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Google Employees Resign in Protest Against Pentagon Contract
It's been nearly three months since many Google employees—and the public—learned about the company's decision to provide artificial intelligence to a controversial military pilot program known as Project Maven, which aims to speed up analysis of drone footage by automatically classifying images of objects and people. Now, about a dozen Google employees are resigning in protest over the company's continued involvement in Maven.
[...] The employees who are resigning in protest, several of whom discussed their decision to leave with Gizmodo, say that executives have become less transparent with their workforce about controversial business decisions and seem less interested in listening to workers' objections than they once did. In the case of Maven, Google is helping the Defense Department implement machine learning to classify images gathered by drones. But some employees believe humans, not algorithms, should be responsible for this sensitive and potentially lethal work—and that Google shouldn't be involved in military work at all.
Previously: Google vs Maven
Google Employees on Pentagon AI Algorithms: "Google Should Not be in the Business of War"
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:12AM (3 children)
Select all squares with radical Muslims. If there are none, click skip.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:13AM (2 children)
Trick question, because all Muslims are radical.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:31AM
I'm not sure when surfing became so popular with Muslims, but yes they do indeed have some quite radical moves.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @05:00AM
Even the ones using boogie boards?!
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:15AM (16 children)
First, a huge amount of credit to these employees who are willing to take a moral stance. It's easy to posture, but it's very hard to choose "no paycheck" over something as abstract as "it's the right thing to do."
Second... for a company of so many thousand, the resignation of a dozen employees is only a minor blip. It will cause some turmoil for their specific teams, but it will hardly cause any fundamental pain to the company. (If anything, that just makes my first point even stronger and why these people deserve more moral credit.)
Third... with only a dozen people leaving, it makes me wonder how many of these people were wanting to leave anyway, and this just provided a convenient excuse. It could be 0, but it does make me wonder.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:31AM (10 children)
Someone said that all twelve of them are the same people who continue to walk into the invisible glass walls.
.
.
.
.
.
.
That's sarcasm. I don't know a thing about any of them. I can guess that they are all special snowflakes, but I know nothing more than is in the story.
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:33AM (6 children)
And we all assume you're a redneck jackass :)
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:51AM (4 children)
ASSuming shit just makes an ASS out of you - but not me.
(Score: 2, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:12AM (3 children)
Pot meet kettle. Amusing that luttle bit went over your ahead, or did you miss your own assumption that they must have been "snowflakes"?
(Score: 0, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:30AM (1 child)
What is obvious here is, forcing the reader to scroll down just a little bit to see the "punchline" of a joke post is just too complicated for some readers. Over my head? FFS, you have to look up to see my knees! No wonder snowflakes have such a hard life. You're all looking up to see what the rest of us are doing.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @09:57PM
scrolling down
It is a good thing you put quotes around your "punchline" cause the two sentences don't even make sense together even if I'm being generous with joke interpretation. You first say they are idiots who walk into walls, then you say they must be special snowflakes, but you know nothing more?
You don't know anything, your joke was terrible, you got called out for it, you gave a totally oblivious retort, and now you're doubling down on the snowflake gag? Pffft, you trying to beat out Buzzy for cluelessness?
(Score: 4, Touché) by DeathMonkey on Tuesday May 15 2018, @05:59PM
What's more "snowflake" than pitching a bitch fit because somebody did something that has absolutely no effect on your life or anything you care about.
Conservatives are the biggest snowflakes of them all. It's only their projection that has them seeing it in everyone else.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:53AM
You don't have to assume. The facts speak loud and clear.
(Score: 3, Informative) by takyon on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:53AM
That was at Apple, not GOOG:
Apple Employees Reportedly Walking Into Glass Walls at New HQ [soylentnews.org]
[SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:59AM (1 child)
Wasn't it Apple that had all the employees hitting the glass doors?
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:25PM
Bluto: What? Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!
Otter: [to Boon] Germans?
