Submitted via IRC for Bytram
US finally giving boot to official foot measurement
Change is afoot for the official measuring stick used to size up big places in America.
The reason? There are actually two different definitions of the 12-inch measurement known as a foot.
Some land surveyors use what's known as the U.S. survey foot. Others use the definition that's more accepted by the broader world: the international foot.
The difference between them is so tiny that you can't see it with the naked eye on a 12-inch ruler. But over big distances, it matters. So, to reduce the chance for errors and confusion, the federal government has announced it's finally giving the boot to the survey foot.
The international foot is the smaller one—adding about an eighth of an inch of difference when measuring a mile. That means the United States is 28.3 feet wider when measured using the international foot instead of the survey foot.
The change started in 1959, when the federal government mandated that everyone use the international foot but allowed surveyors to keep to the old U.S. survey foot for a while. That temporary reprieve has lasted 60 years, but it will finally end in 2022, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration and the National Institute of Standards and Technology announced in October.
(Score: 2) by black6host on Sunday December 15 2019, @09:07PM
I knew this was going to happen. I toe y'all so!
(Score: 2) by ikanreed on Sunday December 15 2019, @09:10PM (12 children)
Solution: standardize to one specific insanity.
(Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:56PM (9 children)
Planck length.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday December 16 2019, @04:09PM (8 children)
Question: Aren't all lengths an exact integer multiple of the Planck length?
Are all time measurements an exact integer multiple of Planck time?
Velocity would be distance per time, thus one Planck unit divided by another, so even velocity would be an integer multiple of some base units.
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(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday December 16 2019, @05:33PM (3 children)
Including averages?
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday December 16 2019, @05:48PM (2 children)
That's interesting. But is an average an actual measurement or is it really a calculation? You never measure the average something or other.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 2) by All Your Lawn Are Belong To Us on Monday December 16 2019, @10:43PM (1 child)
True, although I do take the measure of a man. So therefore people are integers also.
No, DON'T go looking for the post hoc in that one.... By the way, I also weigh the same as a duck.
This sig for rent.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday December 17 2019, @02:46PM
Thinking more about this. Suppose you took measurements in Planck lengths. Then took the average. You could end up with a non-integer average. So not all stated lengths are integer multiples of the Planck length -- even if the Planck length is your unit of measure.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 4, Interesting) by maxwell demon on Monday December 16 2019, @06:20PM (3 children)
Actually one Planck length per Planck time is the speed of light. Therefore in Planck units, the only integer speeds are zero and light speed.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Monday December 16 2019, @09:25PM
Perfect! One foot is now defined as the distance light travels in vacuum in one nanosecond's worth of Planck times.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Tuesday December 17 2019, @02:48PM (1 child)
Very interesting. Suppose speeds were measured as ratios of distance per time. I am supposing that a speed could have a ratio that cannot be reduced to an integer.
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Tuesday December 17 2019, @03:21PM
Actually at least in one dimension, one can get a speed one limit from a simple discrete model quite easily:
Imagine there's a row of places. At each time step, a particle can either stay at the same place, or go to the next place. A particle that always stays has speed 0, a particle that always moves in the same direction has speed 1.
Other speeds are achieved by the particle sometimes staying and sometimes moving. For example, if a particle moves every second time, its speed is 0.5.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 5, Informative) by driverless on Monday December 16 2019, @12:00AM
I particularly like the term "international foot", it's about as international as the World Series is worldwide (unless you count use in Myanmar and Liberia as making something "international").
(Score: 3, Funny) by FatPhil on Monday December 16 2019, @01:32AM
Options available:
- adopt sanity now
- adopt slightly less insane insane-lookalikes now
Choice taken:
- permit full insanity to continue for 60+ years
Enjoy crashing things into mars for the next 6 decades!
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 5, Touché) by Rosco P. Coltrane on Sunday December 15 2019, @09:12PM (24 children)
everybody's moved on and gone metric, and left imperial units in the century they belong to.
The US leads the world in so many things, yet is so backwards in so many others. What a strange country...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @09:22PM
Leave the imperial measurement alone, the wild west still needs it. pew pew!
(Score: 5, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:00PM (9 children)
Back in seventh grade, here in the US, our science teacher at the start of the school year gave the class the chance to vote on what measurement system to use for the year in the class. Myself and one other person voted for metric, the rest for the traditional US units. The teacher gravely bowed to the will of the students.
