as it is now. Given that the replacement mirror was welded, it probably was an older truck, because you couldn't weld it on a newer one because there would be nothing to weld it to (too much plastic).
(Score: 3, Informative) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:35AM (2 children)
I drive an F350 (dually, not 4x4) with standard tow mirrors, and in the interests of science I just measured it:
47 inches from ground to bottom of mirror.
Just right for smacking lane-splitters in the helmet.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @09:42AM (1 child)
The original mirror was kinda flimsy anyway... and he always griped that he could not see past his trailer with it.
Once it was broken, he replaced it with a towing mirror of his own design, which stood out quite a bit further. So he could see around his trailer. And he did not mind a little cosmetic re-do to the door. The refinery always has lots of scrap metal around. He used some.
I just went back to look up the Wikipedia to see if I could identify his old truck ... second generation F350 [wikipedia.org]... that hood and grill design is unmistakeable.
Big old black truck. And it had seen its share of refinery stuff when he got it .. mostly dings. But it was big and sturdy.
Its what he bought the truck for... towing a recreational trailer. And when he wasn't using it for that, he drove it to work.
But come vacation time, he would pack his family up and go. Wherever. To the middle of nowhere. And camp or whatever.
He did not care at all if he got the truck dirty... or a kid made a mess. Just hose it out.
This was in the early 60's. His wife drove the family car. Upper class in those days... a two vehicle family!
Big old heavy truck that would tow damned near anything.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Monday January 08 2018, @12:33AM
Those old-fashioned bald interiors had their virtues -- as you say, literally just hose it out!
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @04:38AM
So, you were in the process of littering and you hit a biker. You're very lucky that the guy didn't come back and beat the shit out of you.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by khallow on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:17AM (3 children)
Yes. Bad driving can make the problem worse, but it's long been a real thing. It was part of my drivers ed course, for example, on how to deal with (or even to look for) motorbikes on the road.
(Score: 2) by frojack on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:39AM (2 children)
My driver's education Course covered that too. That was back in the late 60s. So whatever they wewe teaching all these years clearly wasn't working.
If they've been teaching something the same way for 50 year's and we still have the problem, maybe it's time to teach a different method.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by khallow on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:05AM
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:32AM
I still fondly remember my driver's ed teacher in High School referring to them as "Donorcycles".
Well, during that day, a lot of riders did not wear helmets, so traffic interactions commonly ended up with an intact body but smashed brain...
Great source for spare kidneys!
(Score: 4, Touché) by qzm on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:56AM (1 child)
So, I assume then that that is the reason for the huge increase in cyclist deaths? Its their own fault, right? no?
The main reason motorcyclists get killed often is there are not enough of them, so, as the research says, people dont see them, and kill them.
Yes, there are some nutters - same for cars - but they are a small minority.
For some reason be are getting bicycle lanes all over the place, they get special bays at lights, their own paths - the excuse is often that this is to help reduce traffic.
All without paying a dollar of road charges, insurances, medical insurances (in countries where that is included, which is many).
Whereas motorcyclists, who reduce traffic far more (as it is a much more practical transportation than cycling), get absolutely nothing, even though they pay.
Around here they just banned motorcyclists from bus lanes - why? no one seems to know, cyclists are allowed - oh yes, cannot touch them!
It would be TRIVIAL to add a motorcycle lane on most motorways, the unused meter or so on the inside or outside would do fine - and save them lane splitting (which is also usually legal, in many areas), but no.
Why? because almost none of this is actually about roading - not efficiency, not safety, not CO2, nothing.
Its about trying to be SEEN to be more PC than the next council/roading board/etc.
Its about 'looking good' at elections.
The last thing it is about is good transport.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by theluggage on Saturday January 06 2018, @04:34PM
Maybe, just maybe, because pushbikes travel at ~10mph, whereas even a farty little 70cc motor scooter is capable of keeping up with urban traffic and following the same rules of the road?
Or that pushbikes are not only zero-emission, but help keep their riders fit, are far cheaper to buy and run than any motor vehicle?
Now, that is where motorbikes and pushbikes are alike: drivers are expected to pass them with the same clearance as they would another car, but its somehow the God-given right of riders to dart though the tiniest gap between vehicles and complain when the driver's x-ray 360 degree vision doesn't spot them...
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:56PM (4 children)
Sigh, not this ignorance. Motorcyclists lane split for two reason, one because some motorcycles lack liquid cooling which can mean they break down completely if stuck in traffic during the summer. It's also safer to get sideswiped than run over.
American driver's education programs fail miserably in many ways. Failing to educate drivers about how motorcyclists ride is just one aspect of it.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:49PM (1 child)
Then maybe these pwecious bikes should have liquid cooling.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:48PM
That only solves part of the problem. We also don't have air conditioning or even a fan while wearing what amounts to winter gear in the heat.
There's nothing particularly dangerous about lane splitting when motorists don't drive like dicks.
(Score: 1) by toddestan on Saturday January 06 2018, @11:41PM (1 child)
Two reasons? I always thought they did it primarily to get to where they are going faster.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @05:06AM
Nope. I can't speak of other states, but around here you occasionally see bikers sharing a lane with each other, but never riding between lanes. Occasionally, I'll sneak by on the left if I'm trying to make a right hand turn and have just a partial car length of car blocking my turn, but that's about it.
Getting places quicker is just a byproduct of it, not a cause.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Grishnakh on Saturday January 06 2018, @04:22PM (5 children)
FYI, lane splitting is perfectly legal in some states (I think California). I can't speak to the safety aspect, which I think is debatable, but it's not illegal everywhere.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:37AM (4 children)
Yes, legal in CA, last I paid attention. Basically a case of legalizing what they do anyway.
