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Would you buy a robotic car? (Self driving)
| 31% | 66 votes |
| 6% | 14 votes |
| 17% | 37 votes |
| 32% | 67 votes |
| 7% | 15 votes |
| 3% | 8 votes |
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- Don't complain about lack of options. You've got to pick a few when you do multiple choice. Those are the breaks.
- Feel free to suggest poll ideas if you're feeling creative. I'd strongly suggest reading the past polls first.
- This whole thing is wildly inaccurate. Rounding errors, ballot stuffers, dynamic IPs, firewalls. If you're using these numbers to do anything important, you're insane.
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Would you buy a robotic car? (Self driving)
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There are more things in heaven and earth,
Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
-- Wm. Shakespeare, "Hamlet"
(Score: 2) by yellowantphil on Tuesday July 08 2014, @02:38PM
I would buy one if the robot's driving record shows that it is statistically a better driver than I am. There could be edge cases where I can drive better any robot, but if the robot is better than I am at common scenarios, I should be safer overall, and wouldn't have to drive anymore.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Runaway1956 on Tuesday July 08 2014, @05:29PM
Don't know, don't really care if a robot can drive better than I can. I doubt it very much, but it really doesn't matter. I ride a motorcycle. I commute 100 miles almost every work day, perched on a seat held upright by four powerful gyroscopes. Is it safe? Ehhh - life isn't safe. Name someone who got out of this life alive - go ahead. I intend to ENJOY life, rather than just exist. No seat belt, no air bag, no crumple zone, no stupid computer deciding how fast I should go, or how far I should lean, or whether I have room to zip between two cars.
Being up on two beats anything the computer offers.
ICE is having a Pretti Good season.
(Score: 1) by Bob The Cowboy on Thursday July 10 2014, @03:36AM
Thank you for making that decision for the people in those two cars. By the way, you've just demonstrated a solid argument for driverless cars.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday July 10 2014, @04:12PM
The people in the cars have 3000 (or more) pounds of steel, aluminum, glass, plastic and tin to armor them from me and my mistakes. And, that contributes to their apparent stupidity - they feel secure in their tight little cages.
Come out and enjoy life for a change.
ICE is having a Pretti Good season.
(Score: 2) by Nerdfest on Thursday July 10 2014, @04:50AM
I ride a motorcycle as well, and I'd feel a lot safer if the cars were computer controlled. For non-motorcycle travel, I'd love to have AI do it for me in most cases, as the way most people drive aggravates me to no end. Slower is not always safer. Signal before you turn, not while you're turning. If you want smooth traffic flow, stop following too close and tapping your brakes. Put down your damn cell phone. Really, it would save me a lot of stress, and probably improve traffic conditions in a big way.
(Score: 2) by GreatAuntAnesthesia on Thursday July 10 2014, @09:42AM
> I intend to ENJOY life, rather than just exist.
So do I. That's why I don't want to spend my final decades drooling into a bib.
My brother used to work in a spinal ward. The vast majority of his patients were young men who had come off their motorbikes. He has stories to put anyone off motorbikes forever.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 08 2014, @04:13PM
My conditions:
1. Safe enough (100% safety is not possible, but if it is at least as safe as when I drive myself, I'd be silly on insisting to drive myself for safety reasons).
2. Not too expensive.
3. The car (respectively the maker) has to respect my privacy (that is, probably no Google car).
4. Can be used standalone (that is, you don't need your phone to control the car; especially if it has to be a phone running a specific operating system, rather than just any phone out there — again, this would probably rule out Google's car).
5. Nothing else that annoys me about that car (it is impossible to give a complete list here).
(Score: 2) by Alfred on Tuesday July 08 2014, @05:39PM
The other night I accidentally left my phone and my car keys in the car. The house was unlocked so I forgot about them. In the morning I realized what I had done and panicked. I ran outside and there was the car, under the watchful eye of the phone, with not even a scratch. Relieved, I told the phone that it was earning my trust and to keep up the good work.