Then he started putting up on the blackboard (we still had blackboards back then) lists of traditional units from the length, volume, mass categories. Not just feet, yards, and inches or ounces and pounds, but furlongs, rods, leagues, stones, hogsheads, bushels, drams, pennyweights, etc. There were over 80 in total. Our assignment: from each category (length, mass, etc), express each unit in terms of all the other units. So that we had to compute how many inches in a furlong, and in a league, etc; as well as how many leagues in an inch, and in a furlong, etc.
It took a long time. Have you ever calculated how many furlongs there are in a light-year? I have. So I got that going for me.
The next day the teacher kindly permitted the class to retake the vote. Metric won.
That was 40 years ago. We're still not using metric here in the US. We still use pennies, too. With freedom (what's left of it) comes some suboptimal decisions sometimes.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:50PM (8 children)
> Our assignment: ...
If you took the time to read the story behind some of the more "unusual" units, it would be a good history lesson by itself. Guess your teacher didn't push you quite that far? I like units that scale by 4, 12 or 16, down with the tyranny of 10, just because most people have 10 fingers (I have a friend with 8).
(Score: 3, Touché) by driverless on Monday December 16 2019, @12:06AM (3 children)
The history behind the metric system OTOH is more rational, and can be expressed in a single sentence: The crazy units of the Ancien Régime are being dropped, from now on we're using metric, any objectors please form a line behind the guillotine over there.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by kazzie on Monday December 16 2019, @04:48AM (2 children)
In that context, it's a little surprising that the young upstart US didn't adopt the metric system with open arms.
(Score: 3, Informative) by maxwell demon on Monday December 16 2019, @06:26PM (1 child)
It's the pirates' fault. [sciencealert.com]
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @10:06PM
Beat me to it!
(Score: 5, Funny) by MostCynical on Monday December 16 2019, @02:50AM
Need "-2 unfortunate" mod, for your friend.
"I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @08:06AM
Really? You've got a friend? What's that like?
(Score: 2) by PiMuNu on Monday December 16 2019, @12:22PM
In rural china they use base 12 and count on knuckles. Much more sensible! And only requires 4 fingers.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday December 16 2019, @04:16PM
Even people with fewer than ten fingers still learn arithmetic from childhood in base 10 and become fluent in it.
The "tyranny of 10" is really the lubrication of compatible standardized number systems so that it is easy for everyone to easily communicate and conduct commerce.
Customer: "I demand to buy 5 pounds of beef, but in base 12. Because I don't want to conform to societal norms."
Butcher: "see this sharp cleaver here? Please go away! Now! Don't ever come back!"
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 2) by PartTimeZombie on Sunday December 15 2019, @11:17PM (5 children)
That was my thought oo,
AKA the metre.
(Score: 2) by kazzie on Monday December 16 2019, @04:49AM (2 children)
No, that's the international yard.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @07:10AM (1 child)
What about the international milk shake then?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @12:08PM
That brings all the girls.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday December 16 2019, @04:18PM (1 child)
Ah, but what about American meters?
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Monday December 16 2019, @09:43PM
Right -- defined as either:
That works, right? Even more divisibility options than the yard.
(Score: 4, Funny) by barbara hudson on Sunday December 15 2019, @11:35PM (2 children)
So next the US will standardize on the hexadecimal foot - 16 inches per foot, 16 feet per yard, 16 yards per furlong, 16 furlongs per mile. So the new mile will be a a few percent more than now.
SoylentNews is social media. Says so right in the slogan. Soylentnews is people, not tech.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday December 16 2019, @03:48AM (1 child)
Makes sense to me. The only reason you base ten pansies cling so tightly to your antiquated system is because you still count on your fingers.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2) by krishnoid on Monday December 16 2019, @09:45PM
"Arithmetic is being able to count to twenty without taking off your shoes." -- Mickey Mouse
(Score: 3, Informative) by Coward, Anonymous on Sunday December 15 2019, @11:51PM (3 children)
I've got plenty of 0.1 inch pin headers in my electronics bin. The metric world uses the same parts.
(Score: 3, Funny) by deimtee on Monday December 16 2019, @07:48AM
No, ours are 2.54 mm pin headers. Much more sensible.
200 million years is actually quite a long time.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @08:09AM (1 child)
Are you sure they are not 2.5mm pin headers instead of 2.54mm?
