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Is a religious group a 'race' or isn't it? Is someone 'racist' if they publicly state their dislike of a religious group? An Australian tribunal has answered this question by ruling that Muslim is not a race, and as such, a person who vilifies them in public, an act which is currently illegal in Australia, would not have broken the law.
In 2016 Sonia Kruger 'called for an end to migration from Islamic countries' saying that she wanted people to feel safe when going out to celebrate Australia day. Sam Ekermawi, a Muslim, filed a complaint to the NSW Civil and Administrative Tribunal claiming the comments were racial vilification.
The tribunal was unable to conclude Muslims living in Australia "are a 'race' by reason of a common ethnic or ethno-religious origin" and dismissed the application. This is an important milestone in the legal and cultural development of the ocean-bound nation which is still attempting to balance the melting pot of cultures and people who have migrated to the country from all over the world. This ruling may be a key threshold for defining what the word 'race' actually means in the legal and social and cultural context and how laws will be interpreted in the future.
(Score: 5, Interesting) by looorg on Saturday February 16 2019, @11:53AM (18 children)
Sometimes they surprise you by actually making sane decisions. Belonging to a religious group is not the same as belonging to a race, or just biological subgroup. I could convert to islam (or any other religion) today but you can't really convert race, by becoming muslim I wouldn't change race. It might change some cultural and sociological factors and belonging to various groups. But race isn't one of them. So Kruger is probably not a racist, she might be a bigot or some other things but wanting limit migration from islamic countries is not actually a racist statement.
Still interesting that they found her comments to be vilifying and she apparently should be more touchy feely next time and think of all the people that get their feelings hurt.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 16 2019, @12:40PM (3 children)
Rachel Dolezal finds your words to be bigoted and hurtful.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Saturday February 16 2019, @01:23PM
Can't we ask her parents instead? I would think they would be more hurt then her by her actions.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday February 16 2019, @11:17PM
Rachel Dolezal is a nutbar and should not be taken seriously. I honestly thought she was some sort of ultra-right troll upon first hearing about her, but no, she seems to be one of the few genuine leftie crazies out there...
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 17 2019, @01:48AM
Looks like she's been demolished by both Afropunk and The Root:
https://afropunk.com/tag/rachel-dolezal/ [afropunk.com]
https://www.theroot.com/how-i-know-for-sure-rachel-dolezal-is-not-black-1823604033 [theroot.com]
https://www.theroot.com/this-rachel-dolezal-tea-about-the-oppression-of-darth-b-1792903639 [theroot.com]
https://www.theroot.com/rachel-dolezal-booked-and-released-from-jail-on-welfare-1827328774 [theroot.com]
If we want to move towards a raceless society, then a white person "identifying" as African-American seems to reify racialist theory and is thus a counterproductive act.
Race is largely a social construct while gender binary largely is not, and so no, you can't s/race/gender/ (as Dolezal attempted). Don't even try.
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 16 2019, @12:43PM (9 children)
Change "Muslim" to "Jew" and ask someone whether it's "just a religion" or also something to do with ethnicity or even race.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Saturday February 16 2019, @01:52PM (6 children)
Not so very insightful, IMO. Both Islam and Judaism are political entities, and both are religious entities. Both apparently worship the same God, or at least say they do. The difference between them is, Islam seeks to convert, and thus, to command you, and me, and every human on the face of the planet. Jews do not. A Muslim might kill you for any number of reasons, a Jew is unlikely to kill you except in self defense. One is a viral virus, the other is not so much. For those reasons, Judaism is pretty much confined to one ethnic group, while Islam includes people of every race, culture, ethnicity and nationality on earth.
The funny bit about your question is, the original Jews and the original Muslims were cousins. All were Semitic.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 16 2019, @05:42PM
the original Jews and the original Muslims were cousins.
Ya don't say! And here's the original "#me too" [youtube.com]
(Score: 2) by https on Saturday February 16 2019, @06:23PM (1 child)
The Canaanites would love to agree with your middle point, but since they're dead, they can't.
Offended and laughing about it.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Monday February 18 2019, @09:00AM
Actually, if you were to double check, the Canaanites were NOT killed off by the Jews. They were TOLD to kill all of the Canaanites, but they didn't do so. Now, whether there are any Canaanites left living today is up for debate, but if they are all gone, it wasn't the Jews that did it.
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Saturday February 16 2019, @11:14PM (1 child)
Judaism is the one religion that's also an ethnic group. They are very literal about being Yahweh's chosen *people,* humans, genetic stock (though they didn't have that particular concept back then). In particular, Jewishness is supposed to be passed down *matrilinearly,* which surprised me very much upon learning about it. They also generally discourage conversions, and I remember hearing some of the Chassidim back in Brooklyn outright saying that conversion to Judaism ought not to be allowed.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 17 2019, @02:40AM
Not the only one. Laestadians aren't quite racially homogenous, but they're close to it. Jews are just the largest and most visible/least crazy.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Arik on Sunday February 17 2019, @02:23AM
Mohammed sought to convert, but the Yemeni Rabbis laughed at him. A stripling, a ridiculous youth, son of a single mother, only able to act like a man inside his own tribe because his grandfather was still alive.
I wasn't there. Maybe they really tried. But it sounds to me more like they laughed him off and made him determined to humble them. Which he did. Jews in the Hijaz either converted or died. A few might have been permitted to flee alive, I'm not sure on that.
Semitic, btw, is a linguistic term. People of very different ancestry can share a language, and vice versa.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 0, Flamebait) by realDonaldTrump on Saturday February 16 2019, @02:51PM
We love Jew, sometimes referred to as Jewish. If you have some money that needs counting, you always always hire a Jew to count it -- if you're smart. And we love Israel. They're doing so many things in Israel, tremendous things. And they're putting the Middle East to shame. I think Middle East could learn so much from them. As U.S.A. is learning (Wall& Law Enforcement).
And everybody has heard of the 12 Tribes of Israel. But people don't know this, there are the 12 Tribes of Arabia. Otherwise known as the 12 Tribes of Ishmael. They were Jew. But also Arab. And the famous Mohammad was one of them!!
(Score: 2) by HiThere on Saturday February 16 2019, @05:55PM
That one's a complicated question. There are genetic variations that are only common among the Jews...and among them only common among the Cohens (alleged descendants of Aaron). So. But there's also a large number of folk who are descendants of converts made at one time or another. And, of course, the opposite.
So it would be possible to define a jewish race, but most practicing Jews wouldn't be members. And a few who had never practices the Jewish faith, nor their known ancestors, but end up included.
Mind you, the only way to demonstrate membership in the Jewish race so defined would be to have your genotype sequenced. There's no visible distinguishing feature.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 16 2019, @03:12PM (2 children)
It is illegal to offend people now.
In Australia.
Think about that for a moment.
(Score: 2) by looorg on Saturday February 16 2019, @05:22PM (1 child)
It's not just an Australian thing, most western countries have laws that in essence are there to do the same thing. Most of them appear to focus on various form of hate-speech targeted towards various minorities. Then we have all the normal "offend people"-type laws as various form of slander. Basically we have laws that tell us to love and like everyone or STFU! Just waiting for thought crimes to become a mainstream reality.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday February 18 2019, @02:08PM
Free speech is dead
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday February 16 2019, @05:36PM
It means they can't imprison her yet, but they'll be working on revising the laws to do so in future. Politicians are terrified that if a citizen says something about the community, a shaheed will appear to commit mass murder.