Slash Boxes

SoylentNews is people

posted by janrinok on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:34PM   Printer-friendly
from the not-supported-probably-means-not-tested dept.

Apparently a bug in a Microsoft Security Essentials update caused XP computers to bluescreen. After rebooting once updates were installed the XP machines would bluescreen with "MsMpEng.exe application error".

Microsoft has fixed the error by releasing a definitions update for Security Essentials. From the article:

Many point-of-sale systems, which some businesses are protecting using Microsoft Security Essentials (MSE) as a way to meet the antivirus requirement of the Payment Card Industry PCI), still use Windows XP or related operating systems, including Windows XP Professional for Embedded Systems and Windows Embedded POSReady 2009. Those systems were affected by the update as well, according to one New England value-added reseller with more than 500 clients in the hospitality industry.

While Microsoft corrected the issue within days, the bug crashed at least hundreds of machines. For the New England firm, the issue affected more than 250 machines at 50 customers who relied on the systems, a consultant at the company said on condition of anonymity. "This affected about one half of our customers running Windows XP," he told eWEEK. "This brought their business to a 100 percent standstill until we could resolve the situation. In a pinch, the only solution we could determine was to uninstall MS Essentials to get them running their business again."

While uninstalling Microsoft Security Essentials worked around the issue, it also caused an additional problem: Even though Microsoft later fixed the update, MSE could not be reinstalled on Windows XP computers because the systems are no longer supported by Microsoft, the source said.

This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.
Display Options Threshold/Breakthrough Mark All as Read Mark All as Unread
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
  • (Score: 1) by Iskender on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:42PM

    by Iskender (470) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:42PM (#37873)

    This new feature means Windows Embedded 2009 is now indeed POSReady! It took some time, although many thought XP was already a POS by default. But now things are finished - it's a perfect POS!

    • (Score: 2) by kaszz on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:07PM

      by kaszz (4211) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:07PM (#37889) Journal

      What do you mean with "POS" ..?

      Point Of Sale?

    • (Score: 2) by d on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:42PM

      by d (523) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:42PM (#37903)

      I personally read that as "piece of shit".

  • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:48PM

    by Grishnakh (2831) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:48PM (#37878)

    MS should have just refused to fix this problem, and told customers to upgrade to a newer version of Windows.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:14PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:14PM (#37895)
      Upgrade to new windows? What? This windows shit is busted. Look at it. Busted. I had it for 10 years and now it don't work anymore.
      Fuck windows. it's busted.

      lets try out that linux thing i heard about. or what about we just buy an apple and forget about it.

      [i]And thats why microsoft won't say that.[/i]
      • (Score: 1) by darnkitten on Tuesday April 29 2014, @11:39PM

        by darnkitten (1912) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @11:39PM (#37921)

        Or MS realized that allowing a piece of MS software to cripple a MS operating system would appear as an intentional act of sabotage, and would ensure that customers started looking for alternatives.

        • (Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:47AM

          by Grishnakh (2831) on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:47AM (#37936)

          That's exactly my hope. It's too bad monkey-boy isn't still running the place, because he might just have done what I suggested.

    • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Hairyfeet on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:44AM

      by Hairyfeet (75) <reversethis-{moc ... {8691tsaebssab}> on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:44AM (#37935) Journal

      What I can't believe is they were using MSE on something mission critical. As someone who works out in the trenches? MSE is...well its not for anybody who might actually get exposed to anything honestly. For those that do not know MSE was Giant AntiSpy and its obvious that is really ALL that it is. In fact it kinda reminds me of ClamAV in that its really only good for scanning downloaded files....that's it, that is really all it does. I have yet to see a single page be blocked by MSE because it has malware, I haven't seen it actually stop a single drive by, it just don't do much really and it certainly isn't gonna stop shit on "hey lets run everything as admin!" XP.

      For anybody that is still running XP? If your system is 8 years old or less you should be able to run Win 7 no problem, I have run Win 7 on a socket 754 Sempron with 1.2GB of RAM and it ran fine and an 8 year old system will have a first gen Athlon X2 or Pentium D and those have no trouble running win 7. The most I've had to do when upgrading an old system to Win 7 is a first gen C2D that had a funky old ATI IGP that was kinda flaky, an $8 HD2400 fixed it no prob, its now my landlord's PC and he is using it daily with his stock trading and it just purrs.