Boon: Forget it, he's rolling.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:50AM (1 child)
Why the right thing to do if computers can better identify targets than people. It could lead to fewer unintended deaths
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:48AM
I'm afraid you aren't very familiar with the US's drone program. They are trying to identify more people to attack with their drones.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by looorg on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:17AM (2 children)
So lets see, last time this was up there was as I recall it thousands of Googlers (or whatever we are supposed to call them) that was up in arms and demanded a stop to the military industrial complex (TM) killing babies with drones using Googles patented not evil tech. So a dozen, give or take a few, people quit. Guess it was just a lot of bark and not a lot of follow thru on that empty threat. A dozen people is tiny fraction of a percent of their entire staff.
Still it might not be the number, it might be that those leaving was really important people to the project which might be a devastating blow or it might be some drones that won't be missed and replaced by the army of applicants before they where even out the door. After all every company has turnover of employees, I doubt this is more then a blip. If the thousands that signed had left there might have been an impact.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by TheRaven on Tuesday May 15 2018, @11:21AM (1 child)
sudo mod me up
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 17 2018, @03:39AM
I'm all for bread and circuses if the bread and circuses are good and almost everyone gets them.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by jmorris on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:29AM (26 children)
This is probably good for Google long term. The article was careful to avoid any details about the disgruntled employees but it is a pretty safe bet they are a freak show. Encouraging these defective people to leave will make Google stronger and weaken the companies they end up at.
I can guess they are the defectives because they totally misunderstand the reality of the workplace. Employees work for management, management works for the shareholders. Employees do not give orders to management unless they somehow represent a lot of voting shares.
(Score: 5, Touché) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:34AM (7 children)
Good slave.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by jmorris on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:44AM (6 children)
If you do not want to work for a publicly traded corporation, don't. But if you work for one it is foolish to pretend it is something other than what it is, even more foolish to expect it to change its essential nature because of a few delicate snowflakes' feelz.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by PartTimeZombie on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:55AM
Quite right.
Those people should know their place and never question their betters.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:58AM (4 children)
Are you dumb or what? The employees that quit aren't foolish. They aren't pretending. They aren't snowflakes. They didn't like what the company they worked for was turning into and they quit. What part of that are you ragging on? Awwww, do they have more guts than you? That's okay - we'll let you think you're special even if you don't stand up for what you believe.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Captival on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:10AM (3 children)
Apparently turning in Chinese political dissidents to be tortured and executed was perfectly okay for these employees. It was helping out their own country that's the problem.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:34AM (2 children)
And you have done exactly *WHAT* to help Chinese rebels? Yup, didn't think so.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @04:04AM (1 child)
I haven't directly harmed them, that's for sure.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @06:58AM
I, too, look the other way.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:35AM
Does your brain hurt when you wake up? I can only assume you're constantly smashed off yer ass and just have a really good spellchecker.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:46AM (13 children)
This is a gross over-simplification, and dramatically undervalues half of the equation. I'm not sure if that's by design or you really believe it.
Simply put, there is labor (workers) and capital (money). Labor provides labor (they work) and capital provides capital (they pay money). If either side doesn't like the arrangement, they are free to withdraw from it. Case in point, if capital thinks they are being overcharged for a low quality work, they can stop contributing (stop paying, e.g. firing the worker).
In this case, labor is thinking it doesn't like the deal (they are being asked to do something they don't agree with), and are withdrawing from it. It was a simple negotiation... "We workers don't like what we are working on." "We management aren't going to change." "Then we workers are leaving."
Employees have a lot of say in what they do, and far more than corporate America would have you believe. There is a reason they are called "employees," and not "slaves."
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:57AM (12 children)
Of course. Slaves are expensive. Employees, not so much. Especially so in this day and age when corporations import skills from the next town over, or half the world away, instead of training the work force.
There is also a reason companies like Uber resist calling their workers "employees". The company has even less responsibility to contractors, than to employees, or slaves.
