Nokia CEO says 6G will be here by 2030 — but you might not access it via your smartphone
Headquartered in Finland, Nokia builds telecoms networks that enable phones and other internet-enabled devices to communicate with one another.
Asked when he thinks the world will move away from using smartphones to using smart glasses and other devices that are worn on the face, [Nokia CEO] Lundmark said it will happen before 6G arrives.
[...] "By then, definitely the smartphone as we know it today will not anymore be the most common interface," he said. "Many of these things will be built directly into our bodies."
He did not specify exactly what he was referring to but some companies, such as Elon Musk's Neuralink, are working on producing electronic devices that can be implanted into the brain and used for communication with machines and other people. On a more basic level, chips can be implanted into people's fingers and used to unlock things.
6G may be here in the next 8 years or so, but I believe the suggestion of implanted devices being commonplace is a totally unrealistic statement. We have not yet reached the stage where 'implanting things into the brain' has become a simple and low risk proposition. But even if we had, who is going to be performing these operations and at what rate? Who would pay for such medical treatment?
However, let us put these problems aside for a moment. What do you see as the future of personal communications? Let's discuss some realistic or even 'off-the'wall' ideas. What effect would such devices have on our privacy and freedoms? In Star Trek the communicator device, which appeared on our (television) screens around the mid 1960s, does not look too different from some of today's smartphones although at that time it was pure science fiction.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @11:50AM (2 children)
Fuck you
(Score: 4, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:40PM (1 child)
Agreed. I recently went a good six months without a working cell phone due to AT&T's 3G fuckery (combined with my own apathy and laziness, of course), and it really got me thinking on the LoRa messengers [hackaday.com] I had been watching for some time. I ended up purchasing a satellite messenger to play with (Spot X [findmespot.com]), mostly because it tied into the traditional SMS network so I would not have to convince friends and family to carry around a hodgepodge pcb to communicate with me. These things are getting better though, hopefully the Precursor [crowdsupply.com] gets a LoRa expansion or at least inspires more projects. In the meantime, I backed another project in this space (FreedomText [kickstarter.com]) as I am really more interested in this space as a working product than a hobby project. I suppose I should also mention the goTenna [gotenna.com], another product in this space that I purchased years ago, but I never used because their terms of service for the Android application had a reverse engineering prohibition that I refused to agree to. Would have been a great platform if they were more open to others leveraging their product.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday May 31 2022, @10:05PM
I resisted the monthly cellular bill for years, used it as a justification for a couple of mobile triband HAM handhelds which were pretty good substitutes in certain situations. However, there is no substitute for the ubiquitous cellular network and I eventually broke down and got first one, then shortly after another cell phone around 2002. They remained dumb or flip phones until about 2013 when we moved to a metro area and were no longer obliged to choose Verizon or no coverage at home.
In the 2007-2012 timeframe, iPhones with tiny screens were all the rage. My prediction at the time was that larger screen phablets were the future, if for no other reason than the positive correlation between presbyopia and disposable income. That prediction, dismissed by my sharp eyed younger colleagues who insisted 3.5" was all anyone would ever need, and why carry anything bigger?
I believe that same presbyopia correlation is a strong headwind for phone watches, although I might entertain the idea of a freestanding (no candy bar tethered) phone watch, perhaps coupled to one of those walking tool Bluetooth earpieces for higher audio quality. If it weren't for the Tx power so close to the head, a standalone earpiece with its own SIM card would be cool for phone use.
But it's not about phone functionality anymore, it's more about a video camera and web browser these days, the phone (and music player, compass, GPS, flashlight, etc.) is just along for the ride. More better bandwidth isn't likely to open up too many new applications. Maybe if embedded laser projectors come down in cost we will start carrying them along too.
I don't believe communication implants are going to be popular in this decade, but maybe the plethora of WiFi connected devices we have today might become more freely placed if they start communicating directly with the cell towers?