      But if for some reason you HAVE to stay on XP? be it a piece of hardware or software you have to have that just will not run in a VM (please don't say cost because as a member of the Internet frankly I'd rather have you pirate Win 7 than stay with XP, zombie XP boxes slow down the net and make it worse for all of us) or some flaky piece of hardware in your box you just can't replace? then for the love of all that is good DO NOT USE MSE TO PROTECT YOUR SYSTEM as it isn't for systems where there would be any real threats. And this is coming from someone who uses MSE on his gaming PC but since it is only for transcoding and gaming its not at risk, MSE is really only good at scanning downloaded files. If you are gonna stay on XP Please use Comodo internet Security or Avast Free as both of these are VERY VERY GOOD at stopping malware and are 100% FREE.

      Comodo IS is more friendly to tweaking, although its defaults are good, and its got excellent sandboxing by default and even a pretty good HIPS but as with most HIPS you'll have to train it for a week or so. as a KILLER bonus it has a Silverlight based "virtual desktop" that lets you surf, watch videos, it even comes with eBook Reader and Angry Birds but everything in the VD is in a locked down sandbox so if you want to not have to worry about some iffy site, or have relatives that comes over and fuck up your spare PC? this solves that problem. Avast is just as good when it comes to stopping bugs but its much simpler as far as layout, its the kind of AV you can give your mom and not get bothered by her calling 50 times a day to say "what does this mean?". Its very much a "slap on and never care" kind of AV and while not as deep as something like Comodo sometimes you realy don't need deep or feature rich, you need simple and easy and Avast Free fits.

      So please, pretty please from the guy that has to clean the damned things every day DO NOT USE MSE ON AT RISK PCs!! Its just not good for stopping the kinds of zero days and drive bys the PCs of today face. get Avast, get Comodo, won't cost you a cent and if you are gonna stay on XP the least you can do is minimize the risk, mmkay? And if you are having trouble moving an XP PC to 7 feel free to ask and I'l try to find you a driver or like that $8 HD2400 find a really cheap replacement part that will be better than what you had. Oh and since graphics drivers are the most likely stickler here ya go, an HD5450 for $13 after MIR [] and it works great on Win 7.

      ACs are never seen so don't bother. Always ready to show SJWs for the racists they are.
      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @03:24PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @03:24PM (#38145)

        But Windows 7 sucks. It removed a ton of features from Windows XP (for example, the ability to change file extensions and file types, previously under "Folder Options").

        If you want to upgrade your Windows XP operating system, and you want an actual UPgrade, try Debian.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by crutchy on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:50PM

    by crutchy (179) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @09:50PM (#37880) Homepage Journal dept.

    i didn't realize microsoft had one.

    • (Score: 2) by kaszz on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:09PM

      by kaszz (4211) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:09PM (#37891) Journal

      How can we exploit this? :-v

    • (Score: 1) by meisterister on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:44PM

      by meisterister (949) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:44PM (#37904) Journal

      What? How did you not notice it when Windows 8 was released?

      (May or may not have been) Posted from my K6-2, Athlon XP, or Pentium I/II/III.
      • (Score: 2, Informative) by darnkitten on Tuesday April 29 2014, @11:47PM

        by darnkitten (1912) on Tuesday April 29 2014, @11:47PM (#37924)

        Too bloody right. Even in my small rural town, we've people exploring Linux (mostly Mint, some Ubuntu) 'cause they HATE Win8.

        ...of course, it helps that I have liveDisks and LiveKeys on hand at the Library and can walk them through the install process once they've tested the distro.

      • (Score: 4, Funny) by Grishnakh on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:50AM

        by Grishnakh (2831) on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:50AM (#37937)

        Some folks in the Linux camp have been desperately working to prevent people from migrating from Windows to Linux; the most prominent are called "Gnome developers".

        The only hope is to make sure anyone looking at alternatives looks at KDE, MATE, Cinnamon, and XCFE.

      • (Score: 2) by mcgrew on Wednesday April 30 2014, @01:52AM

        by mcgrew (701) <> on Wednesday April 30 2014, @01:52AM (#37949) Homepage Journal

        Damn it, now my nose burns from the beer I snotted out!