So far my phone has a 100% safe record, so far.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Tuesday July 08 2014, @09:44PM
Safety won't even be an issue; they'll be at least ten times safer than human drivers. Price will be a big deal for me, since I look for the cars with the lowest cost of ownership, though maybe increased efficiency and more usable time would make it worthwhile. I expect privacy will be practically nonexistent if it has anything to do with a major manufacturer. I wouldn't be comfortable unless there were a hard override and mechanical backup controls. Drive by wire and software control means total hackability.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 2) by Sir Garlon on Thursday July 10 2014, @04:00PM
Under certain conditions like avoiding a rear-end collision with the car in front or staying on a slippery road, I agree. There are many kinds of accidents, though. The hazards in city traffic are a lot more complicated than on the highway. A self-driving car is not safer overall if it can't handle construction flagman or if it stops too suddenly for a jaywalker (and gets rear-ended by the human behind it). Those scenarios I just came up with have a low risk of death, but high risk of injury.
[Sir Garlon] is the marvellest knight that is now living, for he destroyeth many good knights, for he goeth invisible.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Friday July 11 2014, @04:42AM
They're already testing those kinds of scenarios. Since the car can be looking in all directions at all times, won't get distracted, and can have thousands of scenario solutions worked out ahead of time, I really do think the car will do better than a human more than 99% of the time within five years.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 2) by GlennC on Wednesday July 09 2014, @06:09PM
My top three concerns, in no particular order...
1. Price
2. Autonomy (as was mentioned above, I don't want to have to have a particular phone, or even A phone, to use it.)
3. Respect for my personal privacy.
Sorry folks...the world is bigger and more varied than you want it to be. Deal with it.
(Score: 1) by acid andy on Tuesday July 08 2014, @05:10PM
I'd do it on the condition that I can intervene and regain full control of the vehicle at any point. So the prying the steering wheel option kinda also applies.
"rancid randy has a dialogue with herself[...] Somebody help him!" -- Anonymous Coward.
(Score: 2) by gman003 on Tuesday July 08 2014, @07:10PM
Seconded.
I want two big slap buttons on the dash. One immediately disengages any automation - even cruise control. The other immediately disengages all automation AND slams on the brakes for an emergency stop (put the car into neutral as well, to fix those runaway cars from a while back).
Do that, and I don't care what automation you put on there. If it's good, I'll use it - if it's bad, I'll override it.
(Score: 2) by DECbot on Tuesday July 08 2014, @09:29PM
I also voted for prying the steering wheel option, but I intend to become the robot.
cats~$ sudo chown -R us /home/base
(Score: 2) by nitehawk214 on Wednesday July 09 2014, @06:27PM
How about one of those placebo steering wheels like little kids have?
"Don't you ever miss the days when you used to be nostalgic?" -Loiosh
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday July 10 2014, @06:39AM
Please remit 59.95 to my email. I will never get the Dr Pepper cleaned out of my keyboard.
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 1) by idetuxs on Friday July 11 2014, @02:51AM
(Score: 3, Interesting) by PinkyGigglebrain on Tuesday July 08 2014, @06:09PM
I have a 1978 Ford that I have been taking care of since my family purchased it off the show room floor. I learned to drive in it, was given it on my 18th birthday and the joke in the family now is I will be buried in it someday. The only thing "automatic" is the transmission.
A robotic car has it's place, put it has been shown that while the technology in cars has made them safer it has also made people worse drivers because they rely too much on the tech to keep them out of trouble. A person who learned how to drive with a car that checks your blind spots for you, applies brakes if you get too close to the car in front, and parks itself tend to leave too much to the car. Put that person in a car without the auto braking and they will end up rear ending someone because they followed too close and didn't have the reflexes to hit the brakes in time.
"Beware those who would deny you Knowledge, For in their hearts they dream themselves your Master."
(Score: 2) by migz on Wednesday July 09 2014, @10:54AM
Ahh, but this doesn't reduce risk and keep the human driver who becomes more careless, it eliminates the driver. How many people will even bother to learn how to drive if they can get around without bothering. You would be surprised how many kids these days cant drive stick.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 09 2014, @02:43PM
Come on man! No model given? Is it that embarrassing? Come on now, is it a Pinto ;-)
(Score: 1) by Buck Feta on Wednesday July 09 2014, @04:06PM
Admit it's a Pinto at the risk of getting flamed.
- fractious political commentary goes here -
(Score: 2) by aristarchus on Thursday July 10 2014, @08:55AM
Here is a place where "literally!" would be appropriate.