(Score: 5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:53AM (10 children)
Shut up, Kanye.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:19AM (9 children)
Do I sense some butthurt? You may want to fill out a form: https://thelibertarianrepublic.com/senator-releases-hurt-feelings-form-for-butthurt-liberals/ [thelibertarianrepublic.com]
Meanwhile, I'll just enjoy some great entertainment: https://thepoliticalinsider.com/liberals-crying-pictures-make-day-even-brighter1/ [thepoliticalinsider.com]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:26AM
Actually, I was just lumping you in with the other mindless sheep who regurgitate what they are told by their masters.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by crafoo on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:18AM (7 children)
Actually, all those people legitimately crying over Hillary losing really disturbs me. It's enough people for me to question how valid democracy really is. Hillary is a monster. I don't understand how anyone paying attention could help but notice that fact.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:54PM (6 children)
It cracks me up. A great feeling of Schadenfreude washes over me and warms my heart. It's not often a smug entitled adult-child gets a life lesson on camera. It's all the more wonderful because the media had been telling them, "We got this" for months and months. The media is hysterically bitter a year and a half later for being so wrong, "by a landslide." Reading the NYT, watching MSNBC, ABC or CNN gives me the giggles when I can just feel the lopsided hate, venom and bitterness that will ruin their credibility for years to come.
(Score: 2, Troll) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:33PM
The election was rigged. And Crooked Hillary still lost. She failed miserably. I said, we should just cancel the election and just give it to Trump, right? And now the Fake News Media and the Dems -- Hillary most of all -- are wishing they'd just given it to me. Democracy is very overrated, folks. What were we even having it -- what were we having it? Her policies are so bad. Boy, do we have a big difference.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday May 15 2018, @07:20PM (4 children)
By a landslide of losing the popular vote, sure
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 2) by Oakenshield on Tuesday May 15 2018, @08:01PM (3 children)
I think the point was that the media had been claiming it was going to be a landslide victory for HRC.
Which is entirely irrelevant. The contest was played by the rules of the game. You don't win the World Series by getting the most hits. It's the runs that count.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday May 15 2018, @08:08PM (2 children)
Yes, I'm aware what the rules are. I think we should change them because most of the reasoning behind the Electoral College really doesn't apply anymore.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact [wikipedia.org]
Not that Trump didn't imply he wouldn't accept the results if he lost, just to drive home to everybody again how big of a douchenozzle he is.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Oakenshield on Tuesday May 15 2018, @08:19PM (1 child)
Before you start changing the rules of the Electoral College which affect ALL of us, maybe you should start a little closer to home and get rid of all those DNC superdelegates that subvert the will of the Democratic voters in favor of party whims. I think the only reason most Electoral College reformists want change is sour grapes. Had things worked out the opposite way, Democrats would be holding up the Electoral College as the great savior that prevented Trump from being elected.
(Score: 2) by tangomargarine on Tuesday May 15 2018, @08:49PM
Sure, sounds like a good idea.
Believe it or not, I was actually in favor of the NPVIC *before* the election. This latest debacle just reinforced that opinion.
"Is that really true?" "I just spent the last hour telling you to think for yourself! Didn't you hear anything I said?"
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 17 2018, @03:44AM
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:56AM
Why are you assuming that they are transsexual or vegan?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Arik on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:57AM
Workers and employers have two-way relationships, not one-way. Very few, if any, workers are attracted to their job initially, or motivated to stay with it long-term, *solely* on the basis of pecuniary interests. Employers often understand this and use it in recruitment, and google is a particularly visible example of that, touting their working environment heavily in recruitment.
Well, you can't have it both ways. If you hire a lot of people at least partially on the strength of 'this is a good place to work because we fit your values' then you shouldn't be shocked if those same employees may later want to have a word with you about how you're currently doing on that score.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Tuesday May 15 2018, @04:01AM
No, no, you need to say it with a German accent. "I vas shust followink orders, mein Herr! Befehl ist befehl!"
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:37AM (8 children)
Whatever happened to "Don't be evil"?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don%27t_be_evil [wikipedia.org]
Seems that Google is moving ever so quietly from being a force for good in the world to something altogether different.
Another company that is letting the almighty dollar corrupt it's values.
(Score: 0, Troll) by jmorris on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:52AM (6 children)
They have been openly Evil pretty much since before they made that their motto. It is a confirmation of Day's three Laws of SJWs.