        Carbon, The only element in the known universe to ever gain sentience
  • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:20PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday April 29 2014, @10:20PM (#37898)

    There were two updates, one on the engine, the other the virus definition.

    The engine update didn't cause a "problem", but stayed annoying red, reminding me that XP has been eol'ed, and likely will be borked.

    The virus definition update caused the problem, although in my case, it simply jammed up the system rather than bluescreening it - eventually you gain cursor and explorer become semi-responsive.

    My fix was to uninstall MSE, install the earlier version of MSE (4.4.304.0 - I managed to pull it off somewhere on the internet), and upon installation, virus definition update pulled a later, nonbuggy definition, and it's all good for now. MS stated that they'll continue to update the virus definition (for Windows XP) till June sometime.

    • (Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:10AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @12:10AM (#37929)

      The virus definition update
      My OS doesn't know about that stuff.
      Can you briefly describe what it is and why I should have that?

      uninstall MSE, install the earlier version
      So, when he has a completely unusable Windoze install, Joe Average goes to a forum where someone with tech know-how tells him how to fix that.
      He simply uses his boot-to-a-usable-desktop media to get online and...
      Oh, wait. I think I see a problem.

      -- gewg_

      • (Score: 2) by Hairyfeet on Wednesday April 30 2014, @04:07AM

        by Hairyfeet (75) <reversethis-{moc ... {8691tsaebssab}> on Wednesday April 30 2014, @04:07AM (#37975) Journal

        NOW do you see why we need a block AC button? Because just like on slash you'll have fanboys that will mod up any AC trollbiat that uses words like "Windoze" and "Lunix".

        Now if YOU wanna have AC trolls crapping all over your pages? Fine and dandy but I personally don't care if an AC craps out a post that makes LOTR look like a fanfic, because if they ain't got the stones to stand behind their words I REALLY don't want to hear it.

        ACs are never seen so don't bother. Always ready to show SJWs for the racists they are.
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @05:59PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @05:59PM (#38197)

          will mod up any AC [trollbait]
          All done with your ad hominem tantrum now?
          Ready to address the actual issues?

          My OS has rectangular frames on its screen, but mine isn't EULAware.
          M$ didn't invent windows; they just had the gall to apply for a trademark on a common word.[1]
          If M$ didn't want people constantly poking fun at what they call their products, they should have chosen less generic names.
          Even back in 1986, Big Pharma had lots of examples of how to do that: Motrin, Tylenol, Advil.
          M$ is the object of ridicule because it has less imagination than a 2 year old.

          On top of non-searchable names, there's the OS that in 1995 shipped without a web browser and there's M$'s getting into the search engine business a decade late.
          Gates' silly book "The Road Ahead" completely missed the elephant in the room.
          He went back later and added a chapter on the Internet.

          Executable files that have no OFF switch such that they are always executable by everyone under the Sun was a really, really dumb design choice.
          Again, even in 1986, everyone else had this figured out.
          Only MICROS~1 requires something as monumentally stupid as "anti-virus".

          Now, how do YOU suggest that a Windoze user get access to help when his system is borked beyond use--knowing that M$ doesn't supply him with bootable media that gives him a usable stop-gap system?
          Oh, that's right. He should call you and pony up some more bucks.
          No, thanks. You can keep your EULAware.
          The idea of hitting myself in the head with a hammer because it feels so good when I stop doesn't appeal to me.

          if they ain't got the stones to stand behind their words
          You picked a really bad example to use to vent your spleen.
          I sign every one of my posts.

          ...and it's odd how you don't seem to ever have a problem with YOUR OWN willingness to point out shortcomings in software.

          [1] The acceptance of that application is yet another prime example of how broken the notion of "intellectual property" is.

          -- gewg_

          • (Score: 2) by Hairyfeet on Thursday May 01 2014, @08:13AM

            by Hairyfeet (75) <reversethis-{moc ... {8691tsaebssab}> on Thursday May 01 2014, @08:13AM (#38406) Journal

            Which part of "AC trolls please DIAF" did you not understand? I don't give a rat's as WHAT your problems are, the second you start writing "Windoze" and "M$" I know you are a retarded FOSSie who spend their time jerking off to a Bash prompt.

