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What IDE do you use for programming?
| 13% | 28 votes |
| 0% | 2 votes |
| 4% | 9 votes |
| 0% | 0 votes |
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| 1% | 4 votes |
| 67% | 135 votes |
| 10% | 21 votes |
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- Don't complain about lack of options. You've got to pick a few when you do multiple choice. Those are the breaks.
- Feel free to suggest poll ideas if you're feeling creative. I'd strongly suggest reading the past polls first.
- This whole thing is wildly inaccurate. Rounding errors, ballot stuffers, dynamic IPs, firewalls. If you're using these numbers to do anything important, you're insane.
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What IDE do you use for programming?
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The horizon of many people is a circle with a radius of zero. They call
this their point of view.
-- Albert Einstein
(Score: 0, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 21 2023, @07:33AM (2 children)
Voted for the text editor, since most right-wing nutjobs are functionally illiterate. I thaut we culd loose them in the woodens wit the Biggum wordles. Donald Trump is an Illegal candidate.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Thursday December 21 2023, @02:16PM (1 child)
I'm functionally illiterate and I'm not an RWNJ (yet).
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 21 2023, @09:38PM
Give it time, turgid! You are still too young to be a Tory.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by turgid on Thursday December 21 2023, @11:13AM (11 children)
I'm still on Vim. Over the years I have used things like Turbo Pascal/Turbo C, Visual Studio, Eclipse, Netbeans and some weird embedded C IDEs (briefly until I figured out how to write their equivalent of Makefiles by hand and then automatically).
When you are new to coding, an IDE can be very helpful. It completely eliminates a large part of the learning curve, making compilation and running just the press of a button, and being able to go straight into a debugger to see what your code really does. When you are doing something big and scary like Java or C++, being able to automatically look up class members and types is great.
Once you get to a certain level though, a good editor like vim and an environment like Linux makes you far more productive. Over the years I have developed my own little shell scripts to automate mundane tasks that even IDEs can't do without clicking loads of buttons. Grep and sed are so useful. Make is so useful.
Linux (well, Unix) is one giant IDE and all the parts fit together like Lego. It's also relatively easy to make your own tools to fit in alongside the others to do the specific jobs you need doing, and to fit your own programming style.
Things like neovim and tree-sitter have come along while I wasn't looking (thanks young people for showing them to me). I could never go back to an IDE.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 4, Funny) by The Vocal Minority on Saturday December 23 2023, @03:48AM (8 children)
Ah yes...that's also why I use Vim...because I'm a good programmer...honest ;)
(Score: 3, Insightful) by turgid on Saturday December 23 2023, @02:55PM (7 children)
I use vim because I can't be bothered to learn anything else.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday January 02 2024, @06:04PM (6 children)
If your programs never exceed 10k of source code, simple editors are probably better than learning a bunch of shifting IDE specific cruft.
As your total project source starts to exceed 100k the value of that cruft increases quite a bit.
Real time (as you type) static analysis isn't a bad thing, either.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by turgid on Tuesday January 02 2024, @06:56PM (5 children)
gcc is so good these days it gives you most of the benefits of static analysis. If you are programming with TDD, you are continuously editing, compiling, refactoring, compiling etc. so you're getting almost-real-time static analysis.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Tuesday January 02 2024, @07:43PM (4 children)
When it is tuned well, the as you type static analysis is really helpful. My current deploy and test cycle takes 20 minutes for the full build, I probably do that 5+ times a day, and none of the silly oversight mistakes get kicked back because they are highlighted in the editor before I even commit the changes.
I don't see much, if any, difference between static analysis and gcc warnings/errors. I mean, there are static analysis tools that try to look deeper, but I don't find much value in those, their signal to noise ratio is way too low.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 2) by turgid on Tuesday January 02 2024, @10:44PM (3 children)
Your IDE is probably just running the compiler underneath anyway to get the feedback. A 20 minute deploy and test cycle for a full build is quite reasonable, but isn't your code modular? Can't you compile and test smaller chunks?
