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posted by martyb on Monday June 01 2020, @04:21AM   Printer-friendly
from the ***=|*|*=*|=*==||*|*=|*=*|*=**|=*==||*==|**|=****=|**=*|** dept.

[20200601_233900 UTC: updated to elide a couple paragraphs and update suggestion to read original article.--martyb]

US court grants permission to recover Marconi telegraph from Titanic wreckage:

When RMS Titanic struck an iceberg on April 14, 1912, crew members sent out numerous distress signals to any other ships in the vicinity using what was then a relatively new technology: a Marconi wireless telegraph system. More than 1,500 passengers and crew perished when the ship sank a few hours later. Now, in what is likely to be a controversial decision, a federal judge has approved a salvage operation to retrieve the telegraph from the deteriorating wreckage, The Boston Globe has reported.

Lawyers for the company RMS Titanic Inc.—which owns more than 5,000 artifacts salvaged from the wreck—filed a request in US District Court in Alexandria, Virginia, arguing that the wireless telegraph should be salvaged because the ship's remains are likely to collapse sometime in the next several years, rendering "the world's most famous radio" inaccessible. US District Judge Rebecca Beach Smith concurred in her ruling, noting that salvaging the telegraph "will contribute to the legacy left by the indelible loss of the Titanic, those who survived, and those who gave their lives in the sinking."

However, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) is fiercely opposed to the salvage mission. The agency argues in court documents that the telegraph should be left undisturbed, since it is likely to be surrounded "by the mortal remains of more than 1500 people." Judge Smith countered in her decision that the proposed expedition meets international requirements: for instance, it is justified on scientific and cultural grounds and has taken into account any potential damage to the wreck.

[...] This latest ruling is bound to generate more controversy, given that the expedition's plans call for "surgically" removing the telegraph from the hull, risking further damage. (It's believed that the telegraph is located in a deck house near the grand staircase.) According to an Associated Press report, the company's 60-page plan calls for an uncrewed submersible to pass through a skylight. If that doesn't work, the expedition would cut through the roof, which is already heavily corroded. Then a "suction dredge" will remove any loose silt, and the submersible's arms will cut through any electrical cords.

The linked story at Ars Technica goes into considerable detail on the history of how several famous people vied for the claim of creator of telegraphy and wireless communications — well worth reading the entire article.


Original Submission

Related Stories

First Full-sized 3D Scan of the Wreck of the Titanic 5 comments

Deep sea researchers have used two submersibles to make the first full, 3-dimensional scan of the wreck of the sunken passenger ship, The Titanic, including much of the 3-mile long debris field. This is a major step forward in evidence-based analysis of the wreck from over a hundred years ago.

The new scan was "devoid of that," he said, adding, "It is completely based on data and not human interpretation and that is why we are now seeing it in its larger context for the first time ever."

Atlantic Productions said "one major area of deterioration" had already been observed in the officers' quarters. "This included the room of Captain Edward John Smith and discovered that the iconic captain's bathtub has now disappeared from view," it added.

"Now we're getting objective, so we can get really serious with the science of understanding the wreck," Stephenson said.

He added that he was "absolutely convinced," that the photogrammetry model would now be used "not just for Titanic, but for all underwater exploration," because it "ushers in a new phase of exploration and analysis."

Much of the wreck lies in two main pieces, far apart from each other, at a depth of about 4,000 meters. Around 700k images where taken and stitched together to created the model.

Previously:
(2022) Researchers Discover Wreck of Ship that Tried to Warn the Titanic
(2022) OceanGate Ramps Up the Research for its Second Deep-sea Expedition to the Titanic
(2020) An Aurora that Lit Up the Sky Over the Titanic Might Explain Why It Sank
(2020) US Court Grants Permission to Recover Marconi Telegraph from Titanic's Wreckage [Updated]
(2018) Finding the Titanic with ROVs and Navy Funding


Original Submission

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  • (Score: 3, Interesting) by Kell on Monday June 01 2020, @04:46AM (8 children)

    by Kell (292) on Monday June 01 2020, @04:46AM (#1001603)

    Who has jurisdiction? It's a British privately-flagged wreck in international waters, discovered by an american - what salvage law applies, which court needs to be petitioned?

