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Which of these popular programming languages do you hate the most? (And why)
| 7% | 20 votes |
| 22% | 58 votes |
| 6% | 17 votes |
| 7% | 20 votes |
| 23% | 60 votes |
| 12% | 33 votes |
| 13% | 35 votes |
| 5% | 15 votes |
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- Don't complain about lack of options. You've got to pick a few when you do multiple choice. Those are the breaks.
- Feel free to suggest poll ideas if you're feeling creative. I'd strongly suggest reading the past polls first.
- This whole thing is wildly inaccurate. Rounding errors, ballot stuffers, dynamic IPs, firewalls. If you're using these numbers to do anything important, you're insane.
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Which of these popular programming languages do you hate the most? (And why)
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Your nature demands love and your happiness depends on it.
(Score: 1) by kristian on Tuesday June 03 2014, @03:43PM
Seriously... it's popular and I don't like it much. (No offense to anybody who does)
The opinions expressed in this post are those of the individual sender and not those of Kristian Picon.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 03 2014, @09:16PM
Sounds like you really need to be programming in Swift.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by gman003 on Tuesday June 03 2014, @03:51PM
Python: I just don't like proscriptionist languages. Python wants there to be one right way to do it, and to make that the only way to do it. It does a lot of things well, and it's fairly clean in design, but I just can't stand it. Also, the vast incompatibilities between 2 and 3 means most of my servers need both installed, which is just dumb.
Java: It's a good language. A bit verbose, and not nearly as high-performance as it ought to be considering its design, but a good language nonetheless.
C++: It's got a horribly inconsistent design, and some of the core libraries are massive failures, but I can't fault it too much because it was so early, and because it's still fast.
Ruby: I've never used it, never really looked into it. I basically don't care enough to summon up any hate.
Javascript: The language itself is good, it's the DOM and the use of it that gets ugly.
C#: It's Microsoft-brand Java, as far as design goes. I used to hate it because of the Microsoft stuff, but I just can't be assed to hate C# anymore.
PHP: I almost picked this one, because the design is a pile of failures and ugly hacks. But despite all that, it works, and it does a few particular jobs very easily.
Perl: Using it for major applications is stupid. Using it as a sort of advanced scripting language is what it's best at. If you think Perl is unreadable, just take a look at a bash script doing the same thing using awk and sed - it's horrifying.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Thexalon on Tuesday June 03 2014, @04:21PM
My rundown is a bit different:
Python: It has its problems, but is overall a good language and good language community headed in the right direction. Python 3 is a major improvement over Python 2. You can write readable and robust code for a wide variety of applications, and that's what I really care about for most purposes.
Java: Verbose, too many nouns, ridiculously long traceback call stacks, but if anything its failures lead to results that are more robust than necessary rather than too brittle. (How many standard libraries provide you with the hooks to switch from the standard Gregorian calendar to, say, a Jewish lunar calendar and not change any of the rest of the code?)
C++: The biggest problem here was not the language (which certainly has its problems) but the developers who abused every bell and whistle they could think of. You can make C++ not suck if you use it correctly.
Ruby: I've played with it enough to know that it too is a very solid language choice.
Javascript: It has some truly interesting language concepts, mostly bolted on from functional languages like LISP. The browser incompatibilities are the biggest problem with it, and that's not the fault of the language but the fault of Microsoft trying to create "This site is best viewed with Internet Explorer 6" notices.
C#: A lot like Java, with some not-terrible ideas tacked on like properties (preventing a lot of boilerplate getter-setter functions) and partial classes (to separate out auto-generated code from programmer code while keeping the same class name). It's main drawback is that there's still a lot of code generation.
PHP: Yeeaaargh! Bad (lack of) design. Terrible standard library. Idiotic developer community. Major security failures. The only reason it's widespread is that it was easier for idiots to use than Perl (the only well-known alternative for dynamic websites at the time) 15 years ago. So yeah, I had to pick this one. There are people trying to fix this with PHP 6 and better libraries, but most of the PHP out there is atrocious.
Perl: Good for what it was designed for, namely replacing complex shell scripting. Sometimes useful for regex-heavy work, but the trouble is that too much is implicit which makes it much harder to read and follow. Nice try, Larry, but not really a good long-term solution.
"Think of how stupid the average person is. Then realize half of 'em are stupider than that." - George Carlin
(Score: 1) by DeKO on Tuesday June 03 2014, @10:58PM
That's by design, and not a unique trait of C++. Stroustrup wanted the language to be usable in ways he could not yet even imagine, so proposals to forcefully limit the flexibility of certain aspects of the language (e.g. template metaprogramming) were opposed. Also paraphrasing him, every new thing will be overused until people figure out where the right balance is; today's C++ programmers don't abuse templates as much; unfortunately there are some clowns that are rewriting
into
just because they can.