🌻🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 4, Touché) by Opportunist on Tuesday May 31 2022, @11:52AM (2 children)
Or other part of my body. It's already bad enough to have this fucking tracking devices in my pants, the idea of not even being able to get rid of them when I'm in bed with someone is certainly not appealing.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @03:01PM
the device in your pocket is not the one to be worried about Senator.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:51PM
Once you have the device, you will gladly conform to the will of the people, for the good of the people. You will no longer care about what may or may not be in your pants, and care even less about being in bed with someone. You will support global adoption of the massively popular devices.
What's not to like?
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:04PM (6 children)
It's hard enough to transplant a kidney from one related person to another one. The receiver has to keep taking pills to prevent it from being rejected.
I wonder how medical researcher think about this; do you get similar responses from "chips" being planted in bodies?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by janrinok on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:21PM (3 children)
I don't know for sure (because I am not a doctor or a surgeon), but I think it is only living tissue that gets 'rejected' in the way that you mean.
Broken limbs are often repaired with metal bars and screws which do not require a lifetime of special medication. Hip replacements likewise. Heart valves can be replaced with non-tissue replacements without medication being needed to prevent rejection. So based on this small amount of anecdotal data - I would guess not.
[nostyle RIP 06 May 2025]
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:06PM (1 child)
You can have reactions to metals and any foreign object, but it's not anywhere near as common and typically, not any of the materials that are cleared for implantation. They will eventually figure it how to get donated organs to work without the drugs to prevent rejection, but the immune system needs to be trained for it if you can't use cells that properly match, be and developing the immune system acceptance takes far more than the few hours b you typically get.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Tuesday May 31 2022, @05:21PM
There are people with nickel allergies, but there are other metals, like titanium, that are safe. I machine medical device parts for a living.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 4, Interesting) by HiThere on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:26PM
It's not only living tissue that gets reacted to, though "rejected" might be the wrong word. Different substances, though, cause different reactions. Think about splinters. Consider artificial knees. So embedded electronics is possible, though you would need to encase them so that the only thing sensed by the body was something it didn't react to. (And, of course, people differ in their reaction profile as well as in other ways.)
It's definitely a non-trivial problem. Even rigidity can be a make-or-break issue. If an electrode is too rigid, THAT will kill the neuron it tries to connect to.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by EvilSS on Wednesday June 01 2022, @01:49PM (1 child)
Seriously? We've been implanting electronics in people for decades now. Pacemakers, IAEDs, VNS devices to prevent or lessen seizures, etc. None of those require anti-rejection drugs. We know what materials can be used for these types of things already.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 01 2022, @08:16PM
Not to mention metal pins are commonly used when treating broken bones.
(Score: 5, Touché) by SomeGuy on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:05PM (2 children)
"We are the Borg. Lower your shields and surrender your ships. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile!"
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:22PM
"You will be assimilated into the Collective and be connected as one. But for only an additional $20 per month, you can have an "unlimited" connection with no data caps! (Terms and conditions apply)"
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:48PM
ALL YOUR BASE
ARE BELONG TO US
EXCEPT EUROPA
USE THEM IN PIECES
ATTEMPT NO LENDING THERE
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:09PM (1 child)
Bill Gates did this already with vaccines and nano-particles.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:53PM
Don't eat the cheeseburgers made with Bill Gates' fake meat grown in some kind of dishes.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:19PM
There won't be any chips implanted in me, unless i also get the same body enhancements as in Syndicate.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @12:40PM (2 children)
This was intentional on the part of the people who designed flip phones. Not the first time this has happened, either. [sciencealert.com] I think it's charming that the people developing the Web were actively attempting to reproduce the virtual world described in Neuromancer. We're living in the future, and that makes me smile every day.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @04:47PM
It's almost 3am here, so I'm too exhausted to search down the references, but it's well-known and accepted that the iPad took a bit of inspiration from the PADs in ST:TNG.
