- decently close friends, - didn't touch them, - scritch of stubble, - middle of a room of 70 people,
I seem to always got the reaction, "YOU CAN"T DO THAT TO SOMEONE!!!!"
Your disbelief? I can't believe you can't see this. What OP is doing **IS NOT ENOUGH**.
I won't go into a meeting room with a woman if it doesn't have transparent windows. Blinds cannot be closed. Luckily, my teams and coworkers have been male, the *twice* that I've had a meeting with a female has had clear glass windows, and a short meeting. Now it's all across-the-internet - but I still don't do meetings with women, as it's simply too easy to claim "He said ..."
I won't go into a meeting room with a woman . . . Luckily, my teams and coworkers have been male . . . I still don't do meetings with women, as it's simply too easy to claim "He said ..."
Thanks goodfulness that it is simply impossible that a male could ever accuse another male of sexual harassment. Or a female could be accused of harassing a male, or OMG, another female!
It is equally or even less (or more?)[1] impossible that male harassing a male could actually happen in real life.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
[1] the equal or less or more operator might be: <=> and always returns true if and only if the left expression is less, equal or greater than the right expression.
-- The Centauri traded Earth jump gate technology in exchange for our superior hair mousse formulas.
> Thanks goodfulness that it is simply impossible that a male could ever accuse another male of sexual harassment. Or a female could be accused of harassing a male, or OMG, another female!
> It is equally or even less (or more?)[1] impossible that male harassing a male could actually happen in real life.
What you seem to not get is: men don't bitch about it. It's how men interact. Women do it to women, too. Women *DO* do it to men. Yet only women bitch about it, and only when men do it to them.
The problem is so profound that even when men *don't* do it to women, women report it regardless. And regardless whatever the man did, the woman must be cared for, must be protected - and so the man failed, no matter what.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 04, @02:24AM
(1 child)
by Anonymous Coward
on Tuesday March 04, @02:24AM (#1395153)
Also, any M --> M, F --> M or F --> F sexual harassment will be investigated carefully before any assumptions are made. Any claim of M --> F sexual harassment is automatically assumed to be true - guilty until proven innocent.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 04, @08:45AM
by Anonymous Coward
on Tuesday March 04, @08:45AM (#1395180)
The problem is with M --> F sexual harassment historically is that it was not taken seriously. It was often just dismissed or brushed under the carpet. Things changed from essentially victim blaming or accusing the female of hysteria to believing the victim. In many cases this is a useful way of approaching the situation. The problem is that there are people who will make malicious and vexatious claims of harassment against others. Mounting a robust legal defence is expensive and beyond the means of many people.
You broke the cardinal rule of never touching someone without being explicitly invited to do so.
Where I am, it is reasonably OK to touch people's hands (handshaking on greeting strangers you are bieng introduced to is normal), elbows, and (briefly) the centre of a persons back in the area from between the shoulder-blades to the small of the back. Allowable parts of the body vary by culture.
Scratching stubble against another persons face wouldn't be usual. You'd need to give adequate warning, and be invited to do so. It would still be regarded as odd.
Your boundaries were not her boundaries, and you made the mistake of not checking first. Easily done.
(Score: 2) by DrkShadow on Monday March 03, @02:34AM (7 children)
Each time I tell the story to someone,
- decently close friends,
- didn't touch them,
- scritch of stubble,
- middle of a room of 70 people,
I seem to always got the reaction, "YOU CAN"T DO THAT TO SOMEONE!!!!"
Your disbelief? I can't believe you can't see this. What OP is doing **IS NOT ENOUGH**.
I won't go into a meeting room with a woman if it doesn't have transparent windows. Blinds cannot be closed. Luckily, my teams and coworkers have been male, the *twice* that I've had a meeting with a female has had clear glass windows, and a short meeting. Now it's all across-the-internet - but I still don't do meetings with women, as it's simply too easy to claim "He said ..."
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday March 03, @03:41PM (4 children)
Thanks goodfulness that it is simply impossible that a male could ever accuse another male of sexual harassment. Or a female could be accused of harassing a male, or OMG, another female!
It is equally or even less (or more?)[1] impossible that male harassing a male could actually happen in real life.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
[1] the equal or less or more operator might be: <=> and always returns true if and only if the left expression is less, equal or greater than the right expression.
The Centauri traded Earth jump gate technology in exchange for our superior hair mousse formulas.
(Score: 2) by DrkShadow on Monday March 03, @09:19PM
> Thanks goodfulness that it is simply impossible that a male could ever accuse another male of sexual harassment. Or a female could be accused of harassing a male, or OMG, another female!
Indeed.
(Score: 2, Flamebait) by DrkShadow on Monday March 03, @09:23PM (2 children)
> It is equally or even less (or more?)[1] impossible that male harassing a male could actually happen in real life.
What you seem to not get is: men don't bitch about it. It's how men interact. Women do it to women, too. Women *DO* do it to men. Yet only women bitch about it, and only when men do it to them.
The problem is so profound that even when men *don't* do it to women, women report it regardless. And regardless whatever the man did, the woman must be cared for, must be protected - and so the man failed, no matter what.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 04, @02:24AM (1 child)
Also, any M --> M, F --> M or F --> F sexual harassment will be investigated carefully before any assumptions are made. Any claim of M --> F sexual harassment is automatically assumed to be true - guilty until proven innocent.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 04, @08:45AM
The problem is with M --> F sexual harassment historically is that it was not taken seriously. It was often just dismissed or brushed under the carpet. Things changed from essentially victim blaming or accusing the female of hysteria to believing the victim. In many cases this is a useful way of approaching the situation. The problem is that there are people who will make malicious and vexatious claims of harassment against others. Mounting a robust legal defence is expensive and beyond the means of many people.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by pTamok on Tuesday March 04, @02:39PM
You broke the cardinal rule of never touching someone without being explicitly invited to do so.
Where I am, it is reasonably OK to touch people's hands (handshaking on greeting strangers you are bieng introduced to is normal), elbows, and (briefly) the centre of a persons back in the area from between the shoulder-blades to the small of the back. Allowable parts of the body vary by culture.
Scratching stubble against another persons face wouldn't be usual. You'd need to give adequate warning, and be invited to do so. It would still be regarded as odd.
Your boundaries were not her boundaries, and you made the mistake of not checking first. Easily done.