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday January 02 2024, @11:37PM
Our full suite for one of our critical systems takes almost an hour and a half to complete the critical path in wall time. However, one of the benefits of having engineered the system the way we have is that we don't have to run the full suite for each change. Instead, we have layers of tests and run a subset at most stages of development. A great technique we use is that the choice of tests run at lower layers is automatically determined by the dependency graph of the changed files. That way you aren't waiting around for tests whose results won't change and we don't waste resources running them.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by JoeMerchant on Wednesday January 03 2024, @01:40AM (1 child)
I forget the name, I think it is llvm they run to get the real time analysis, it's somewhat fooled by complex macros so it's not doing a full compile.
The code is modular, I can compile a module in seconds for local changes, but some of what I do splashes changes across the whole system so a full recompile is needed to see the whole system effects.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday January 03 2024, @05:42AM
It could be scan-build/CodeChecker. But both have knowledge of the complete translation unit and that includes macros because it does a special type of compilation. This doesn't sound exactly like what you are talking about but is very common and close.
I do have a word of caution. Depending on what you mean by "fooled by complex macros," you could be talking about macros that fool either the symbolic execution of scan-build or whatever tool you are referencing. However, if your problem is only limited to "complex macros," there is a chance that the analysis tool is pointing to a real bug in your code that is being overlooked because of how the preprocessor is treating its input. Some most common ones are given in the GCC docs. [gnu.org] I'd suggest giving a very careful reading to the output of your preprocessor, just in case. You could also try reporting it to the tool's team, at least to cut down on the false positive noise that may be hiding real bugs.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by VLM on Sunday December 24 2023, @06:25PM (1 child)
Let me guess, that STM32 system workbench thing. I WTF pretty hard at that IDE and your description sounds familiar.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Sunday December 24 2023, @09:01PM
It might have been. It was a few years ago. I had an unfortunate colleague who had to work with all these weird chips and there special compilers and IDEs. There was one where short was a single bit. I asked him whether it was signed or unsigned and got a colourful response.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 3, Interesting) by DannyB on Thursday December 21 2023, @03:41PM
I use both Visual Studio and Eclipse since I'm now on the team of a big C# project as well as the Java project I've worked on for many years. So I voted for Eclipse since it is the underdog.
If I ever get around to it I would like to set up VSCode because I understand it has support for Clojure. I once enjoyed extensively playing with Clojure on Eclipse, but then Counterclockwise quit working. Counterclockwise was the Clojure plug in to give Clojure support to Eclipse.
People who think Republicans wouldn't dare destroy Social Security or Medicare should ask women about Roe v Wade.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by Rich on Thursday December 21 2023, @05:15PM (1 child)
It's required for my major customer projects, which keeps me on Macs as main platform. Those went from MPW through CodeWarrior to XCode. And I even use it for AVR projects through external makefiles that tap into the binaries inside Arduino.app (1.8.x). Good enough and saves me from juggling with multiple IDEs.
Occasionally, I'm asked to do minor Windows / CE stuff, which is done in VS proper - but often legacy versions for legacy projects; all on customer machines, I don't keep Windows kit around aside from what came with second-hand ThinkPads (that now boot into Linux by default). At other times, some Linux kernel work was required, which I've mostly done with Kate (from KDE, but running under GNOME 2 or MATE). For some quick crossplatform stuff, QTCreator also got involved.
(Score: 2) by bart9h on Tuesday January 02 2024, @01:07PM
I was required to produce a Mac installer for the product I was developing. I installed XCode, but then only used it's compiler from the command line (not directly, cmake would take care of that for me).
brew.sh helped me setup the comfortable IDE I was used to: vim, git, tmux, etc
(Score: 3, Interesting) by HiThere on Thursday December 21 2023, @10:45PM (1 child)
If I'm not using Java, I'll use Geany. If I am, I use NetBeans. But recently I've been moving away from Java and towards c++.
OTOH, is Geany just a text editor? It feels sort of half-way between a text editor and a simple IDE.
Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 21 2023, @11:22PM
Geany is an IDE. It is just a more lightweight version of one out of the box. Instead, a lot of the IDE features the more complete ones have out of the box are built using plugins or support scripts.
(Score: 2) by JoeMerchant on Friday December 22 2023, @01:15AM
Qt Creator since 2006.