(Score: 2) by Grishnakh on Wednesday June 04 2014, @04:29PM
Python: ... Also, the vast incompatibilities between 2 and 3 means most of my servers need both installed, which is just dumb.
That to me is the worst part of Python. The bit about it using indentation as a syntactical element also sucks IMO.
Java: It's a good language. A bit verbose,
Java is extremely verbose, and that ruins it as a good language to me.
C++: It's got a horribly inconsistent design, and some of the core libraries are massive failures, but I can't fault it too much because it was so early, and because it's still fast.
C++ is a good language as long as you restrict yourself to a subset of it. Different people may prefer different subsets so it ends up being the language you want it to be. And core libraries really aren't that important; you don't have to use those, you can use other libraries. C++ programming with Qt is actually quite nice, but using the standard libraries it sucks.
PHP: I almost picked this one, because the design is a pile of failures and ugly hacks. But despite all that, it works, and it does a few particular jobs very easily.
PHP's gotten better over the years; just ignore the older parts that only remain for backwards-compatibility.
Perl: Using it for major applications is stupid. Using it as a sort of advanced scripting language is what it's best at. If you think Perl is unreadable, just take a look at a bash script doing the same thing using awk and sed - it's horrifying.
Perl is a lot like C++: there's multiple ways to do the same thing. You don't have to write things in an obfuscated way, but it certainly is possible to do so. It's really not good for serious applications, but for text-processing and scripting it's excellent. And you're right about bash scripts. Those are truly horrible.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by meisterister on Tuesday June 03 2014, @04:43PM
I don't really mind the language itself. In fact, I think that it's a fundamentally good idea. The problem that I have with Javascript is just how overused it is, especially given how poorly the heavily script-laden sites perform. I'm sorry, Johnny T Web Developer, but Grandma doesn't have a gigabit connection or overclocked i7.
(May or may not have been) Posted from my K6-2, Athlon XP, or Pentium I/II/III.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by forsythe on Tuesday June 03 2014, @05:34PM
I do have problems with Javascript as a language. There's the === operator, the silly handling of NaN, ... here, just read page 7 of this article [usenix.org], which is pretty succinct.
(Score: 1) by meisterister on Tuesday June 03 2014, @05:54PM
Before reading that, I did understand that the modern web was a massive kludge, but I didn't understand just how bad it was. The web itself doesn't amaze me so much as the fact that the web can sort of work amazes me.
(May or may not have been) Posted from my K6-2, Athlon XP, or Pentium I/II/III.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 04 2014, @08:25AM
I think Javascript would be less hated, if it didn't have to be used for web browser client side scripting. I think web browser client side scripting should be a simpler language, more suited for less skilled programmers.
On the other hand, if javascript was not used in the web browser, would people care that it existed?
(Score: 2) by Aiwendil on Tuesday June 03 2014, @05:35PM
All of them, for a simple reason, I parse {} as comment-blocks in my mental first pass, so it tends to give me headache over time.
Other than that they are just like any other popular language really, not typed hard enough and too forgiving ;-)
(Score: 1) by shortscreen on Tuesday June 03 2014, @06:01PM
Hence why I did not become a programmer. It's a close race between Javascript and Java, as to which is the enabler of the most and worst buggy, painful, unwanted goings-on that I'm forced to deal with as a user.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Drake_Edgewater on Tuesday June 03 2014, @06:14PM
I will vote using numbers 1-9, a higher number means I hate that option the most.
[4] Python: All my friends with a physics degree keeps talking about how easy is to set up an animation of a simple pendulum in Python. I haven't tried this one though.
[2] Java: Rigorous rules forcing you to write good object-oriented code (exceptions always may occur). Would be the best of the list, but there is a lot of stinky litigation around it lately.
[1] C++: I've seen the most beautiful code written in C++, I can see the colors of the rainbow even in a VT100... when used properly! (on the other hand, I get multiple migraines whenever a friend of mine shows me his/her code saying "look at my C++ code!" and all I see is a gigantic main() function)
[5] Ruby: Never tried this one, I'll give it a neutral vote.
[8] Javascript: Used to be very handy. Now is a disease, the black plague of the web.
[9] C#: Introduced by Microsoft. The world was supposed to be a better place after its introduction. Typical solution looking for a problem (and now a new challenger [soylentnews.org] appears!).
[6] PHP: I suppose a lot of websites wouldn't exist without this one. I did some small projects with it, it was fun.
[3] Perl: When I need to manipulate text files, output from commands, and so on Perl always saves my day.
(Score: 2) by quadrox on Wednesday June 04 2014, @11:15AM
WOW!