            But if you didn't have cliches and your pathetic attempts at insults why then you might have to have an independent thought [] and realize what everybody knows [] that even when MSFT put out a universally reviled OS you STILL got curb stomped [], does that give you ANY clues? or all they all brainwashed by those black choppers that have been following you? Hell when the Chinese were given the choice of your "free OS" or pirating Windows they chose the latter [] even if it meant staying on XP and using IE fricking 6, LOL! Does that ring ANY bells? A smart person would say "what are we doing wrong the other guy is doing right?" but a FOSSie who is just like a Moonie in that they blindly follow, instead says "Its all a conspiracy! They are all shills keeping the masses from true salvation!" and then you wonder why we all laugh at you [] because you DON'T Listen, you DON'T learn, and Torvalds could take a big steaming dump and hand it to you and you'd thank him for his generous gift.

            ACs are never seen so don't bother. Always ready to show SJWs for the racists they are.
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 03 2014, @08:17AM

              by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 03 2014, @08:17AM (#39189)

              the second you start writing "Windoze"
              The few times that I write "windows", I'm talking about multiple frames on my screen.
              I don't advertise for a company that can't even come up with a unique name.
              Someone doing a web search will not find anything in what I write that will be useful concerning how to further/better use what I consider an inferior OS.
              For folks who are looking to reinforce their own reasons to switch away, what I write may be useful; they will likely use my spelling in their search.
              It's perfectly logical.

              and "M$"
              The moment that I see M$ do something that is clearly austerity WRT their end users, I will stop that.
              After 4 decades of practices, I won't be holding my breath waiting for the bloodsuckers to go that route.
              The way I render their name (MSFT, MICROS~1, M$) indicates whether I'm talking about their declining stock price, their 4th-rate technology, or their mercenary business model.
              Again, perfectly logical.

              ...and, man, I really hate the way the idiots at Wired can't keep a goddamned URL valid for 2 fucking weeks in a row.
              After the fork, LibreOffice is doing great and (relicensed) OOo is only alive due to its name and inertia (Hmmm. That sounds familiar)--all the devs bolted, so that dude's point about non-GPL licenses has at least 1 giant data point against it.)

              curb stomped
              You know and I know that when people go to the high street, they buy what they find there.
              Gutless whitebox builders still stuck in 1989, combined with M$ volume discounts tilt the table before Joe Consumer even arrives.
              If Joe was given an a la carte list, that $0 next to Linux would look really good to him.
              ...and so on. []
              Now, vendors like you would take it in the slats, not being able to sell extra junk like "anti-virus".

              Walmart sold 10,000 Linux boxes in 48 hours in 2007. []
              People walked right past the identical hardware with Windoze installed.
              The only reason they didn't sell MORE Linux boxes is that they ran slam out.
              ...and when the Linux boxes were gone, the customers did NOT start scooping up the Windoze boxes.

              What happened after that? Nobody not inside that loop knows for sure.
              (Likely: M$ lawyers; a previous exclusivity agreement with M$; NDAs.)

              Oh, and most folks these days want small and cheap.
              Among handsets, the last numbers I saw said 83 percent of folks bought something with a GPL core--with that share still growing; M$'s junk? Under 4 percent and falling.
              (When given an actual choice, very few want the brand with a reputation for infections, blue screens, and reboots.)

              20 percent of laptops currently being sold are ChromeBooks and that number continues to grow.
              For over a year, a ChromeBook has been at the top of Amazon's best sellers list.
              M$ loses money on every Surface it sells. (Redmond's propaganda machine is very expensive.)

              In its old stronghold (English-speaking users, traditionally at the mercy of their whitebox builders), September 2013 saw Windoze reach minority status (49 percent) [] and it continues its slide (44 percent). []
              Unlike the dark past of essentially monoculture, the future is diverse.
              (That's one of the most-visited sites on the Web.
              Don't bother to point to some site with tiny sample rates and cooked numbers.)

              the Chinese were given the choice
              Lock-in is a bitch. Ask any nicotine addict.
              Meanwhile, the Brazilian public school system has 500,000 Linux desktop seats.
              Panasonic, Inc. has 300,000 Linux desktop seats.
              The French Gendarmerie Nationale has 85,000 Ubuntu seats.
              Extremadura switched 80,000 boxes to Linux in one weekend.
              After a BSA raid in 2000, Ernie Ball, Inc. got rid of all EULAware in under 1 year.
              Munich is over 95 percent M$-free and they are still working on that.
              Last century, Dave Richards had the entire administration of the City of Largo, FL running Linux with the exception of a few legacy apps on 1 Windoze server.