It went back and forth for a while vs Visual Studio with Qt plugins but like all things Microsoft I found myself "serving the tool" instead of the other way around far more in Visual Studio.
Ironically, chose Qt over Apple's native Carbon/Cocoa at the time and discovered that Qt and Creator "just works" as compared to the Apple tools or Eclipse for FPGA or other things I have tried since then.
🌻🌻 [google.com]
(Score: 3, Interesting) by maxwell demon on Friday December 22 2023, @06:51AM (3 children)
At home: XEmacs
At work: various IDEs, depending on the project.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 22 2023, @03:54PM (1 child)
At home: XEmacs
Oh, you're one of those.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 23 2023, @12:05AM
At least it's not EmacsD.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 23 2023, @01:37PM
A large percentage of those who use any variety of emacs as an IDE will probably be needing Depends. Just sayin.
(Score: 2) by mhajicek on Saturday December 23 2023, @02:03AM
I program in Mastercam, unless I'm doing Fanuc Macro B, in which case I use NC Plot.
The spacelike surfaces of time foliations can have a cusp at the surface of discontinuity. - P. Hajicek
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday December 23 2023, @03:26PM
(Vi+lldb+inotifywait)/tmux
(Score: 3, Insightful) by canopic jug on Saturday December 23 2023, @08:01PM
I mostly stick with Emacs, as it is enough of a IDE for many languages. However, editor aside the GNU/Linux or *BSDs are themselves IDEs if used with skill. On their own they are more than suitable for quite a few languages and the most an editor can add would be syntax highlighting. Java, I guess, is one of the exceptions since so many classes have to be tracked.
Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Sunday December 24 2023, @06:27PM (4 children)
No fans of the Sublime Text? Kind of commercialized emacs sorta kinda. In the sense that Dwarf Fortress is the real thing and Rim World is the commercialized version.
One thing I don't like about ST is the license is "lifelong" but temporary. I think they're up to version 4 now. I don't like the "We've decided you get to 'donate' for the next version now" attitude so I moved away but ST was pretty nice at one point.
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Thursday January 04 2024, @12:57PM (3 children)
I use sublime if I am in a gui (normally), vim if I am in a terminal. I find vim is harder to use, but probably I just don't know how.
(Score: 2) by VLM on Thursday January 04 2024, @03:35PM (2 children)
Interesting, I also use vim but the criteria for me seems to be time based, if its a one-liner and less than five minutes work then its vim time and if I brew a pot of tea for a long night its "some fancy IDE".
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Thursday January 04 2024, @05:26PM (1 child)
That makes sense - IDE often has a bit of set-up faff; even just finding the file/etc in a gui already takes longer than Ctrl-t to open a terminal and then `vim path/to/my_file'
(Score: 3, Insightful) by VLM on Friday January 05 2024, @02:44PM
Yeah, startup is slow, then it updates the IDE software on its schedule not mine, then it updates the extensions on its schedule not mine, then I have to learn the changes in the IDE on its schedule not mine, then I have to learn the changes in any extensions I'm using on its schedule not mine, finally I get to change the header of the TPS report in about 5 seconds.
Its almost as bad and expensive as SaaS 'solutions'.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by acid andy on Monday December 25 2023, @12:29AM (7 children)
CodeLite for most of my own projects. It seems to have its quirks but it's a nice IDE.
If I'm just changing a few lines of something then I use one of a number of text editors. Not vi or emacs though, unless I have no choice. I'm sure they're very powerful once you learn all the keyboard shortcuts but life's too short for me to do that--plenty of other things to learn instead.
Consumerism is poison.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 25 2023, @06:01AM (6 children)
I've heard a number of recommendations for CodeLite lately. Can you expand on what you like about it and how it compares to other environments you have used?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by acid andy on Tuesday December 26 2023, @12:10AM (5 children)
In my darker days of coding on Windows, I cut my teeth on Visual Studio and honestly found it usable up to about the 2008 interface. Anyone who's used to that will feel at home with CodeLite's interface, which I see as a good thing. It's got good support for building GUI applications with wxWidgets, Qt or the GTK, can generate CMake or GNU makefiles and integrates with the gdb debugger with nice tabs for the call stack, watch lists, disassembly, etc. There may be better FOSS IDEs on Linux but this did just what I needed so I've stuck with it. When I was looking for one, Code::Blocks seemed to be the other popular one at the time but for whatever reason that wouldn't work straight away on my system and CodeLite did.