(Score: 2) by dublet on Wednesday July 09 2014, @03:42PM
Living around a congested city (London), I would happily have a self driving car for my tedious journeys. I'd want to keep my toy car though (1995 Toyota Celica GT-four) that's 100% manual.
"If anyone needs me, I'm in the angry dome. [dublet.org]"
(Score: 2) by lhsi on Tuesday July 08 2014, @06:13PM
I think for it to be nearer 100% safe, you'd have to remove all human drivers from the roads and ensure the robot cars can communicate. Considering how poorly some humans drive, I don't see it as a bad thing.
(Score: 2) by redneckmother on Tuesday July 08 2014, @07:05PM
While I am firmly in the "cold, dead hands" camp, if there were no "gotta get there, go, go, go" drivers during rush hour, the inevitable "wave motion effect" might be cancelled and traffic might flow smoothly.
Mas cerveza por favor.
(Score: 2) by e_armadillo on Tuesday July 08 2014, @07:50PM
I don't want to let go of my steering wheel, but do recognize there are many who should.
"How are we gonna get out of here?" ... "We'll dig our way out!" ... "No, no, dig UP stupid!"
(Score: 2) by lhsi on Tuesday July 08 2014, @08:48PM
I heard of a survey recently (I think in the UK ) where a lot of current drivers wouldn't be able to pass the test if they had to retake it due to bad habits gained. No idea how accurate it is as I can't remember where it was from.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday July 08 2014, @06:14PM
You'll rent time in it. The price will depend on the type of car you rent, which days and times of the day you want to use it at, the delay to get to your house, and maybe some other factors, like how often it's cleaned. This will be a cross between a taxi cab and a lease. Since the car can drive itself, it doesn't have to sit in the parking lot of your work for 8 hours - it could ferry others and come back for you at the end of the day. Or another car that's closer could pick you up. There will be peak times (rush hour) so the amount of cars on the road won't be drastically different. I'm guessing some people will still choose to own a self-driving car for the convenience of having it always available. Then again, they may link it to their Uber account and earn a couple of extra bucks while they sleep. The future will be glorious.
(Score: 1) by maxim on Wednesday July 09 2014, @12:11AM
I don't own yet any car, but when I make it home from work, in a bus,
I really thankful that I don't need to drive, as I am so tried from fighting that loosing battle with bugs.
So to have a car to drive me in such situations, yep why not.
But I no way want a car I can't not control myself if I want to, this is ridiculous.
(Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday July 09 2014, @01:59AM
After all, just like with online voting, if we let the computers drive the cars, the cars will go where the hackers want to take us!
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 09 2014, @03:02AM
Off a cliff?
Into a wall?
In front of a train?
Hmmm so many options!
(Score: 2) by mendax on Wednesday July 09 2014, @03:34AM
It depends on who is in the car. If it's members of Congress I think any of those options are appropriate. Of course, it would only be killing their bodies; their brains are already dead and their souls have already been sold to Satan... or the Koch brothers.
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 2) by edIII on Thursday July 10 2014, @01:54AM
This is my objection. Hackers.
It's like that movie Minority Report. Tom Cruise is actually the good guy with people after him, the bad guy is the Elite 1% justifying the deaths of some, and the miscarriages of justice as "grease on the wheels" for society. Tom Cruise was just a good guy keeping society safe until it turned out he was more dangerous to society once in possession of a truth. This truth is something any of us can come into possession of at any time really.
Software is NOT some nebulous *thing*. It's programming. Who is doing the programming? Who can intervene? How secure is it?
Aside from the fact that it's an absolute total loss of anonymity with governments and Google now performing analysis on where you go, who you *might* be seeing, and how to more effectively market to you, it's a loss of *freedom*.
Call me crazy, but I really like the fact I can still get in my car (no OnStar or equivalent) and just drive to where ever the hell I want and talk to whoever I want without a computer recording my every move and able to intervene to take me to the nearest re-education camp because I dared to post something disruptive to the social "experience" we are having now.
So, yeah. Shut up and take my money from the geek side of me that believes a Utopia is possible if we kill all the assholes at the same time. Take my steering wheel out of my cold dead hands from the pragmatic side of me that understands how government and corporations will abuse it.
Technically, lunchtime is at any moment. It's just a wave function.