I've seen a few car-vs-motorcycle, and it's invariably been a lane-splitter in the car's blind spot as they change lanes at slow speed.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Grishnakh on Sunday January 07 2018, @07:34PM (3 children)
I'm not a motorcyclist, but it does seem to me that lane-splitting isn't so bad or dangerous if it's done in heavy, stopped traffic, for instance at a stop light where there's 2+ lanes and all the cars are at a stand-still while the light is red. The motorcycle can slowly drive up between the cars to the front, then easily out-accelerate everyone when the light turns green, which lessens the traffic load and gets more vehicles through the light while it's green. But yeah, doing it in moving traffic seems like a bad idea.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @08:08PM (2 children)
Yeah, dead-stop traffic isn't really a huge issue -- most of the time. But then you get the bike who lane-splits, gets up to the front, then neglects to notice he's between dual turn lanes where one is optional-turn, and goes straight when the guy next to him legitimately turns... smack into the bike. Or the bike who stops having sneaked up on the far right intending to go straight, then is astonished when the car (or worse, big truck) doing a legit right turn clips his front wheel.
Where I've seen it be a problem on L.A. freeways is the transition areas between HOV and normal lanes, or where a left lane merges right, and the bike thinks because he can fit in the space between, he's golden. Basically, anywhere there's a lot of turning or lane changing makes it a bad idea.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Sunday January 07 2018, @10:56PM (1 child)
Seems to me that it should be restricted to places where there's two lanes both going straight, and that the biker can only go between the straight-only lanes. That should avoid these corner cases, while still deriving most of the benefit that lane-splitting gives to the overall traffic situation.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Monday January 08 2018, @12:29AM
Yeah, basically "don't do it where doing it is Darwinistic".
Tho as a me-too to above remarks, more than once I've had some biker come along between and have to duck my tow mirrors at the last instant... in parts of L.A. with the old narrow freeway lanes, there isn't actually enough room, but some still try it. Never had one helmet himself on my truck, but it was sometimes a near thing.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Snotnose on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:57AM (3 children)
Mid 70s, gas crisis, decided to save on gas as I was a teenager making minimum wage.
I realized it wasn't that the other driver couldn't see me so much as they saw me, hated my long hair and everything it stood for, and subconsciously did their best to kill me.
For you Sandy Eggins, it was El Cajon, Broadway turning left into what was Gemco and is now Target intending to take the 67 north. I had the green arrow, some old dude barreled through the light, I laid it down, got some nasty scrapes, and never rode the bike again (that was the 3rd or 4th time I "wasn't seen" in 2 years, and by far the scariest.
When the dust settled America realized it was saved by a porn star.
(Score: 2, Informative) by anubi on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:46AM (2 children)
Hey, Snotnose... I like my hair long too! I know the feeling... a lot of people sure resent the signal I am trying to send.
To me, it represents freedom and being out of the goddamm corporate noose.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Webweasel on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:19PM (1 child)
Strange. I got promoted recently to a very senior position.
My bosses advice was to keep my hair long, but start wearing a suit. The idea being I would be welcomed by the seniors as I dress like them, but would be listened to over technical matters due to my long hair.
Priyom.org Number stations, Russian Military radio. "You are a bad, bad man. Do you have any other virtues?"-Runaway1956
(Score: 3, Touché) by Justin Case on Sunday January 07 2018, @04:05PM
I took the opposite approach. I cut my hair to appease the conformists, and started coming to work naked.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by anubi on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:21AM (10 children)
I have seen numerous optical illusions of the form of sheets full of O and one C. Find the C.
Or it shows a pen-and-ink drawing full of elephants... and one koala... Find the Koala.
It does not jump out at me. I really have to look for it.
When I am driving, I tend to see cars and trucks - in the location I expect to see cars and trucks. I see pedestrians too if they are in their expected position at the crosswalk. However, motorcyclists can sneak up me because they can "hide" amongst the cars.
And they are agile enough to not be seen, then suddenly they are right in my path.
Although the car registers in me, the motorcyclist often goes unseen. Nothing else can be there because the car is there, eh?
In retrospect, a few milliseconds ago they were right behind the car. Now they are splitting a lane.
A bicyclist or skateboarder can also seem to suddenly appear out of nowhere.
Its gotten to where I really hate to drive in rush hour traffic, as motorcyclists in particular, with their unique capability to go between cars, place themselves in positions that if I do not take immediate actions to avoid them, a collision will be inevitable.
Most of the time, I feel its due to lane splitting. I expect everything to stay in its lane - and motorcycles in particular do not have the restriction, neither physical or legal, to stay in lane.
Or, at least not here in California, which recently clarified traffic law clearing motorcycles splitting lanes. In my mind, by doing so, they are about as vulnerable as a tomato in the road.
None of what I typed is intentional... its just foibles in my own logic I have noted - and I post it so you can compare it to yours.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 4, Interesting) by frojack on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:54AM (5 children)
I see a lot of pulsing headlights on motorcycles around here. Don't know if they are legal, but they sure are Eye catching.
Two lights, stacked vertically, blinking alternately might be better.
The idea is to induce some cognitive dissonance in the mind of the driver.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by anubi on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:20AM (1 child)
Sounds like a good idea!
Just don't have em so bright they blind. Some of these new headlamps are so bright they leave other drivers temporarily blinded.