              Desktop Windoze is an unnecessary crutch. Those who aren't weak have broken free.

              ...and the Chinese want to continue to use something built by a company that VOLUNTARILY handed over to NSA the keys to all its back doors??
              Didn't they learn anything from Stuxnet? The phrase "gross stupidity" comes to mind.
              We can revisit this topic after it has been demonstrated that NSA cyberwarfare has completely pwned their asses.

              -- gewg_

  • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @01:23AM

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday April 30 2014, @01:23AM (#37945)

    Lots of retailers are in this boat. Although MS has ended support for XP their WEPOS and POSReady OS lines are still supported for another couple of years, since they're considered an embedded OS and are on a longer product lifecycle

  • (Score: 3, Informative) by juggs on Wednesday April 30 2014, @05:01AM

    by juggs (63) on Wednesday April 30 2014, @05:01AM (#37978) Journal

    *Reader Advisory* -This is likely an entirely offtopic rant - I saw POS in TFS and the red mist descended.

    As subject - the POS unit industry as a whole seems to be an absolute clusterfuck of clueless fuckwittery from top to bottom. There appears to be absolutely no rigour whatsoever applied to determining what is fit for purpose to be deployed in this retail environment and subsequently no rigour in deployment and ever more subsequently no rigour in maintenance.

    Personal Anecdote - hey sample sizes of one prove everything when the mist descends - visited my local convenience store (7-11 type operation, national chain) a couple of weeks back. Having corralled the ever shelf shifting meagre rations from their placements to my basket I head to the cashier. The cashier station looked as expected the usual all in one thing attempting to:
    a. capture a rapidly moving barcode as the cashier juggles every item until a bleep is emitted or any carbonated drinks explode requiring mop-up supervisor
    b. feed the cashier 'useful' 'time-saving' tips via on screen prompts that scanning the barcode would be good
    c. accurately weigh both the in and out areas simultaneously within a picogram variance, throw an error if any anomaly detected and require godly override if one cashier skin cell was deposited in the wrong place
    d. display an enticing product selection to the patient customer on their 5" facing screen - is this to encourage customers to rush back into the store to pick up more goods mid check out??! WTF
    e. tally all cash and card receipts in and out
    f. act as interface to the chip and pin keypad device so common in Europe (where's the nearest PTZ cam in a ceiling bubble?)
    g. do all the above in real time with just a single 4004 processsor - because.... umm saving costs.

    But all was not normal this day - on my approach to basket product jugglement by the cashier, I noted the customer facing 5" screen was overlaid with a lovely XP-esque error "Adobe Flash Player Update Failed Reason: 50MeHEX work it out yourself". So no shiny, dewy sweet pepper images for me that day.

    Flash Player to show inspirational consumer choices on a device that is simultaneously connected to stock control, cash flow and a customer accessed device for entering both token (card) and knowledge (pin). What could go wrong in that scenario?

    On vaguely questioning the poor cashier I was reassured that it had been like that "for a few days" and the IT engineer had been to look at it. On asking how they knew who the IT engineer was the response was - "they all wear the same shirts so they are easy to ID".

    This is an absolute failure from the top (in choosing a supplier), through the middle (outsourced delivery of solution), to the bottom (outsourced maintenance and inadequate house rules).

    We more or less had these issues nailed down 25 - 30 years ago as technologists. Tech was advancing into corp world as an enabler - a tool, a finely crafted tool to crack a nut. Strikes me tech sold out for the big bucks somwhere along the line and "as long as you're paying enough" kicked in. As ever in any field greed trumps all.

    • (Score: 2) by tibman on Wednesday April 30 2014, @04:13PM

      by tibman (134) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday April 30 2014, @04:13PM (#38163)

      Nice story : ) It does seem that the best solution is rarely the cheapest. Too many businesses are willing to roll the dice and save money upfront. But a lot of your story is dealing with very poor business decisions and not the tech used. Someone in-charge had a great idea that customers/cashiers would love and NO, they don't need to do market research.. they are a genius just like Steve Jobs. *rolls eyes*

      SN won't survive on lurkers alone. Write comments.