I hate Microsoft - I am absolutely disgusted by their behavior regarding many different things, but if there is one (or two) things they ever did right, it's Visual Studio and C#. I have never seen a better way to get stuff done. Rating C# the worst just shows you have no fucking clue. Sorry - but you don't. I still avoid using it because it is from Microsoft, but when it comes to the language itself it is easily the best of all of them, by far.
And java - yes it's fucking pure and all that. But that's on such a theorectical and academical level, using it in practice is such a horrible painful exercise in frustration... It's inconsistent, inflexible, cumbersome, bloated... ugh I despise it. And that's even without considering that litigation stuff you mention.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 03 2014, @07:49PM
Learning it has meant encountering either gratingly oversimplified syntax, mutant cross-breeds of strings and arrays, or left-field weirdness (eg its excessive love of whitespace, or the __init__ thing). It has not been the 'gives you wings' experience a certain webcomic promised.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Tuesday June 03 2014, @09:10PM
Right now it's both Python and Perl, because where I work engineers are becoming increasingly reliant on using them as half-ass kludges as a way to quickly meet the most base requirements without a proper solution.
The kind of Perl and Python coding they use actually isn't unreadable, but they're stupid solutions which require even the most non-technical users to install yet more crap (perl and Python) on their computers. It's mostly the situation and being the wrong tool for the job, rather than the languages themselves.
That being said, though, Larry Wall is a proselytizing and unfunny cocksucker who like-minded zombies adore just because he's a Christian zealot.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 05 2014, @09:14AM
Ah, that explains why Perl 6 never gets finished: The finishing of Perl 6 is the equivalent to the second coming of Christ. Promised for the then-current generation to see, but 2000 years later it still didn't occur.
Don't wait for Perl 6 to get finished. It will take millennia at least. More probably it will never be finished at all. But a whole world religion will be based on the expectation of it getting finished eventually.
SCNR
(Score: 2) by mendax on Tuesday June 03 2014, @10:38PM
I'm glad to see that Groovy is not on that list. Groovy is indeed a groovier way to do Java although it seems to be perhaps a bit too overly complicated for my tastes. However, I don't have to use those complications because if you already know Java, you already know Groovy (mostly).
But my big surprise is seeing Javascript so thoroughly hated. I think Javascript is a terrific language given what it's used for. I suffers from many of the ills of a scripting language but that's just the way it is.
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 1) by zsau on Tuesday June 03 2014, @11:10PM
Because I use it every day and both the original language and the original codebase were written by darn fools. Who on earth thought:
might be a good idea? How on earth can I know what anything is at any point in time?
(Score: 2) by Subsentient on Wednesday June 04 2014, @04:30AM
I don't want a PDF viewer written in Javascript, and I hate Java because it's too high level, not that fast, creates stupid programmers, and because Google wants you to use it for Android.
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." -Jiddu Krishnamurti
(Score: 2) by skullz on Wednesday June 04 2014, @03:04PM
I haven't heard Java being called "high level" in a while. That kind of made my day. Take that, Python / Ruby / Groovy!
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday June 04 2014, @10:19AM
Javascript can add some useful enhancements to a web page if used by a professional coder who also happens to appreciate working with text editors, and has a fondness for low-level programming and minimalist efficient design paradigms.
Javascript is a great excuse to fuck userland in the ass without a condom when it's used by any other web creator.
I think I would respect Javascript-infested websites more if they always included these two things:
-- If user has disabled JS in his browser, the website will load a basic HTML+CSS version of the page. Check this out [motherfuckingwebsite.com]
-- If website chooses to display a toolbar-message in my browser saying "This website requires JavaScript to fully function, which is blocked or failed to load...", then I want that toolbar to also have a link-button saying "Click here for more info...". Clicking that button opens a basic html page which describes in plain English the name and purpose of every script used on that website.
If a Javascript-infested website cannot interact with me in those two ways then it and its owners are flagged by me as ENEMY! I don't care about your "requirements" and your disinterest in sharing the "real deal" with userland; you are just a self-serving rat as far as I'm concerned.
I hardly ever use YouTube anymore because of this fact; to make all page elements load properly and view comments you need to spread you asscheeks and point your asshole at Google's cock, otherwise page will not work (except for the video). Another website which is a useless JavaScript abomination is 'The Guardian'. Ditto for many others.
(Score: 2) by evilviper on Wednesday June 04 2014, @06:00PM
I know there are useful Java apps out there. I've had to maintain some. Even in that best case it was still always a pain dealing with different versions of the java libraries.
But my big frustration with Java, stems from client apps. Far too often Java apps are a clunky mess, that just BARELY work with the exact library version they were designed for, and nothing else. Upgrading your java version VERY often breaks a CRITICAL app you need, yet not updating leaves you open to vulnerabilities. And these Java apps may be needed and critical, for a DECADE after their release... You can't stop managing your SAN, just because the Java app only BARELY works with Java 1.3.8.1.9 when run on Windows ME, and doesn't work elsewhere.