I carry a flashlight around with me when I walk at night, but will not aim it at a driver... that thing will blind someone. If I flat have to, I will rapidly flick it past them to get their attention... just to let them know I am there. You know.. someone idling at an intersection, and I am preparing to walk out in front of them. Or in their driveway idling - but not going anywhere. I know they are probably distracted with something else and may not even be aware I am there until they finish, quickly scan for cars, finding none, think everything is clear, then back right into ME!
( Yes, I have had a few close calls. Better get the driver's attention before walking out behind him! And the same has happened to me when I am driving... where did that guy come from?!?!? )
A lot of bicyclists around here set their headlamps to strobe. It draws attention. Speaking as a driver, I appreciate them making themselves more visible. I do not mind sharing the road. But if I do not know you are there, its really bad news for both of us.
I note around here parents are buying shoes for their kids with LED's in the soles. Some even have LED collars and bracelets on their kids. Even their dog has LED collars.
As a vehicle driver, I am thankful of the parents / kids / dogs being more identifiable as something I need to be aware of. The last thing in the world I want is to get involved in accidents.
No matter how hard I try, there is always something I'll miss. If I was that good, I would also avoid curbs and potholes. But from time to time I will nail one. Please oh please - not you or your loved ones. Its bad enough I hit potholes.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @08:13PM
One of the problems with those little LEDs is that they're small. They may catch my eye, but in the dark, they're deceptive. Don't assume that the driver will judge correctly when he's expecting that tiny light to be a headlight far away.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Nerdfest on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:09PM (1 child)
One of the other good things I've seen suggested is to play "spot the motorcycle" as a game with your kids, if you have any. It will help train them to spot them when they're drivers (although really, it's probably too late for that, drivers will have been replaced)..
I think a bit part of why accident rates might be going up is the crappy sight-lines in modern cars. My current car has far poorer sight-lines than my previous (20 year old now). The A pillars block a very large and very important area of view, especially for those of us that look *way* ahead. Personally, I'd feel a lot safer with all the airbags gone, and a clear view of the road back.
(Score: 1) by toddestan on Saturday January 06 2018, @11:55PM
To compensate for the crappy sight lines, a lot of cars now have blind spot monitoring. Except the blind spot monitoring often doesn't see something smaller like a motorcycle. This makes the problem is even worse - due to the poor visibility, people just rely on the blind spot monitor, and if it says the blind spot is clear they just go and can flatten a motorcyclist in the process.
You can actually see first-hand how effective some of these systems are in various cars, as they often put the indicator for the blind spot monitor in the side mirror and at night it's often visible to you too if you're in the car's blind spot.
(Score: 2) by dry on Sunday January 07 2018, @05:13AM
Those pulsing lights fuck my head up, something about the speed of the flashes. Same with the odd bicycle that has a blinking head light. Anything that makes you look away does not seem safe.
What really gets my attention with bicycles is the pedal reflectors, orange light going up and down and I know it is a bike and not a random reflector on the side of the road. Something like that would be much better on a motorbike and even bicycles could have them lit up so they're noticeable when the bike is on a side road or such where reflectors don't work.
(Score: 2) by RS3 on Saturday January 06 2018, @01:35PM (1 child)
Yes! The human brain, at its most fundamental, is a pattern-matching machine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pattern_recognition_(psychology) [wikipedia.org]
We get too used to looking for a car-sized thing. Life is so complex in general, people are generally distracted, thinking about this or that; I perceive at least 1/2 of drivers are doing something on a smartphone while somewhat partially driving. If they look at all, it's a quick glance. Pattern-matcher doesn't see a car, so it's okay to hit gas, and pull out in front of a motorcycle.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:59PM
What's really freaky is when you get it wrong and then the brain realizes that you've gotten it wrong and replaces the image you saw with the correct one.
Around here we have some trees that have weird lumps near the bottom of them. They have the same basic shape as a person with a backpack crouching, so I'll see that, then moments later the image will be replaced with a tree that I was supposed to see.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:04PM (1 child)
I thought it meant 2 vehicles, side-by-side in a single lane, travelling together. This is OKish if they agree and cooperate. California allows this; most other places do not.
You seem to be referring to when some fool drives right along a lane division, squeezing between vehicles that might be stopped. AFAIK, that isn't lane splitting. It's just plain illegal AFAIK, even in California.
(Score: 1) by anubi on Sunday January 07 2018, @03:18AM
Thanks... that is *exactly* what I am referring to.
Two motorcyclists riding side by side makes common sense to me. Between both of 'em, they greatly enhance their probability of recognition. Now their combined pattern area is that of a car.
Over here in California, my main gripe is those who go 60 mph through traffic going 50 mph. I am driving a big Ford E350, and my mirrors are already clearing other truck's mirrors by about maybe two feet. There is NOT enough room for a motorcyclist between us. But some try to squeeze in anyway.
And its up to me to decide to either cream the motorcyclist or involve another driver legally in his lane.
That is one decision I hate being forced, by the motorcyclist, to make.
"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]
(Score: 4, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:47AM (2 children)
Dude (or chick) sitting in a nice air conditioned vehicle, big, solid, comfortable, driving along. He is looking for potential threats. That is, he is watching for anything that may possible hurt him, or his vehicle. Non-threats aren't noted. It's really just about that simple. A Mack truck represents a huge threat, so almost no one pulls out in front of a Mack. Chevrolets and Fords represent a rather large threat. Some people, but not many pull out in front of them. Motorcycles and bicycles represent little if any threat, so they are dismissed. They represent so little threat, that they may not even be seen.
Funny thing - the Department of Transportation long ago mandated that motorcycles must have a headlight burning at all times, to make them "easier to see". People still don't see the motorcycle.