(Score: 1) by Crosscompiler on Wednesday July 09 2014, @12:55PM
Good ideas, like seat belts, radial tires and disc brakes took decades to show up (and even decades longer to appear in the US).
Add-ons for unskilled idiots, like automatic transmissions, power steering and power brakes cut to the front of the line, and I suspect robot SUVs are unstoppable, particularly in the US.
(Score: 1) by gallondr00nk on Wednesday July 09 2014, @11:01PM
Brake servos are for idiots? That's some top class trolling there, sir. Kudos to you.
A missing option in the poll isn't whether I'd like one, but how much I'd like other people to own one. Judging by the behaviour I see, I'd say there's a fair proportion of people really don't enjoy or can't master driving a car. To get them into something that safely and harmlessly transports them around sounds vaguely utopian to me. For the rest of us, it'll mean an altogether less frustrating driving experience.
I'll get one when they're in $1000 beater territory. I hope all the inattentive 4x4/SUV drivers who can't fathom how to use an indicator or stay within the lanes get one immediately.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 09 2014, @02:18PM
You guys stole my post from a few weeks ago! http://soylentnews.org/comments.pl?sid=2612&cid=61372 [soylentnews.org]
Nah, just kidding. I am glad to see my post turned into a poll.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday July 09 2014, @08:35PM
Indeed I did, I could always use more suggestions, too.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Wednesday July 09 2014, @04:29PM
I am torn between the two. On one hand, driving can be a fun and enjoyable experience. Especially on long road trips. But daily commutes suck. I hate commuting. Hate it.
But one thing that I just thought of that could be a problem: Many people who want self driving cars advocate them because they will remove impaired drivers. Impairment can be from medication, lack of sleep, stress, sickness, drugs, alcohol etc. So we send the drunks home in their robotic cars. But, what if they get sick or die en route? Eg person lies down in back seat on back and chokes on vomit. Or what if a diabetic slips into a diabetic coma, old person has a heart attack, etc. The car in essence is completely stupid. It's just a bunch of algorithms navigating a vehicle from point A to point B without hitting anything. Imagine a car rolling up to a destination, parks itself but the driver is in need of emergency medical help or has died en route. Who would know?
It might sound a bit alarmist but it would be helpful if robot cars have some sort of alarm or remote monitoring to ensure the occupants are healthy. I imagine it would be along the lines of onstar, you can call for help yourself, eg "I think I am having a heart attack" and your car can reroute to the nearest hospital or clinic. Or perhaps it can pull over and wait for an ambulance while the cars lights flash in a pattern for emergency crews to recognize while transmitting GPS coordinates to an emergency service. If a car arrives at its destination and no doors open a timer should start once the car is parked. After 10 seconds an audible tone will play for X seconds to alert any sleeping occupants that the car has arrived. But if no attempt to acknowledge the alarm or the doors are not opened then an emergency beacon can be signalled indicating something is wrong with the driver. That can flash the lights, beep the horn, and/or call emergency services.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Leebert on Thursday July 10 2014, @01:31AM
How is that different than someone like me who lives alone? And explain to me why it's a problem that someone who has a heart attack won't let others know it by losing control of their vehicle and smashing into other objects?
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday July 10 2014, @06:30AM
" But if no attempt to acknowledge the alarm or the doors are not opened then an emergency beacon can be signalled indicating something is wrong with the driver. That can flash the lights, beep the horn, and/or call emergency services."
It is going to have to be pretty sophisticated, EMS services will quickly grow unhappy responding to calls for people dead drunk in the back seat that aren't in any real danger. (I realize drowning in vomit or alcohol poisoning could be occurring, but I would wager the majority will just be drunk and sleeping it off)
As far as people dieing en route, well, it happens, and at least with an autonomous vehicle there won't be a crash. Perhaps the ability to do an On Star link to those emergency necklaces for the elderly. If they last long enough to push it, there is no reason the car could not be put into an emergency mode, lights flashing, horn blaring, even a speaker announcing to clear the way, while signaling other autonomous vehicles to give way while it rushes you to the hospital or meets up with EMS halfway. This could be a real lifesaver. Heck, no reason it can't be given EMS access to the signal system to green light the trip.