    --
    Scientists ask questions. Engineers solve problems.
    • (Score: 1) by Mozillium on Monday June 01 2020, @04:52AM (3 children)

      by Mozillium (9952) on Monday June 01 2020, @04:52AM (#1001605)

      American salvage laws apply and American courts need to be petitioned. Any more questions?

      • (Score: 4, Informative) by Kell on Monday June 01 2020, @05:43AM

        by Kell (292) on Monday June 01 2020, @05:43AM (#1001616)

        Turns out it's actually more complex than that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wreck_of_the_RMS_Titanic#Ownership [wikipedia.org]

        --
        Scientists ask questions. Engineers solve problems.
      • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:53AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:53AM (#1001618)

        The wreck is also protected by UNESCO convention, so it's not at all as simple as "Americans found it, so it's our courts".

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:29AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:29AM (#1001638)

        International law of the sea, biatches! Rogue nations like the United States of Trump no longer are signatories, so they can be fired upon at will.

    • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:49AM (3 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:49AM (#1001617)

      The rest of the world looks to the United States for leadership. Democrats dislike America and would like to diminish the United States to weaken our presence internationally. I'm glad Odumba only had eight years, so he couldn't complete his plan to make America puny and weak. As long as the Democrats don't get their way, American leadership is still what matters.

      - snruter rotsac

      • (Score: 0, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:31AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:31AM (#1001639)

        Fucking Nazi! We will find you, and kill you, and sink you with topedoes and malasadas! Democrats are the real Americans, Republicans have sold out to the Ruskies, and Turtle Man's Wife's family.

      • (Score: 2, Offtopic) by hendrikboom on Monday June 01 2020, @12:37PM (1 child)

        by hendrikboom (1125) Subscriber Badge on Monday June 01 2020, @12:37PM (#1001673) Homepage Journal

        couldn't complete his plan to make America puny and weak

        No. It took Trump to do that by betraying alliances that made America a player on the international scene.

        -- hendrik

        • (Score: 2, Touché) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:20PM

          by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:20PM (#1001691) Journal

          No. It took Trump to do that by betraying alliances that made America a player on the international scene.

          Asking allies to pay more of their fair share for the expenses of those alliances does not constitute "betrayal."

          NATO was created to hold the Warsaw Pact at bay during the opening moves of the Cold War. It also was meant to help war-torn Western Europe recover its military strength under an aegis that would avoid the mistakes of WWI (that is, to rehabilitate, not punish, Germany.) The US footed most of the bill to do that, and did for 70 years until Trump arrived. It had benefits for America initially, because it could sell its products to those places while their manufacturing bases recovered, and because it could exercise its leadership to American benefit. In recent decades, America's allies have used the money they were saving on defense to expand generous social programs and better the health, education, and general well-being of their populaces. America, meanwhile, has seen those indices slide for the last 40 years. The slide accelerated after NAFTA and various trade agreements under GATT, the WTO, and other mechanisms siphoned manufacturing out of the US and send it to China. The American middle class has been vanishing with it.

          Those are real factors, and all the data substantiate it.

          So under those circumstances asking those who have been saving hundreds of billions by charging it to America's account to pay more is reasonable. That you and others characterize it as "betrayal" demonstrates that the forces that have benefited from America's decline want it to continue. They don't want you to see news that contradicts that, nor see movies or television programs, or get any other sort of mass media message, that contradicts that. They want you to accept as natural reality that America should get weaker, and its people sicker and poorer. They want you to accept the inevitability of China's rise and imminent global supremacy. They want you and everyone else to accept that because it makes them personally richer to cast their lot with China than with their own countries.

          --
          Washington DC delenda est.
  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Mykl on Monday June 01 2020, @04:58AM (2 children)

    by Mykl (1112) on Monday June 01 2020, @04:58AM (#1001606)

    TFS already mentions that more than 5,000 artifacts have been salvaged from the wreck. Ongoing controversy notwithstanding, it seems to me that they have about 5,000 items of precedent.

    • (Score: 2) by Nuke on Monday June 01 2020, @08:46AM

      by Nuke (3162) on Monday June 01 2020, @08:46AM (#1001653)

      I was also trying to work out why this is different from the previous 5000 items. I'm guessing it is because things on the ship must be cut or broken to get to it - cables to the radio for example, and breaking a skylight. But the "Protectionists'" argument seems to be about human remains, which is nothing to do with that.