So, it all comes back on the motorcyclist. Just accept that you are the gladiator, and everyone in the ring is your enemy. You don't have to defeat your enemies to win, all you have to do is survive. Each and every vehicle that you pass without dying is a victory on your part. If you get home alive, you win. This is defensive driving. Assume that every vehicle you see is going to do the least expected thing. Assume that every driver on the road is out to get you. You must ride with this attitude, because you represent no threat to those drivers, but every one on them is a serious threat to you. Believe this, and ride like your life depends on it - because your life DOES INDEED depend on it.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by ataradov on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:00AM
Lights are not going to help. A typical pattern I see: 2 lanes stopped at a traffic light, from a number of cars behind a motorcycle appears and tries to get in front of everyone. There is no time to react to anything, there is no way to be aware of their presence up to the moment it is too late.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:27PM
Besides the physical threat, like getting hit by a truck, there is also the legal consequences threat. Nailing a pedestrian or bicyclist will have the car driver liable by default, hurt a motorcyclist, and a car driver has a pretty good chance of getting off by saying "but I didn't see him!"
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:14AM (14 children)
I ride aggressively, not crazy, but moving often to keep you inattentive people from killing me.
Guess what, after 50 years, I can say that works.
Getting left handed is another story altogether, not much to be done about those who are too distracted to properly look for motorbikes.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:52AM (11 children)
Ummm.. pass anyone on the left at your own risk! I don't care who you are, cyclist or car.
I wish I had a dollar for everyone who passed me on the left, while I was slowing down, turn signals ON, attempting a left turn! And motorcyclists take first prize for this one.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:00PM (1 child)
Uhhhhhh - you're British? In most of the civilized world, we do pass on the left. Actually, all of the civilized world, you barbarian!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @03:21AM
Mea culpa.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Webweasel on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:24PM (7 children)
I'd say the cyclists are worse, there are more of them nowadays. Constant newspaper articles that cyclists are "good people" and are all perfect, never break the law.
I have NEVER encountered a cyclist that has not broken the law right in front of me. Every single one ignores traffic lights, every one passes on the left or ride on the pavement. They don't wear hi vis or have lights at night, they don't wear helmets. Assholes the lot of them.
Priyom.org Number stations, Russian Military radio. "You are a bad, bad man. Do you have any other virtues?"-Runaway1956
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:53PM (6 children)
I'm a cyclist and I agree with this. Stop signs basically do not exist unless cars are already there waiting. Switching side-walk / road / verge is fair game. Lights and helmet are a must and reflective vest. Other than that tho, cyclists (especially men in lycra) are ASS HOLES.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Saturday January 06 2018, @04:39PM (5 children)
Stopping for a stop sign is stupid, in a car or on a bike. If there's no traffic, and you can see well enough to verify this, you don't need to stop. All stop signs should be changed to yield signs instead.
But it's worse on a bicycle, because the transition time between taking your foot off the pedal (which frequently means you have to disengage a clip), putting it on the ground, then starting again and getting the clip re-engaged is probably the most likely time you'll wreck on a bike, and doing so in an intersection is the worst place to do it. And at the same time, you're using one arm to give a hand signal, so you don't have both hands on the handlebars. Personally, I'll slow down enough to look around and make sure there's no cars around (which means I don't slow down at all if there's no cars at all in visual distance anywhere, as with wide-open rural places), and proceed with caution through the intersection. If there's cars, I'll generally try to slow down enough to almost-stop, without having to unclip, and then proceed when it's my turn.
Honestly, I'm a little sick of this "cyclists are assholes" thing. I've seen both types, and generally most cyclists I've seen are just fine: they wear helmets, use lights at night, follow traffic laws mostly (unless they're stupid), ride safely, etc. I have seen some assholes of course, but I wouldn't call them a majority. Maybe I'm in the wrong places or something. And lycra is the most sensible thing to wear on a bike: wind resistance is a real thing, and skintight clothes really do perform better when you're moving, which is why people wear them for every almost other kind of exercise these days.
(Score: 2) by tekk on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:50PM (3 children)
That's why in some states there are explicit laws which allow cyclists to treat stop signs as yields. In general a lot of the "dangerous" behavior for cyclists is the same reason motorcyclists do the same "dangerous" stuff: it keeps you moving and away from traffic, because stopped and near cars are the 2 biggest danger factors.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:52PM (2 children)
According to my quick bit of research, those "some states" are comprised of: Idaho, and.... that's it. I think Delaware and California are considering such laws.
But you're exactly right about the "dangerous" stuff.
There's also a law in Virginia (not sure about other states) that bicycles and motorcycles are allow to go through red lights after stopping and waiting 120 seconds, enough for two full cycles of the light, so they don't get trapped if the light doesn't detect them.
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:55PM
That's a dead red law. In WA. it's not a time period, the light has to go around once without giving you a green at which point you can go anyways as long as it's safe.
There's one big issue with it that cops may or may not recognize it as a legal excuse for ignoring a red light.
(Score: 2) by tekk on Saturday January 06 2018, @10:48PM
Quick search said it started in Idaho, it was added to Delaware last year, and various municipalities have added it in Colorado. As far as the 2 cycle thing, I think that's a thing here in NC but that may just be hearsay. Depending on the traffic (cyclist) sometimes I deal with a light, but if it's, say, a left across a 4 line highway I usually use a crosswalk if it's available. Perks of a bike rather than a motorcycle :)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @05:09AM
It's not stupid. If it's a four way stop as opposed to an uncontrolled intersection they didn't put those stop signs or stop signal up just because they had left over money in the budget. The stop signals are there for a reason and if you run it anyways and something happens, then you're the one that's going to be at fault.