Not was well-known is that the designer for the ST:TNG PADs took inspiration from the PADDs in Elf Sternberg's pornographic alt.sex.stories "Journal Entries", according to Elf who had a chat with the guy at a convention and mentioned it in a Usenet post about 30 years ago.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 01 2022, @06:50AM
(grin)
(Score: 5, Funny) by Snospar on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:04PM (1 child)
You know when you're walking through a mall and there's a little kiosk that offers phone unlocking, repairs, replacement screens and the latest protective phone case? It'll be them with the equivalent of an ear piercing gun.
No thanks.
Huge thanks to all the Soylent volunteers without whom this community (and this post) would not be possible.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @05:00PM
So you'd rather have a non-unlocked chip? Tie your thoughts to a specific service provider for a subsidized rate plan?
(Score: 5, Interesting) by jon3k on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:18PM (7 children)
Half the country wouldn't even get vaccinated, which was supported by the CDC, because those idiots thought it had a "Bill Gates 5G Microchip" in it. And you think they'll let a private company implant electronics in them?
[X] Doubt.
(Score: 5, Informative) by HiThere on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:28PM (1 child)
Yes. It just takes the right marketing spin.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday May 31 2022, @10:08PM
If it is offered for no money down there will always be a significant slice of society that will go for it, no matter how much privacy they lose.
🌻🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:38PM
Another sizable segment of the country flocked to get vaccine into themselves, their babies, their dogs, their cats, and their hamsters, all because The Holy TV Said So!
That same segment is the target customers for the brain implants. After all, you are in no danger of brain damage if born without a brain...
(Score: 2, Interesting) by pTamok on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:53PM
Of course they will if it gives them "Free* Access" to something shiny, or a social network, or music/movies/TV shows.
*Terms & Conditions apply. After an initial period, administration charges may apply, as well monthly service fees, hire of implanted equipment, billing fees, fees that we feel like adding 'just because', contributions to ex-gratia payments to the C-suite members, their spouses, families and hangers-on, regulatory lobbying fees, lawyers retainers and anything else we can think of.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @03:05PM
you mean i will have to get a booster to upgrade from the 5g we just got implanted with go 6g already?
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:56PM (1 child)
Suppose that once they are implanted, they suddenly no longer have any objections. They even become supportive of this and will assist in spreading the good news and making sure everyone gets it.
Think ST:TNG episode The Game.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by maxwell demon on Wednesday June 01 2022, @05:56AM
Actually I'm more thinking of the device from the Star Gate episode "Revisions". Although that wasn't actually implanted.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @01:31PM
ImbecilesInvestors flocking to pay real present-day money for imaginary future-day vapors. What's not to love?(Score: 2, Interesting) by charon on Tuesday May 31 2022, @02:02PM (3 children)
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:45PM (2 children)
It's not so bad. Really. No need to be so concerned. It will not be necessary to implant this technology into your body.
It can easily take a form of something that you simply wear. It can be a combination of seemingly everyday items which take the place of "implanted" devices into your body. For example, a single individual would simply have: [1] glasses, [2] ear pieces (like hearing aids), [3] dentures and [4] a chastity device attached. No surgery.
Nonot very much pain. For certain definitions of not very much.Other options which do not involve surgery would be something resembling a tatoo. It could be applied to your right hand. This makes contactless payment easy. Since it would wear off, it would be necessary to have a new one re-applied every 30 days. This also acts as a loyalty program. For people who could not afford this, a version could be offered which also includes a tatoo device on the forehead which displays color animated advertising banners. Teens would compete for certain coveted brands to be displayed on their foreheads!
Once everyone has finally been 'chipped', the entire population will be behind this. Polls will show it to be overwhelmingly popular.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 01 2022, @07:36AM
Imagine the effect on a radius of 5m of around 44kJ [digikey.com] discharged in 1µs-1ms through a single loop of a copper bar**
**(no, not the "a domestic abuser, a klansmen, and a murderer walk into a bar. Barman: What will it be officer?" kind of bar)
(Score: 1) by charon on Wednesday June 01 2022, @01:36PM
(Score: 3, Interesting) by looorg on Tuesday May 31 2022, @02:39PM (2 children)
It might not be totally unrealistic. After all almost 10 years or so is a long time in technology in that regard. Today's phone or device vs on from the 2010:s are miles apart in that regard.