Consumerism is poison.
(Score: 2) by coolgopher on Monday January 01 2024, @01:35PM (4 children)
After Visual Studio 6 it seems to just be downhill. Thankfully I haven't had to develop for Windows in over a decade.
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Monday January 01 2024, @03:57PM (3 children)
Pretty much except that from what I can remember things like Intellisense (autocomplete) and tools to find references to functions and variables came later or at least were improved in the versions that followed. The languages got better too. I think it probably peaked around 2003. 2007 is apparently when M$ Office introduced the ribbon and IMHO everything got really unpleasant to use in the years that followed.
Consumerism is poison.
(Score: 2) by coolgopher on Monday January 01 2024, @09:22PM (2 children)
I'd sooner take Clippy than that useless confusing changing cluttered abomination known as the ribbon!
(Score: 2) by acid andy on Monday January 01 2024, @10:16PM (1 child)
I quite agree. I think a whole load of user interfaces were being ruined around the time the ribbon came in, across many platforms. It was around the time the iPhone came out. It seems I was wrong about Intellisense, and that Visual Studio 6 had it, but apparently it wasn't as good in Visual C++ then as Visual Basic.
Consumerism is poison.
(Score: 2) by coolgopher on Monday January 01 2024, @11:28PM
Both Microsoft and Apple had excellent human interface guidelines/standards. Then they both decided to ignore their own guidelines because, I dunno, shiny?!, and well, here we are. 😞
(Score: 2) by jimbrooking on Tuesday December 26 2023, @02:34AM
Full Stack website development: Html, JS, CSS, PHP, MySQL
(Score: -1, Spam) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 26 2023, @07:53PM
Apropos the frontpage article, could it be that some are software engineering without a license? Ought to Runaway from such activities. Epic and (k)hollow fails.
(Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday December 26 2023, @10:04PM
During my sentence of employment, I used vim, various other text editors, and Visual Studio. The last few years I managed to move to database design because I was so burned out on programming I was having nightmares of the code coming alive to kill me. I still dream in entity-relationship diagrams at times, and awake screaming.
But all that's behind me now, and I read programming-related items with the amusement of one released from hell must have towards the damned. Retirement can be boring at times, but at least I'm just a stinkin' user now, and life is pretty good.
I shall code no more, forever.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by mendax on Tuesday December 26 2023, @11:17PM (8 children)
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DannyB on Tuesday January 02 2024, @03:05PM (7 children)
IDEs do a whole lot more.
Select an identifier, right-click --> Refactor --> Rename, small dialog box pops up, type in new name for identifier; it is renamed everywhere in the entire code base according to the understanding of the compiler of that identifier, not just a silly search/replace. After all, the identifier "j" might be used many times and I don't want to change every "j" to "jane", just this particular one, its declaration, and all actual usages of this one.
Select these six lines, right-click --> Refactor --> Extract to new method, small dialog pops up asking for new method name. It Replaces those six lines with a function call, and adds a new function with the six lines right after the current function.
Templates, you can type in "for", then hit a key combo and the following is typed in for you:
for (var [i] = 1; [i] []; [i]++) {
}
The square braces above are actually editable boxes in the text. If you edit any of the [i], then all of them are changed together keystroke by keystroke as you replace variable [i] with some other name. There are similar templates for many other common constructs. You can add your own templates to the IDE.
I am just scratching the tip of the popsicle.
You can dig a ditch with a spoon instead of dealing with the noise and complexity of a backhoe. But the backhoe is a lot faster once you know how to use it.
People who think Republicans wouldn't dare destroy Social Security or Medicare should ask women about Roe v Wade.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Tuesday January 02 2024, @06:59PM (3 children)
It might be that you need a higher-level language if you need your IDE to do that sort of work? You're probably not programming in the right language for the job.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Wednesday January 03 2024, @02:48PM (2 children)
I was using the same language before I used an IDE. I began using the IDE because it made routine things easier. As I learned more and more of what it could do, I took advantage of that. I kept finding more things it could do for me. I keep finding new things, without actively seeking them out.