Stopping completely for an uncontrolled intersection tends to be rather silly unless the visibility is poor though.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:10AM
Apologies, should have mentioned I'm in the USA.
What I meant, was a driver awaiting to turn left will cross over the oncoming traffic lane, so they do not have the right of way.
When it's clear, only then, may left turn traffic proceed.
So, getting "left handed, also known as "left turned", is a major cause of M/C fatalities.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:51PM (1 child)
same thing with driving. i drive like speed racer. good luck hitting me. it will be just like the cartoon. ch-ch-ch-ch and i jump right over you. :)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:12AM
Pretty sure your missing my point, have fun though, enjoy the traffic fines and restrictions.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by MostCynical on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:26AM (5 children)
reading the glee with which people on this thread are recounting stories relating to injuring motorcyclists, it seems we have demonstrated part of the problem: people hate motorcycles and motorcyclists.
Once that is clear, SMIDSY [macmillandictionary.com] is actually missing some letters: "BIHY" ("Becaus I Hate You")
Even unconsciously, or, as in this thread, with deliberate malice.
The why isfar more complicated, but probably relates to perceptions of danger. (You are making yourself a target, so I will aim at you")
Sad.
Shame we can live and let live.
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:02AM (2 children)
I don't hate motorcyclists. But I do hate kids playing in the road, and putting us all at risk.
Think I get great glee of splaying a motorcyclist's innards all over the road? Its gonna be a big pain in the ass for me with all the legal paperwork you have put me through.
If I see someone else do it, I may get a sigh of relief that's one less road hazard, in much the same way as I see a fixed pothole.
Just by and large, many motorcyclists drive crazy and put the rest of us at risk of filling out a bunch of paperwork and lost time for court and legal appearances.
If someone wants to splay themselves all over the road, I don't care. But I don't want to be involved in it.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:11PM
I hate everyone who gets out on my highway and slows me down. I have a lot of important shit to get done, and all of you mortals just get in my way. Oh, as a matter of fact, I DO own the road.
signed
Grim Reaper
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @05:37PM
Seriously you sound like a psychopath.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:53PM (1 child)
i don't mind motorcyclists. i think it's funny when they drive in between lanes of stagnant traffic. screw the normals. i also don't know why people can't hear the motorcycles. they are loud as hell.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @05:12AM
Some motorcycles are very loud, but they're only loud from behind. They're not loud from the front or the sides. Also, modern cars and trucks have more insulation to provide a quiet ride than older vehicles did.
Plus, those jap bikes can be incredibly quiet. I ride a small Kawi and it doesn't make very much noise. I doubt people notice the sound coming off my exhaust system when they're in a car.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:52AM (5 children)
Someone needs to explain to motorcylists that it is a matter of life and death that the other drivers can predict what they are going to do. Most motorcylists seem to take pride in acting in the least predictable manner they can achieve.
And riding on the wrong side of the road, even within the speed limit (not that that happens a lot) should be dealt with very severely by the courts, seeing the alternative is a death sentence.
(Score: 2) by choose another one on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:34AM (1 child)
And driving should not? why?
Or do you never overtake unless there are multiple lanes?
(Score: 2) by Dr Spin on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:07PM
Or do you never overtake unless there are multiple lanes?
No, I don't normally overtake unless there are multiple lanes, but I live in London, and on most roads around here, there is always traffic going both ways - even at 3AM. If you live somewhere where there is only one car an hour, that is not the situation I was thinking about. Here bikers pop out from behind cars to overtake a car on their side because it is obeying the speed limits (cameras every few hundred yards), forcing you to brake or hit them - this can happen almost continuously if you travel in the opposite direction to rush hour traffic. The bikers presumably think a car is as manoeuvrable as they are, and are playing chicken, or are not thinking at all.
Warning: Opening your mouth may invalidate your brain!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:04PM
You seem to be confusing bicyclists, who often ride on the wrong side of the road, with motorcyclists. It's very unusual to see a motorcyclist going the wrong way. Maybe some kid with a dirt bike, who isn't allowed on the road to start with, trying to sneak a short distance between home and his favorite dirt course.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:07PM
We know that and most of what we do is in fact highly predictable. The fact that other motorists don't know how to predict is speaks volumes about the lack of competency in typical drivers. We're going to cut across the lane from outside to inside and back to outside much of the time when we go around turns. We're usually going to pull off to one side or another of the lane when coming to a stop and motorists should do that as well so that we don't get crushed by idiots failing to stop in time.
This whole business of bikers being unpredictable is mainly because most drivers are incompetent. For the most part, if you just drive at some sort of predictable way, we'll figure out how to make it work. We've got more options than you do and we've got better maneuverability as well.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:19AM
Thanks mate, always good to learn something new, after riding safely on the roads for 50 years.
Totally amazing I missed all that, thanks!
(Score: 3, Interesting) by choose another one on Saturday January 06 2018, @09:46AM (1 child)
Pretty sure this is the same effect as covered here, years ago:
http://www.theinvisiblegorilla.com/gorilla_experiment.html [theinvisiblegorilla.com]
Just give the gorilla a bike.
Bottom line, for motorcyclists and cyclists, is that in areas where bikes are a normal part (and significant percentage) of the traffic, you will be seen. If not, you won't be, by a significant percentage of the drivers, because drivers are looking for traffic and you are not traffic (in that area). I've ridden tens of thousands of miles in my life, and it is consistent experience that if there are lots of bikes, you get seen, or if there are very few cars, but if you are one bike per 500 cars, expect trouble.
(Score: 1) by tbuskey on Sunday January 07 2018, @11:30PM
This is the most insightful post I've seen.