That said all this AR/VR whatever stuff still have not taken off. But I guess it's just a matter of time. Perhaps the next device then as noted is some kind of monocle or glasses or lens and then it's probably not to many steps for it to become like a contact lens you insert over your eye or even into your eye. Question is are you still getting a "phone" to as some kind of private base station or wireless router to all your other stuff. Something that keeps all the antennas and the power sources. But it could basically be a black little box (in all possible ways) that you just keep in the bottom of your bag or whatever? Or how will the lens get power and signal?
But to have them surgically implanted into my brain? No. Wait, let me rephrase that .. FUCK NO!!!!! There are no simple and low risk brain surgery options. Even if it was there will be plenty of news of people more or less getting lobotomized (sometimes you might not be able to tell the difference compared to today's smartphone-zombies) by their devices then or the surgery in question as someone will want to make it on the cheap.
After all you shouldn't have to go to the hospital to get your "phone" repaired or inserted. So they'll have to setup their own clinics to do it. The procedure will also have to be so simple that a common tech with minimal training can learn to do it so they don't have to go to expensive medical schools. Cause a brain-surgeon can only do so many surgeries per day. I guess they could create robots to do it but still that is just another technology in waiting then. Still when, or if, you want brain surgery preformed on you by a minimum wage store clerk in a mall you must be insane.
That said when Elon (or whomever) have their brain surgery streamed live on Twitter the masses will probably follow. Still that will be the deluxe procedure and not the one you'll get in the mall preformed by Cindy that went the brain surgery college last weekend.
If this is the new form of Ludditism I'll be there with them. Cause this is just some techporn bullshit fantasy. But perhaps we should all just be glad it's not the Probulator.
The Star Trek stuff is just nostalgia in that regard. It was futuristic and scifi as hell in the original series. That you could carry a small handheld device that did all the things of a computer and lab-equipment and sensory monitoring stuff. So they couldn't just get rid of it when The Next Generation came about as the president was set and considering then that Voyager and DS9 share a timeline with TNG they had to have it to. Then came Enterprise which was before so they had to go in the opposite direction. Still they couldn't go to far as it would look ridiculous by modern viewers. Then we have the shitfest that is Discovery and that can just go and die in a fire so whatever they do doesn't matter.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @03:11PM (1 child)
is a pity Strange New Worlds is carrying on in the 'modern' tech lines, yet comforting they have started emulating the Orville storylines more than Discovery schluckt.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Tuesday May 31 2022, @05:36PM
I have not watched it yet. But it can't be worse then Discovery can it? Even if its somehow linked or something isn't it? It's from that weird time-travel stuff they did on Discovery and left Pike someplace (or is it some time when then?) or whatnot. As noted I have not really paid any kind of attention to it yet. I guess I'll wait for most of the season to be shown to start to watch it. That said if it's starting to be more like the Orville (which a new season should start any day now or so) then it can only be for the better as the Orville was a lot more "Star Trek" then Discovery ever was/is.
Still it's not like you can't find a good, or at least fun, episode of Discovery. I still though the alternative earth episodes was kind of fun when Tilly was all super evil.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by hendrikboom on Tuesday May 31 2022, @03:37PM
The people making Star Trek didn't have to install actual electronics into the communicators, since they were just props. So they could shape the communicator to be convenient without regard for technical limitations.
We may have the optimal format already.