The examples I pointed out are things I could waste time manually doing that the IDE does in a few keystrokes. The language is no different.
People who think Republicans wouldn't dare destroy Social Security or Medicare should ask women about Roe v Wade.
(Score: 2) by turgid on Wednesday January 03 2024, @03:21PM (1 child)
I was just thinking that we in general should be pushing harder for more powerful languages.
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 3, Insightful) by DannyB on Wednesday January 03 2024, @05:59PM
I completely agree with that. The need for very low level languages will always be with us. But more powerful languages which abstract you away from the hardware are a good thing. Languages should make it easier to express complex ideas in simple ways, along with powerful ways to work with complex structures.
People who think Republicans wouldn't dare destroy Social Security or Medicare should ask women about Roe v Wade.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by mendax on Wednesday January 03 2024, @09:15PM (2 children)
I didn't say that I haven't used IDE's. Indeed, my first IDE was the original Turbo Pascal on some PC clone in the 1980's. Later, I used Turbo C in DOS for a long time, then Borland C++ for Windows development, then Visual J++ for Java development (and at the time the only Java IDE that had debugger that wasn't so riddled with bugs as to be non-functional), then Codewarrior (I still have the Codewarrior T-shirt wearing Tux doll I got at some trade show twenty years ago), then some Symantec IDE whose name I have long forgotten, then Borland's JBuilder, then NetBeans. I've even fiddled with Eclipse but never really liked it. Netbeans and the latest Java SDK are on my computer today but I rarely use them. Most of the time when I need to write a program on my Mac, I just write C code in VIM and compile it with GCC. As you can imagine, they are very simple, non-GUI programs.
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 04 2024, @06:17AM (1 child)
Symantec's Visual Cafe was an interesting IDE. I mainly used it for its CORBA support (something I'm glad seems to be mostly unused today). But our Java people loved it compared to the alternatives at the time.
(Score: 2) by mendax on Thursday January 04 2024, @08:59AM
Ah, that was it. Visual Cafe! I didn't do anything like CORBA with it but Java does have something called RMI, which stands for Remote Method Invocation which was if I remember right some sort of customized implementation of CORBA just for interprocess communication between Java programs. CORBA was messy to put it mildly. But then look at SOAP, which is something that I did use to define an interface I designed, published as a WSDL, and used in Java to communicate with non-Java apps using that interface.
If CORBA is shit, then SOAP is the shit smeared around to look like a smiley face. SOAP works but was hardly lightweight since apps on both sides of the SOAP message had to use a fair amount of CPU time to parse XML documents containing the parameter data and the response. REST's introduction was a welcome change. And JSON is also a big improvement as a way to format interprocess data in a more human-readable format to make debugging easier. Debugging SOAP messages was painful but I guess there are some people in the business who are masochists.
It's really quite a simple choice: Life, Death, or Los Angeles.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by hendrikboom on Tuesday January 02 2024, @11:28PM (2 children)
For writing Racket programs (a variant of Scheme, which descend form Lip) I use drRacket.
For everything else, emacs and the command line.
-- hendrik
(Score: 2) by turgid on Wednesday January 03 2024, @04:03PM (1 child)
What sort if performance do you get from Racket?
I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent [wikipedia.org].
(Score: 3, Informative) by hendrikboom on Wednesday January 03 2024, @11:34PM
Adequate, but not great. I use it for simple graphics programs. The hard work is done in OpenGL, not in Racket.
In DrRacket it used to compile to bytecode, and then the bytecode is interpreted. At least this is the version I get from the oldstable release of Devuan.
The new version (which I've not yet installed) translates to Chez Scheme, which I'm told compiles to .zo files, which contain machine code, and seems to be faster. I don't expect to get this speed in DrRacket, because DrRacket contains a lot of overhead to be helpful when things go wrong.
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Wednesday January 03 2024, @07:27PM
I pretty much have settled on PyCharm + Python for the foreseeable future. Though, C# + Visual Studio isn't terribly difficult either.
I mostly just use Python to make my job easier.
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"