I've ridden motorcycles since I was 9, with motocross and other offroad riding. When I got my driver's license, I got the motorcycle license. I'm definitely looking for motorcycles.
In college, I had my 1st incident of almost pulling out for a motorcycle I didn't see and it surprised me.
We drive our cars all the time & come to expect cars on the road. Like the gorilla study, people routinely block out anything that's not a car. So accidents happen with motorcycles, bicycles and pedestrians all the time.
Some situations make us more sensitive to non cars, like driving in a residential area where you can expect to see kids in the street. I'm always more aware when I'm on the motorcycle. Bicyclists will sometime be more alert too.
The collision detection in newer cars can help. Volvo measured a 10% reduction in pedestrian accidents below 25 mph in their cars equipped with it. I'm looking forward to more of this semi-autonomous assistance.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by turgid on Saturday January 06 2018, @10:24AM (8 children)
Here in the UK filtering (lane splitting) is legal for motorcycles, but overtaking on the left (right in other countries) is illegal for all other vehicles. I drive twice daily on a motorway. I've never ridden a motorbike because I consider it just too risky, and I'm often amazed at the sloppy way many people drive.
It really does pay to have your mirrors in your car correctly set up, especially on multi-lane roads where vehicles will be passing and changing lanes frequently. There's a lot going on all around you all the time. In fact, I find myself very busy looking ahead, behind and to the sides all the time.
It's pretty obvious that many drivers can't be bothered or just don't care or have no idea of the danger they're causing when they drive too fast to close, change lanes without indicating, causing other vehicles to brake or change lane evasively including motorcycles. Obviously this is especially dangerous for a motorcycle since the rider has virtually zero protection from impacts. In fact, I know someone who had to take evasive action from a car changing lane on such a road. He had to put the bike down on its side, skidding along the road, hit something and broke his legs.
What absolutely beggars belief is the number of times an ambulance or police car comes along the motorway with its lights flashing and siren going, and it gets blocked by cars ahead who apparently haven't noticed! All they need to do is to pull over. How can you not notice flashing lights in your mirrors? On the straight bits you can see them a mile and a half away.
The standard of driving is pretty poor in general. The sooner self-driving cars become the norm, the better.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @12:08PM (7 children)
Tell your friend to NEVER lay his bike down. The tires and brakes will slow your bike down faster than the metal and flesh sliding along. That laying bikes down to stop is from another day and age, when bikes may or may not have had working brakes at all, and they weren't very effective if they were present. Never, never, NEVER lay a bike down intentionally. Well, unless you decided to disconnect the brakes, then went riding - in which case, you're up for a Darwin award. Just grit your teeth, and get it over with, then claim your award!!
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:15PM (6 children)
Thanks, this is the second time "laying the bike down" has been referred to, and it's another of those stupid riding habits like only using the rear brake like you did on your old bicycle. Luckily, both of these habits are eventually self-correcting.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:00PM (5 children)
Only using the rear brake is one of those perpetual wrong-teaching things, that should be coming to an end, soon after the Baby Boomers are gone.
There weren't any riding classes when I came up. No internet. Few authors had written anything authoritative about motorcycle riding. There was nowhere to go for information. Somebody or other has a wreck on a bike, and he insists that his front brake caused it. No matter that he may or may not have a measurable IQ - everyone who hears him gives him some credibility. And, bikers tend to avoid that front brake because it can indeed do strange things to your ability to stay upright - IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THE PHYSICS OF YOUR MOTORCYCLE.
It was only after the internet came along, that I gained enough understanding of the physics, that I now feel comfotable using that front brake aggressively. If, 45 or 50 years ago, someone had explained all the facts about weight and tire loading, I would have been a much better rider.
Anyway, everyone needs a teacher when he starts out. Having a bad teacher helps you to be a bad rider.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:50AM (4 children)
I don't know how it would work on a motorcycle, but on a bicycle ... if you ride on ice or packed snow, you learn to use ONLY the rear brake the very first time you apply 'em... because if you use both, you'll swap ends (and possibly flip yourself) at amazing speed. Same with braking while going down a serious hill.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 1) by Crash on Wednesday January 10 2018, @08:32PM (3 children)
The worst was a steep ~45° hill during the Winter with moderate temperatures - which caused frequent black ice. Oddly I only wiped out once that year.
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Wednesday January 10 2018, @10:30PM (2 children)
I know the evil stuff well... black ice didn't seem to bother the bicycle as much as did packed snow, maybe a matter of relative surface melt from tire pressure.
And that's a steep enough hill to wipe out without any help! Yikes!
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 1) by Crash on Thursday January 11 2018, @04:56AM (1 child)
Or the bicycle, I used to ride a heavy steel-frame wide-tire Mountain Bike that you could just barely pick up with one hand.
Things changed drastically when I switched to a Medalist 7005 aluminum frame, which you could easily pick up with a single finger
Found a picture here: https://www.pinkbike.com/photo/13627227/ [pinkbike.com]
Rain, Sleet, Snow, Hills - no problem!
(Score: 2) by Reziac on Thursday January 11 2018, @05:27AM
Yeah, my old bike was a steel-framed Schwinn from the 1960s, and it weighed 40 pounds (I know, cuz it got weighed when it was sent on the bus as freight). That thing had its own momentum. Current bike weighs about half that and isn't nearly as sensitive to how it's braked. (OTOH, it's not nearly as good a bike, despite being lighter on the controls.) But when I come off my yard hill -- I still rear-only brake, cuz otherwise it wants to skitter a bit.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 3, Touché) by Bot on Saturday January 06 2018, @01:08PM (8 children)
I understand driving a bike at 50kph following the laws is pure suffering. But then don't complain when other people care little about the laws too and get in your path.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:10PM (7 children)
Sigh, this ignorance. Bikers ride faster than traffic typically because it makes is less likely that we'll be stuck in somebody's blindspot.
