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posted by martyb on Monday December 03 2018, @07:41PM   Printer-friendly
from the moah-powah dept.

Nvidia has announced its $2,500 Turing-based Titan RTX GPU. It is said to have a single precision performance of 16.3 teraflops and "tensor performance" of 130 teraflops. Double precision performance has been neutered down to 0.51 teraflops, down from 6.9 teraflops for last year's Volta-based Titan V.

The card includes 24 gigabytes of GDDR6 VRAM clocked at 14 Gbps, for a total memory bandwidth of 672 GB/s.

Drilling a bit deeper, there are really three legs to Titan RTX that sets it apart from NVIDIA's other cards, particularly the GeForce RTX 2080 Ti. Raw performance is certainly once of those; we're looking at about 15% better performance in shading, texturing, and compute, and around a 9% bump in memory bandwidth and pixel throughput.

However arguably the lynchpin to NVIDIA's true desired market of data scientists and other compute users is the tensor cores. Present on all NVIDIA's Turing cards and the heart and soul of NVIIDA's success in the AI/neural networking field, NVIDIA gave the GeForce cards a singular limitation that is none the less very important to the professional market. In their highest-precision FP16 mode, Turing is capable of accumulating at FP32 for greater precision; however on the GeForce cards this operation is limited to half-speed throughput. This limitation has been removed for the Titan RTX, and as a result it's capable of full-speed FP32 accumulation throughput on its tensor cores.

Given that NVIDIA's tensor cores have nearly a dozen modes, this may seem like an odd distinction to make between the GeForce and the Titan. However for data scientists it's quite important; FP32 accumulate is frequently necessary for neural network training – FP16 accumulate doesn't have enough precision – especially in the big money fields that will shell out for cards like the Titan and the Tesla. So this small change is a big part of the value proposition to data scientists, as NVIDIA does not offer a cheaper card with the chart-topping 130 TFLOPS of tensor performance that Titan RTX can hit.

Previously: More Extreme in Every Way: The New Titan Is Here – NVIDIA TITAN Xp
Nvidia Announces Titan V
Nvidia Announces Turing Architecture With Focus on Ray-Tracing and Lower-Precision Operations
Nvidia Announces RTX 2080 Ti, 2080, and 2070 GPUs, Claims 25x Increase in Ray-Tracing Performance
Nvidia's Turing GPU Pricing and Performance "Poorly Received"


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  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @07:54PM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @07:54PM (#769264)

    NVIDIA gimping their fp16 performance is what originally turned me against them (also the telemetry). If there was competition this card would go for half to a quarter of the price.

    And it isnt really about the hardware, it is about CUDA.

    • (Score: 2) by edIII on Monday December 03 2018, @09:34PM

      by edIII (791) on Monday December 03 2018, @09:34PM (#769295)

      The telemetry is why I use the open source drivers and not the official nvidia ones for Ubuntu.

      I wish we could create a telemetry RBL and incorporate that into our firewalls. That way, even network guests, couldn't send back telemetry.

      --
      Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
    • (Score: 2) by Hyperturtle on Tuesday December 04 2018, @04:04PM

      by Hyperturtle (2824) on Tuesday December 04 2018, @04:04PM (#769617)

      I agree, $2500 for a card is hard to justify.

      At least the telemetry can be blocked or disabled without affecting the utility of their present line-up. Everything else is what you are paying for, and it's not worth that unless the performance desired requires numerous other cards (like previous generation titans or Tis) with a topology that costs too much to justify.

      Sometimes, it is cheaper to buy the bloated card, and I think they understand their market enough that anyone willing to pay for it has done the math or isn't paying for it themselves. Or they don't care about prices, because shiny.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @07:55PM (2 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @07:55PM (#769265)
    • (Score: 3, Informative) by takyon on Tuesday December 04 2018, @01:41AM (1 child)

      by takyon (881) <takyonNO@SPAMsoylentnews.org> on Tuesday December 04 2018, @01:41AM (#769380) Journal

      130 TFLOPS is lower precision "tensor performance", not the number given by LINPACK. It's useful to machine learning users, but misleading.

      However if a technology like this [soylentnews.org] pans out, we could see 1 petaflops smartphone SoCs or maybe 1 exaflops desktop PCs.

      --
      [SIG] 10/28/2017: Soylent Upgrade v14 [soylentnews.org]
      • (Score: 2) by opinionated_science on Tuesday December 04 2018, @02:22PM

        by opinionated_science (4031) on Tuesday December 04 2018, @02:22PM (#769547)

        indeed a more appropriate label would be "Titan RTX now 510 GFlops Double precision!!!!".

        If you want a real comparison, the ASCI red machine (1997) had a peak of 1.3 Tflops (LINPACK), remained number 1 for 7 years (2 upgrades).