Java is usually only ever used for client apps, because of its supposed cross-platform nature. Sadly, the reality is that it won't EVER run on any platform it wasn't specifically designed for and tested on, just because. Porting a simple C++ program would probably be orders of magnitude easier, and better, in almost all cases.
And don't bother asking for fixes and updates, or an alternative to their crap Java app. When they've shoveled it out the door with "Java" stamped on it, that means it MUST be able to run on every platform, forever, and they won't listen to complaints that it doesn't.
Obviously, I'm bitter. I recognize Java has a useful place in the world. But when it's bad, oh man is it ever a nightmare, with no way to escape from.
Hydrogen cyanide is a delicious and necessary part of the human diet.
(Score: 2) by istartedi on Wednesday June 04 2014, @06:11PM
Slower by orders of magnitude just so everything can be an object which is an instance of a dynamic class. Sometimes you really just want to do simple math with integers. The language refuses to acknowledge that reality. You must have the capability to instantiate the number 2 as a web server and send e-mail to it... for some crazy reason.
That wouldn't be so bad, except for the culture of people around it who insist that it's wonderful simply because it has some Lisp-like features. (This was a few years ago, they seem to be less boisterous now). They also tend to be Mac snobs. It's also part of the "just throw more hardware at it" because "developer cycles cost more". That's true to some extent. Few people write assembly anymore for this very reason. Ruby takes it too far though.
I can see why JavaScript is winning though. It's what forces me to run NotScript wheras Ruby doesn't annoy me directly as a user. It would only annoy me if I had to write code in it... knowing that just about any other language would beat it, knowing that it's only a matter of time before it gets profiled and I end up writing critical sections in C, with less time to debug the C because I wasted time in Ruby because... "developer cycles are more expensive".
Appended to the end of comments you post. Max: 120 chars.
(Score: 2) by jasassin on Wednesday June 04 2014, @11:08PM
Wow. I thought C or even bash is bad. Perl gives me nightmares. Lines and lines of code I cannot fathom, creating the nightmare around me. Ohhhh perl you.... I'll get back to you!
jasassin@gmail.com GPG Key ID: 0xE6462C68A9A3DB5A
(Score: 1) by forkazoo on Wednesday June 04 2014, @11:19PM
I've never really learned C#, but as far as I can tell, it actually isn't that terrible of a language. By all reports, Microsoft actually learned some things from the flaws of Java when they ripped it off, and they spent a few versions iterating improvements on things they didn't get right out of the gate. Unfortunately, it's a vendor locked second tier ripoff, and I just don't have much reason to write Windows specific code. So, I am kind of jealous of the fact that there is a cute little ecosystem of useful stuff that is of no use to me. Since I don't use it, I hate it to fill the gap.
(Score: 1) by Ethanol-fueled on Thursday June 05 2014, @04:25AM
Microsoft has their hooks deep into Corporate America. Usually expressed through a big and expensive service contract through Dell in which Windows XP and 7 are obligatory on those machines. By extension comes the painless single-language licensing of Visual Studio. In the case of C#, if you already know Java(or really any C-like language) building useful shit quick occurs naturally thanks to the full-featured and configurable IDE with a fat standard library. Hell, they convinced our software/firmware leader that Silverlight was the way of the future, and now we're paying for it, because Silverlight was a flash-fad.
Don't get me wrong, I like Java. But that there was no standard library for usefully handling serial communication was pants-shittingly retarded. Really, I have to install RXTX and then dick around with command-lines or configuring Eclipse or Netbeans instead of Visual Studio's nice out-of-box experience, which already knows what I'm talking about, even having a datatype called SerialPort on Windows? For something that's been around and as well-understood as a goddamn serial port?
Any industry which uses Windows/VS/C# as opposed to Java is doing so for that reason. Nobody wants to fiddle and twiddle to get basic functionality interacting software with hardware. Serial is still widely used in industry, and that Java has neglected it was what allowed C# and VB to eat its lunch.
(Score: 2) by jasassin on Thursday June 05 2014, @04:37AM
Visual Studio's nice out-of-box experience, which already knows what I'm talking about, even having a datatype called SerialPort on Windows? For something that's been around and as well-understood as a goddamn serial port?
Man, I know you are being serious but the truth of what you say, and the fact serial ports were my living for a few years, made it hilarious to me. Thanks for the laugh.
jasassin@gmail.com GPG Key ID: 0xE6462C68A9A3DB5A
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Thursday June 05 2014, @03:47AM
United States legal code.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 05 2014, @09:24AM
That's not a programming language. Programming languages are based on the need to rigorously specify the working of anything you write. The legal code is based on giving a lot of freedom for interpretation.