What's more, those speed limits are set based on car traffic. We take up less space in a lane, which means we're more likely to be able to swerve around a hazard without going into somebody elses lane. We can also take corners more quickly without crashing as well.
Going much faster than the speed limit is rather foolish in most cases, but don't pretend like car drivers are any better. I regularly get passed by car drivers while I'm riding that are upset because I'm only going 5 over the speed limit.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:34PM
Who's pretending? The difference is car drivers are more likely to survive not being better. Maybe even physically unharmed...
Yes don't pass other vehicles too slowly[1] but don't pass other vehicles closely at speeds higher than you are willing to collide with them. Lots of bikers break this rule. Breaking this rule may not ever kill you but it has definitely killed or maimed for life many other bikers.
[1] Never stay to the side of another vehicle for long. Doesn't matter if they can see you or not. Especially if it's a truck or similar large vehicle: http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a30085/want-to-live-stay-away-from-trucks/ [roadandtrack.com]
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:08PM (2 children)
I ride. I ride fast a lot of the time. In fact, I ride pretty aggressively. But, your excuses for breaking the law are pretty feeble. I drive fast because I'm a fucking speed demon, and I like going fast. I like to see the expressions on people's faces as I whip past them. I'm not going to bullshit people about their blind spots. I know, you know, everyone knows that motorists have blind spots. We bikers have our own, for that matter. There are several ways I can avoid a blind spot. I can slow down, I can change lanes, I can pass, or I can just move over in the lane, where I no longer occupy a blind spot. But, my first choice, almost all the time, is to pass the guy ahead of me. Speed is an addiction, just like any other drug. Roll that throttle, and watch the world flash by - THAT is why I go faster than most traffic.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @10:00PM (1 child)
It's not bullshit and it's barely illegal. Riding 5-10 over the speed limit is often safer than riding the speed limit. Especially in cities where the speed limits have been artificially lowered.
Hell, I'm regularly behind cops driving their cruisers that fast.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Sunday January 07 2018, @06:13AM
Barely illegal? Is that a legal term? Buddy, the fact is, if a cop sees you riding just 1 mile over the speed limit, he can pull you over and ticket you. And, of course, once he has you on the side of the road, he can find more infractions. Your exhaust may be factory fresh, and he can say it's to loud. A light may have a hairline crack in the lens, which you can't even see until you look at it at the right angle. (A diesel cop got me for a cracked rim once, that was very nearly impossible to see.) Further, it doesn't stop at the bike. Your driver's license has a history has a driving record, not to mention that it is the gateway to any kind of arrest record and court history.
Barely illegal? Tell that to people of various colors who have been subjected to "stop and search". A pair of fingernail clippers might be deemed a weapon, by some asshole of a cop.
Riding 5 to 10 mph over the limit is breaking the law, and citing safety reasons for doing so will get you no points, no sympathy from a judge. Those speed limits that have been artificially lowered, were lowered for the purpose of revenue generation. You are walking, talking revenue - revenue on the hoof, so to speak.
You may rationalize speeding however you wish, to yourself. Don't expect the rest of us to share your rationale.
I speed because I like speed, and I'm smarter than the average cop. I like breaking the law, and I do it routinely. If/when you can make such a statement, you'll probably be happier with your life. And, getting a ticket won't be such a devastating experience. You won't get all teary-eyed, pissed off, and upset at the loss of money. Instead, you can shrug it off. "The bastards caught me - let's see how long until they catch me again!"
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Reziac on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:53AM (1 child)
Being able to swerve faster to avoid hazards also means you can swerve INTO being a hazard that much faster, too. Just because you can avoid something doesn't mean the guy in the next lane can avoid YOU when you suddenly appear in his space.
And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday January 07 2018, @05:24AM
You do realize that a motorcycle takes up roughly a third of the width of a car, right? A motorcycle swerving usually remains in the same lane as it was traveling in. A pedestrian or car that pulls out too far or fails to clear the lane usually leaves at least a portion of the lane free to swerve into.
I've had to swerve while riding in the past and I've yet to have to leave my lane, but I have had a couple times when I was riding the centerline for a few feet with no oncoming traffic. Plan ahead and it's not an issue.
The main situation where you're not going to be able to swerve safely is when there's oncoming traffic and the entire lane ahead of you is blocked up. But, if you're actually planning ahead, you can see that coming and plan accordingly by leaving more space in front of you.
A car though cannot swerve without leaving the lane that it's traveling in. You might be able to swerve a foot or so if you've got a smart car, but as a general rule a swerving car will leave the lane. A swerving motorcycle won't leave the lane unless the rider either plans to or lays it down.
(Score: 2) by Bot on Friday January 12 2018, @01:05PM
What blind spot? A 50km/h biker in the center of his lane following cars sticks out like a pig in a mosque, I was about to take a pic, but, you know, I was driving.
Account abandoned.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by lars on Saturday January 06 2018, @01:44PM
I daily drive a motorcycle, and honestly, this has happened to me too. There are just so many cars on the road that when you are looking to see if the lane is clear you are really looking to see if there is a car there. Your brain just gets used to looking for cars. I don't think there is any way to prevent it. Practicing slow lane changes is about all you can do.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by VLM on Saturday January 06 2018, @02:57PM (8 children)
The problem is lack of augmented reality and crash proof A pillars
A pillars are the sticks by the windshield that hold your roof to the hood, kinda.