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by Aiwendil on Wednesday July 09 2014, @08:28PM
I don't drive yet but in lot of the cases when I end up in a car with someone it is to go to places where there are no roads, or that are restricted to the public, or require careful interaction with heavier equipment that is passing by, or places that are strictly directed by a human outside of the car (ie, boarding a ferry with the car)
So a steering wheel to be able to override/take control is a must.
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday July 10 2014, @06:50AM
As a driver trainer, I wish all of my students started out with this type of experience. Build upon that, please!
I teach Semi Trucks, too many four wheelers do not realize the dangers represented by 80,000 lbs of equipment rolling down the freeway.
You sir, have a large head start.
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by Aiwendil on Friday July 11 2014, @09:45AM
Thanks, even tough that actually is how I will request to start my drivers-ed (for the reasons you stated, and also because the very notion of controlling a machine weighing a few tonnes - quite frankly - scares me) when it starts it seems I failed with my implications in my original message.
My field of employment includes working with infrastructure, so often I end up at places where it can't be any roads, and often need to cross places that are offlimits, behind perimiters and also at times would be insane to visit (for instance; a while ago visited a place where they were currently blasting to build a bridgehead, just a few weeks earlier the very spot I visited was a few meters higher up, and also covered with trees).
(Score: 2) by Pslytely Psycho on Thursday July 10 2014, @06:09AM
...are going to take delight in deliberately fucking with autonomous vehicles, cut them off, tailgate, drive slowly in front.
But aside from douche bags, If autonomous vehicles catch on with those who don't like to drive or drive poorly, it would still be a win safety wise. I teach driver safety and try to live by my words to my students. Getting easily distracted drivers and drivers that are unable to acquire competence behind the wheel out of the control loop would make it safer for all.
Some people really do not belong behind the wheel.
As long as the A.I. drives better than GTA V anyway.
Alex Jones lawyer inspires new TV series: CSI Moron Division.
(Score: 2) by LoRdTAW on Thursday July 10 2014, @02:35PM
A certain subset of drivers are going to take delight in deliberately fucking with autonomous vehicles, cut them off, tailgate, drive slowly in front.
What's funny is this could certainly happen. The protesters would be drivers whose livelihood is threatened by the autonomous cars. Drivers of Taxis and limos would be the most threatened. Then once autonomous trucks hit the road, the truck drivers. What a shit storm that will be, stock up on popcorn.
Here is a story of how bad things can get. It takes place during the early days of the truck (lorry). The Teamsters were horse carriage drivers back then and they saw trucks as a threat to their profession. One trick they used was to back their carriages into the front of a truck which would damage the relatively unprotected radiator (in those days even doors were an afterthought). Mack trucks saw this problem and actually moved the radiator behind the engine in the A series trucks. Search for Mack AC or Mack AK. You will see that on each side of the hood just in front of the cab are the radiator openings. This was when Mack was based out of New York City, the union stronghold of the nation.
(Score: 2) by clone141166 on Thursday July 10 2014, @08:48AM
Yes, if these conditions were met...
#1: Open source code base; all code used to control/drive the car should be available, viewable AND modifiable by users and independent third parties. Really you are NOT just putting your life in the hands of a computer, you are putting your life in the hands of a group of overworked, underpaid office programmers... I for one want to be able to check the code they write.
#2: Ability to override the AI at any point and obtain manual control of the car. Technology breaks; it always has and it always will. Having redundancies and being able to bypass broken systems is crucial, especially in a situation as dangerous as road travel at high speeds. Being able to bypass the AI driver if it breaks and take manual control of the vehicle is a feature that would probably save lives.
#3: Absolutely no wireless networks connected to it of any shape, form or variety at all, ever. The control systems should be *completely* isolated from all utility systems like MP3/CD players and other junk. Anything with software is susceptible to malicious modification; it should be impossible to modify the code in the car without physical access to the *INSIDE* of the vehicle.
(Score: 1) by Solaarius on Friday July 11 2014, @05:10AM
1. Agreed.
2. Maybe. If they are interacting on public roads, there should either be manual control, or a "pull over and stop" emergency button. In a more distant future where there are dedicated guideways for autonomous vehicles ONLY (no manual cars, bikes or pedestrians), this becomes less necessary.
3. Hrm, agree and disagree. Yes to air gaps (so to speak) between control systems and user amenities. But control systems that are situationally aware via wireless connectivity to other vehicles and to public information/control networks seems like a pre-requisite...