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @04:57PM (1 child)
it's the new dependency.
once normal daily operations become dependent on a mobile phones, like banking, stock trading, side-channel identification (2FA) for other communications, clubbermint services, etc?, we're f#cked.
all else stands and falls if you have a mobile phone or not. it then is a new "leak in pocket book" or "monthly overhead" you cannot get rid off (rent?)
if you think being dependent on fossil fuels for everything is bad, just wait until landlines become unavailable and the mobile carriers get enough pull inside the clubbermint regulators ...
the prices will get jacked up BUT with the option to "sell yourself" more. of cource this will not be phrased like that. enabling constant geo location tracking (for example) will be sold as "improving service quality" and "reduction of monthly cost" ('cause they're selling that data, aside from other personal data, to advertisers and getting their monies that way).
ofc to the clubbermint regulators, this is sold as "meor national security" and "peaceful population" and "law enforcement optimization".
if you elected peoples just have shred of decency, then enforce "per minute billing" at a reasonable cost. no more of this 'em "package" shit. data and voice (lol) are both available once you bought and registered a SIM for 50 cents.
and no, increasing energy costs are not a reason to "join the inflation" party, since mobile network are just a service and the energy to provide 'em can be had for free.
6G? no thanks, add solar and/or wind to the base station instead.
ah, also, forbid pure relay towers. towers that have no coms-cable going into the ground, that solely rely on relaying a wireless signal.
if you want to put up a tower, the permit requires 64-core fiber to go in. the dark cores can be used by others for other stuff (to-be-determined).
(Score: 2) by Magic Oddball on Wednesday June 01 2022, @02:30AM
It wouldn't matter if landlines became unavailable — it's now fairly rare for a household to have a traditional POTS landline, as the phone companies in much of the US no longer hook them up or activate them when people relocate and have killed off access to oldschool ADSL through their lines. Most people who have a "landline" actually just have a VOIP line as part of their Internet service package, and primarily (if not entirely) rely on their personal cellphones for phone service.
Also, using made-up derogatory terms like "clubbermint" makes you sound too immature or irrational to take seriously.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @07:30PM
Is Nokia talking about nano particles that connect with bluetooth?
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:28PM (4 children)
In the 1970s I mused about the communicators.
On most planets there was not some type of planetary routing network that could be used by the communicators. (eg, 6G) Yet the communicators could reach the ship at any time. Apparently regardless (or irregardless?) of what part of the orbit the ship was in. On the other side of the planet? Could the Enterprise plant some communication satellites in orbit when it first arrives?
Another amazing feature is that a call could be routed directly to a specific individual. Much like cell service. Even if it was by the user's name rather than some sort of telephone number. Oh, and with voice recognition used to initiate the call. And incoming call notification was in the voice of the person calling you.
So on a planet with no infrastructure, could the communicators form some sort of ad-hoc mesh network? (I wouldn't have known that terminology in my teen years, but that was the basic idea I had in mind.) So communicators might participate in the network even when a crewman is not using their communicator. Actively routing calls or information.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:53PM (3 children)
Perhaps the teleporter just beams the bits down? Who knows ...
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @09:14PM (2 children)
Or "subspace radio" fits into communicators. But only for short range. Because the ship can be out of range in some episodes. Putting Kirk in a situation where there is nothing he can do except this episode's space bimbo.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 31 2022, @11:54PM (1 child)
the so-called "neutrinos" seem to go thru everything and be directional?
shoting 'em thru the core would be 6'xxx km. i think not even leo sats can beat that (unless the little ones are kindda slow).
if only they would stop putting everythin' in the bottom shelf labled "for later use"...
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Wednesday June 01 2022, @06:12AM
Well, if you invent a neutrino detector that's small enough, sensitive enough and cheap enough to be used as communication device, you'll get a Nobel prize for sure.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday May 31 2022, @08:33PM
It the Nokia CEO who once (in)famously made the inciteful remark that using Android as the OS for your mobile phone was like peeing your pants in winter to stay warm.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 01 2022, @11:04AM
What I'd like is a High-Fi device that uses shaped EM fields to stimulate my brain to produce a customizable range of neurotransmitters, so I could "dial-a-high".