I'm older; my first car had stylish A pillars that were thinner than my heavy steel Sears kids bicycle tubing. My current commuter vehicle has A pillars like a fat ladies thighs (ah Snowcrash, never change). Seriously though, my first commuter car A pillars were less than a quarter as visually blocking than my current commuter car's A pillars.
If I'm trying to survive a rollover crash, obviously I'd live a lot longer in a car that has A pillars that resemble an elephants legs than a car with A pillars that resemble a somewhat understuffed bratwurst.
On the other hand I've had problems where I'm gradually turning and a car gets behind the A pillar at the same exact angular velocity and I kinda block it out because my mind has taught itself to ignore everything happening around the gigantic A pillar, because, obviously, the damn pillar is there 24x7.
I can point my eyes at the giant wide motorcycle-view blocking A pillars, but damn right I'm never going to "see" anything because if I flinched or slammed on the brakes every time I saw a giant A pillar in my visual field I'd never get anywhere.
Augmented reality will fix this. We'll have the visual field of a motorcycle, maybe better. You'll have an A pillar, you'll just have 15 cameras outside synthesizing an image without anything ever blocking it. But until then we gotta mow down cyclists.
Something only older folks will remember is cars with A pillars so narrow you couldn't hide the setting sun behind them by moving your head. Modern cars are like being in the shade of a tree trunk.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 06 2018, @03:17PM (5 children)
The pillars are alright, IMO. I hate most rear view mirrors. I come up to a stop sign, and a car on my right can be approaching the same intersection. I don't see it until I duck my head, to look under the damned mirror. This is the most dangerous at 4-way and 3-way stops, but anything moving at a matching angular speed can be hidden from me. Those pillars just don't seem a very big deal to me, in comparison.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Saturday January 06 2018, @04:50PM (4 children)
Huh? It sounds like your seat sits too high. Try leaning it back a bit. Your rearview mirror should be above your main line of vision, not blocking it.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Saturday January 06 2018, @07:26PM (1 child)
Lean it back? You mean, like reclining? Uhhhhhhhh - sorry - NO FUCKING WAY! First, my back would hurt like hell. Second, reclining is for sleeping. Okay, so I'm not going to actually fall asleep, unless I'm driving for to many hours. Still, reclining means relaxing. Relaxing is anathema to paying attention, or staying alert. Putting my seat lower to the floor? I don't think my seat has an adjustment for up and down, but if it did, I'd jack it up higher. To low a seat, and my legs and knees start killing me.
I'll continue to duck my head, to double check that blind spot before I pull out into an intersection.
I could just take the rearview mirror out, and replace my two outside mirrors with better mirrors. Trucks don't have rear view mirrors on their windshields, after all.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Saturday January 06 2018, @08:59PM
I don't mean recline all the way back, just enough so your mirror isn't at the same height as your eyes (while making sure your wrists can touch the top of the wheel, otherwise you're leaning too far back). Or lower your seat if that's possible.
If those don't work, it sounds like your car just doesn't fit you very well, and you should get a different one. I'm 6'1" and I don't have these problems in my car.
(Score: 1) by toddestan on Sunday January 07 2018, @12:14AM (1 child)
I have the same problem. I'm tall, and drive a smaller car. I otherwise fit just fine in the car, but the rear-view mirror is a nice car-sized blind-spot, and can completely obscure a vehicle coming up to an intersection I'm approaching at the same time. I've just had to learn to remember to look around/under the mirror to make sure I'm not missing another car.
My car is older too, newer cars are even worse as the mirror has grown in size as they've added buttons and lights and other crap to it. And the greenhouses now are a more low-slung and slopey (compared to older cars that tend to have them squared off), with the end result that I'm often looking out the very top of the windshield even in cars much larger than the one I have now.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Sunday January 07 2018, @03:32PM
I have a ugly as hell Yaris and my wife traded in her Prius for a ugly Sienna. I once drove a sporty-wannabe 90s Saturn which was a pretty nice looking car although it had terrible visibility. Another historical anecdote; Plymouth Horizon / Dodge Omni, ugly as hell, but great visibility. Another ugly car with great visibility: Ford Taurus station wagon.
My wife's old Prius wasn't all that ugly, yet had decent visibility, so compromises do exist.
An interesting technological innovation either via better CAD design or augmented reality would be cars the look nice but have good visibility; you can't buy both at the same time AFAIK.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 06 2018, @06:44PM
One can make a thin A-pillar that will handle a rollover crash.
One can't do that out of cheap steel, with padding, with a handle, with an airbag, and still keep it attractive.
The sort of material to use is probably a metal-matrix composite. For example, this is what is used for the F/A-18 nose gear. Picture something like a carbon fiber composite, but with nickel instead of epoxy.
Another option is a single-crystal superalloy, as used in jet turbine blades. The tradeoff is a bit different, gaining some types of strength and losing others.
The A-pillars should be asymmetric, so that the driver sees them edge-on. (parts must be distinct for left-driver and right-driver countries) The padding should be minimal. The windows need to attach in a way that doesn't effectively widen the pillar with gaskets. You can't put an airbag in an A-pillar.
Oh, don't forget the other pillars. The driver-side A-pillar is most critical, but they all matter.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Magic Oddball on Sunday January 07 2018, @02:29AM
This exactly. My first four cars were manufactured between 1976-1994, so they not only had thin A-pillars, their windshields & rear windows were steeply sloped so I had a much greater vertical/horizontal viewing space than today's cars offer. I've ended up having more close calls per year in my current car than I did for all of the years of those other cars combined, and 99% of them are due to how obstructed the view is.