1. SJWs Always Lie
2. SJWs Always Double Down
3. SJWs Always Project
Announcing "Don't Be Evil" was what we call a "tell." A rapacious entity trying to suck in the world's information and everyone's personal information to grind it up in AI algos to sell to advertisers trying to reassure their users that they will somehow rape their assholes in a "non-evil" way because they are such enlightened and progressive people. Anyone who didn't realize Google had designed itself from the start to be evil wasn't paying attention. All Brin and Page needed was white cats and a volcano lair to be Bond villains... and who knows, they might have both.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:10AM (2 children)
'Don't be evil' was just 'dont be microsoft'
They did that perfectly. However, money corrupts. Even people with 'morals' are always for sale.
It is like the old joke.
A man walks up to an absolutely stunning looking woman.
"Madam would you sleep with me for 1 million dollars"
She mulls it over and says.
"Yes I would"
"How about 5 bucks"
"What sort of woman do you think I am?!!!!"
"We have already established that Ma'am I figured at this point we were just negotiating over price"
Would people be lining up to work at google if it paid 20k a year and did not look good on ye ol resume? Probably not.
They sacrificed Facebook to the altar of public opinion. What does everyone think Google a company much bigger than them is doing with all that information? A fellow I know recently asked "What would you pay for facebook services without the ads and info scrapping?" I answered "nothing I would not use it" "yeah that is the answer I get from most people" "shows what everyone really thinks of those services doesnt it?" "they are valued at nothing?" "yep".
(Score: 1, Troll) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:39AM (1 child)
The folks at Facebook are making money hand over fist. Amazing Q1 report, TREMENDOUS growth in revenue & earnings. They were a big help to my campaign. They helped me win big, now they're winning big. Think about it! foxbusiness.com/markets/3-new-must-see-quotes-from-facebook-inc-ceo-mark-zuckerberg [foxbusiness.com]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:30AM
Phew! Zuckerfuck got through hazing. I was a little worried, but he did fine. The CIA is very popular these days, especially with tech companies.
Once we have a war going, we're guaranteed to have plenty of pussified little mama's boys looking to join the army (due to chocolate rations being raised so much), become real men instead of failures, and get laid.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:39AM
Apparently you don't have to be a SJW to double down on stupidity.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:55AM (1 child)
SJW sure is a funny acronym for right-wing extremist.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:33AM
Right-wing extremist, meet left-wing extremist. You've got so much in common!
(Score: 2, Funny) by simonInOz on Tuesday May 15 2018, @10:46AM
I think they have shortened the motto by one word.
-- cats like plain crisps --
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @12:59AM (2 children)
It's like a horse and a carriage. It's the world we live in.
You may argue Google should spin out military tech outfits. That don't work. There is no clear line between civilian tech and military tech.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:14AM (1 child)
https://wikileaks.org/google-is-not-what-it-seems/ [wikileaks.org]
They are as likely to spin it out as I am to grow another ear on my forehead. The military is so far up them google can feel its hymen on the back of its teeth.
(Score: 3, Informative) by frojack on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:38AM
TLDR; It had a difficult time getting to the point, but only because it really couldn't find any point to make.
No, you are mistaken. I've always had this sig.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:33AM (2 children)
There are employers with better projects to work on. Raytheon is a great example:
Want to work on robots? Raytheon makes a gun that aims and fires without human action.
How about a death ray? If you cranked to power a bit, Raytheon's active denial system could probably do the job. More power!
Do you like shooting planes from the sky? For that, there is the Patriot missile system.
Maybe a shoulder-fired missile with a top-down attack mode is more your style. Join the Javelin program.
Like cyberwar? You can do that.
You can also keep it traditional. Design bombs. Good old fashioned bombs can still be lots of fun.
...
That's just one awesome company. There is also General Dynamics, Boeing, Northrop Grumman, Lockheed Martin...