(Score: 2) by Coward, Anonymous on Monday December 16 2019, @08:30AM
I'm sur about my stock. Are you sure about yours? My Raspberry Pi zero needed a 2x20 header. I don't even think 2.5 mm pitch would fit without violence.
(Score: 2) by bart on Sunday December 15 2019, @09:56PM
You're kidding right?
(Score: 0, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:01PM (2 children)
My foot is exactly 12 US inches. Now I have to trim my toenails to conform to some commie international foot bullshit? Will the lady at the shoe store still be overwhelmed at my shoe size now that it's smaller? Will I have to get the next size smaller condom now?
Did I ever tell you about the condom I filled up with helium at work? That sucker blew up to 3 feet long and about 6 inches wide. It looked like the Hindenburg when I let it go at work, but got stuck in the roof overhang. It was there for 2 weeks.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday December 16 2019, @03:48AM (1 child)
Doesn't matter if you're not a surveyor.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @05:38PM
Only surveyors look up?
(Score: 3, Funny) by maxwell demon on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:11PM (2 children)
At the end of the article, there's the following text:
Which raises the question: US foot care, or international foot care? ;-)
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @10:59PM (1 child)
It doesn't matter. Obamacare won't cover it and pharmaceuticals will rape your savings.
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Monday December 16 2019, @07:10AM
Last I checked, Obamacare was US only.
So at least that one should definitely differ between US foot care and international foot care.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 4, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @11:10PM (5 children)
Can't remember the last time a President made the country bigger. And bigger is greater. So he really did #MAGA
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Sunday December 15 2019, @11:55PM (1 child)
How much did Russia influence this? Impeach!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @02:01AM
You've got it wrong, impeachment isn't about what the Russians did. Trump's request for them to hack his opponents was criminal enough, but those really are some of the lesser crimes he has committed.
But you were just being silly, doubt you're ready to integrate Trump's betrayals into your world view.
(Score: 2) by DannyB on Monday December 16 2019, @04:23PM (2 children)
Most people would call it cheating to claim that the country is actually bigger just because you changed the units of measurement.
By that argument any US president could claim that his private member is of an acceptable size simply by altering the units of measurements to, let's just call it, "Trump inches".
The server will be down for replacement of vacuum tubes, belts, worn parts and lubrication of gears and bearings.
(Score: 3, Interesting) by DeathMonkey on Monday December 16 2019, @06:43PM (1 child)
Well it's an improvement over simply lying about imaginary floors to make a building taller!
Trump Tower is actually 10 floors shorter than Donald Trump says it is [businessinsider.com]
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Monday December 16 2019, @07:56PM
No, Trump doesn't lie, he just uses alternative counting. :-)
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @12:11AM (3 children)
cant divide base 10 easily. base 12 (inches in foot) can half/quarter/third into full numbers which is very handy for building.
16th/64th inch for the same reason.
that's why its still used, base 10 is just as arbitrary as base 12.
(Score: 3, Touché) by pe1rxq on Monday December 16 2019, @12:41AM (1 child)
So.....you want everyone to suffer just because some builders are either bad at math or just plain idiots?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @03:43AM
no im telling you why its still used.
baseing is arbitrary the math is the same., you should use whatever makes the job easiest.
(Score: 2) by maxwell demon on Monday December 16 2019, @06:51PM
People have universally employed the decimal system for numbers. One might argue that the duodecimal system would have been a better choice, but given that the decimal system is here to stay, it is reasonable to adapt the measurement system to that.
That said, a measurement system based strictly on the factor 12 would still be much more reasonable than the mess that are the US customary units.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
(Score: 2) by Coward, Anonymous on Monday December 16 2019, @12:21AM
Some states in the US [noaa.gov] already use the international foot for surveying, others use the US foot, and some don't care. Who knew that Montana, Arizona, and South Carolina were ahead of the curve?
(Score: 3, Interesting) by inertnet on Monday December 16 2019, @01:28AM (2 children)
I learned in (a European) school that an inch is 25.4 mm, but used to be 25.401 mm until about mid previous century. I'm not sure if the 25.401 mm inch was an American or English version. They may have been slightly different in the past.
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday December 16 2019, @03:50AM (1 child)
Just do like I do and find the nearest inchworm.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 16 2019, @07:54AM
In Oz, we went metric long ago, so we have to find one of these [wikipedia.org]