        That was an x86 chip and they used 9152 of them.

        two decades supercomputer to desktop.

        Let that sink in as you have your coffee....

  • (Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Monday December 03 2018, @08:29PM (4 children)

    by MichaelDavidCrawford (2339) Subscriber Badge <mdcrawford@gmail.com> on Monday December 03 2018, @08:29PM (#769275) Homepage Journal

    ... is how long it would pay for itself by mining ASIC-Resistant Crypto.

    Such resistance is typically built in to the mining algorithm by requiring more memory than is feasible to include on an ASIC chip.

    However, some intentionally ASIC-Resistant Cryptos turn out to not really be as resistant as their designers envisioned.

    Carbonizingly,

    MDC

    --
    Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
    • (Score: 3, Interesting) by RamiK on Monday December 03 2018, @09:57PM (3 children)

      by RamiK (1813) on Monday December 03 2018, @09:57PM (#769305)

      So there's this cattery owner. She loves Persians but has no huge love for the trade shows so she's not competing anymore. Keeps a male and a few females and sells the odd litter to folks in the business or even just her vet. She's registered as an NPO and operates at a loss. But she doesn't care. Profits were never the point. She just loves those cats.

      Now, why am I tell you this? Well, here's the thing: Some* miners are gamers. They're not in it for the profits. All they want is to game with the latest and greatest card and when a new one comes out, flip it off on ebay. For them, mining just cuts some costs for their hobby. If it wasn't viable, they wouldn't be able to afford fancy cards so they'd just game on lesser ones.

      So, be careful assuming people only care about "how long it would pay for itself by mining ASIC-Resistant Crypto". There some irrational consumers out there that are normally willing to buy a $600 card just for gaming and are looking at those $2500 cards thinking "how long it would return $1900". And suffice to say, with enough of those customers around the valuation of the coins can get pretty screwy...

      * https://cryptomenow.com/coinshares-released-a-19-page-report-on-bitcoin-mining-here-are-the-highlights/ [cryptomenow.com]

      --
      compiling...
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @10:36PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @10:36PM (#769321)

        >For them, mining just cuts some costs for their hobby. If it wasn't viable, they wouldn't be able to afford fancy cards so they'd just game on lesser ones.

        This can be risky. NiceHash fried something on my 1080, causing green artifacts. Between the NiceHash heist and the card it killed, I took a loss. I'm just glad it didn't kill my 1080ti.

      • (Score: 2) by MichaelDavidCrawford on Tuesday December 04 2018, @04:25AM (1 child)

        by MichaelDavidCrawford (2339) Subscriber Badge <mdcrawford@gmail.com> on Tuesday December 04 2018, @04:25AM (#769436) Homepage Journal

        The problem we've got isn't so much that prices have plummeted.

        The problem we've got is that it now costs me significantly more to pay for the electricity to mine than mining will pay in coins.

        That's a _widespread_ phenomenon; network hashrates have become smoking radioactive craters for most if not all cryptos.

        That will make the price crash even worse because what the miners are paid for is confirming transactions. Without enough network hashrate, rather than twenty minutes to confirm a transaction, I expect by now it takes a whole day for some coins. As the price continues to drop, more and more miners stop mining, the confirmations take longer and longer, leading fewer and fewer to be willing to buy because doing so takes so very long.

        When I get some money in Real Soon Now, I fully intend to buy some cryptos - but also fully expect to wait days for those transactions to clear.

        The only way for this problem to be solved is for a whole bunch of miners to hurl themselves on hand-grenades for the good of the community. In my specific case, I only have one rig. I don't expect anyone to run _all_ their rigs but I _do_ expect lots of fellow miners to run at least a few rigs apiece.

        Miners tend to be intimately familiar with why we mine; I haven't raised this issue in a public way before now, but you can be certain that this weekend or so I'll be blasting this concern throughout every corner of The Series Of Tubes.

        --
        Yes I Have No Bananas. [gofundme.com]
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 04 2018, @05:24PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 04 2018, @05:24PM (#769664)

          "but also fully expect to wait days for those transactions to clear."

          get off the cheese, man.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @10:50PM (1 child)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 03 2018, @10:50PM (#769326)

    I still am running an ET4000, how much faster would this be?

  • (Score: 2) by RamiK on Tuesday December 04 2018, @08:09PM

    by RamiK (1813) on Tuesday December 04 2018, @08:09PM (#769728)

    https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3394-rtx-2080-ti-artifacting-failure-analysis-crashing-black-screens [gamersnexus.net]

    Overheating, core dumps and, rarely, boards cracking due to mechanical stress from the fans and the heat.

    On the a more positive note, along with ebay's entries for 1070s and 1080s and their increased presence in steam's hardware survey [steampowered.com], they're probably selling better now.

    --
    compiling...
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