Or you could spend all day trying to track people to better target them with ads and keep them addicted. Your choice.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @01:59AM
When I was 19 I had great job working on tracking for ICBMs. Whomever is living in my parents old house better hope no one ever pushes that big, red, shiny button.
(Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday May 15 2018, @06:48AM
Somewhere around Caltech.edu I found the statistics. A particularly large portion worked for General Dynamics.
That's traditional for Caltech: back in the sixties the students took no particular interest in the antiwar movement.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @02:15AM
https://youtu.be/TlO2gcs1YvM [youtu.be]
(Score: 2, Troll) by realDonaldTrump on Tuesday May 15 2018, @03:07AM
Who am I kidding, of course you're listening. We (I) thank you for your service to our great Country and to my great military. You're doing a fantastic job! Bringing fire and fury -- and frankly, POWER.
And to the Quitters I have this to say. Winners never quit and Quitters never win. (Vince Lombardi)
(Score: 3, Interesting) by srobert on Tuesday May 15 2018, @04:15AM (3 children)
I can remember when I would have literally killed somebody to get a job that paid a livable wage. I'm not saying they're right or wrong because I don't know the details what they're protesting very well. But what a privilege it must be to leave a job to protest moral failings of one's employer. I'd love to be in a position to do that. How do you do that? Do you have a couple million banked when you bravely announce that you're resigning in protest? I wonder if they would still do that if (like myself at one time) they were about a week's pay away from being homeless. I never did kill somebody, but I worked for people who did. I never saw any of it, but if I had I would have kept my mouth shut.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Tuesday May 15 2018, @06:04AM (2 children)
Just in case I don't quite get it: do you resent what they did?
(blink) ... what's the worse that can happen that you'd need those millions?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 15 2018, @04:25PM
I don't know if he resents what they did. The way I read it, he is wondering what their situations are. Were they already on their way out the door? Were they affluent enough that they didn't need to be working? Did they already have jobs lined up to jump into, or knew that they could easily get another job? Knowing the answer to some of those questions would provide a little background before holding these guys up as Great Moral Crusaders. Remember during the last NFL season when Mike Pence walked out of the evening football game in a moral protest against the players who were kneeling during the National Anthem? Then it was (not surprisingly) revealed that was the entire point in going to Indianapolis in the first place and that there was never an intention to watch the game? That information confirms that his mighty stance based upon his high moral convictions was just a cheap political stunt meant to appease his boss. I think this guy is similarly wondering if there might be other motivations in play here.
(Score: 2) by srobert on Tuesday May 15 2018, @04:52PM
"Just in case I don't quite get it: do you resent what they did?"
No. I don't know whether I support their cause. I don't know much about it. I actually have some respect for their actions because they are protesting what, at least they perceive, as a moral lapse on Google's part. The world needs more of that and less of assholes who stand on the side accusing everyone of being an "SJW" for caring about anything. I'm glad they feel that they can protest in this way. But I hope they realize what it would be like not to be privileged in that way. Unfortunately the Joker was right: People are only as good as circumstances will allow them to be. Just a few small changes and these people will eat each other.
"what's the worse that can happen that you'd need those millions?"
Even now, though I'm much better off than I used to be, if I go too far in speaking my mind, I could easily wind up jobless, homeless, and unable to meet my family's needs. (We have a couple of serious medical conditions that we're dealing with). If I lose my job at my age, I'll probably be unemployed for the rest of my life. And I'm not close to being able to draw my pension yet. A million dollars isn't so much anymore. If invested well it could generate a livable income, but it's not enough to make you independently wealthy. But I think if I had 2 or 3 million, I would not hesitate to speak openly about much of anything. I wouldn't hesitate to point out an injustice, if I thought my pointing out could help fix it. There are some people who would like to use your economic circumstances to make sure that you keep your mouth shut. If they can't do that, they can parrot "SJW, SJW" in response to any legitimate concerns you have. That wouldn't stop me. But holding my livelihood over my head can stop me. Perhaps I'm a bit of a coward, but that's the way it is.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday May 15 2018, @06:35AM
And I wrote Every Engineer's Solemn Duty [warplife.com] in 2005.
Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]