      Nor do I imagine that there are 1500 bodies piled around the radio and need shifting, like the word "surrounding" in TFA implies. They will surely be scattered over a mile or two of seabed.

    • (Score: 2) by martyb on Tuesday June 02 2020, @12:09AM

      by martyb (76) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 02 2020, @12:09AM (#1001949) Journal

      TFS already mentions that more than 5,000 artifacts have been salvaged from the wreck. Ongoing controversy notwithstanding, it seems to me that they have about 5,000 items of precedent.

      I can't speak for certain, but given the ship did split in half on its way down to the seafloor and wreckage was found over several square miles, I could see how a great number of artifacts could be recovered without needing to gain access to the ship itself. Then, with the ship split open, many cabin rooms' contents would be accessible without need for much ingress to the ship.

      The telegraph, on the other hand, would most likely have been constructed into the ship itself. Most certainly it would have had its own room. Further, given the description, it is in a less accessible part of the wreck. That could required further "de-construction" to gain access to the wireless. Then comes the matter of trying to extricate the device through the hull. The ROV may been able to get in, but could need a larger hole for the telegraph to get taken out.

      --
      Wit is intellect, dancing.
  • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:58AM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:58AM (#1001607)

    This is a perfect example of white privilege. In fact, the Titanic, itself, is a symbol of white privilege. The white people on upper decks were able to escape on lifeboats while the people of color on lower decks drowned. White people didn't even value the lives of people of color enough to equip the TItanic with enough lifeboats. Even long after the passengers of color died, white people aren't satisfied and want to disturb the final resting place of people of color in order to recover a piece of long obsolete communications equipment. It's like white people are actually incapable of caring about black lives. This is exactly why the protests are occurring and must continue. Even so, white people want the protests to be "peaceful" so they're easier to ignore. Fuck your white privilege. Black lives matter. Show some respect for black people and don't disturb them in their final resting place.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @06:12AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @06:12AM (#1001621)

      You come to a new site fills with nerds and rage about a tragic maritime accident that happened over a century ago? Seriously, go outside - help one of your neighbors, learn a useful skill or something. Do something more worthwhile with your life.

    • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:22PM

      by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:22PM (#1001692) Journal

      Those poor people were white, too. Europe was not then full of other races eager to emigrate to America.

      --
      Washington DC delenda est.
    • (Score: 2) by meustrus on Monday June 01 2020, @04:59PM

      by meustrus (4961) on Monday June 01 2020, @04:59PM (#1001777)

      It's like white people are actually incapable of caring about black lives.

      Um, sorry to be pedantic and potentially insensitive, but black corpses are not the same thing as black lives. And if you really value their lost lives, you will want to preserve their memory. Letting the ocean dissolve it all into dust is how we forget about those who died, not how we respect them.

      --
      If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @10:21PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @10:21PM (#1001913)

      Inherently racist of you to imply blacks did not have access to lifeboats in the middle class - they did: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Philippe_Lemercier_Laroche [wikipedia.org]

      ...and if I may say. "Black lives matter" implies someone thinks they don't. I believe all lives matter. So Screw your generalization of an entire race. That, in and of itself, is racist. If you can't see that, maybe you aren't as smart as you think you are.

  • (Score: -1, Flamebait) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:21AM (5 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:21AM (#1001610)

    Seriously, fuck all white people. You fuckers are concerned about recovering old hardware from a sunken ship, knowing that nobody will ever use the hardware again. But you don't care about the lives of the unarmed black men who are killed by racist white police. Worse yet, the one comment here that actually acknowledges the problem has been censored to -1 by "moderators" using their white privilege. Fuck all white people. You are all racist pigs. Do something useful instead of worrying about recovering obsolete radios from sunken ships.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:25AM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:25AM (#1001611)

      Post of the year.

      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:37AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:37AM (#1001640)

        No, fuck all white people who think they are white! I am watching the protests for Floyd, and guess what? Mostly woke whites. All you white supremacist fucks are going to die miserably at the hand of your intellectually superior white folk. Seriously. Dead White fucks, who can't breath, because they are not smart enough, like Samuel Alito and Antonin Scalia, who could not breathe, but not because there was a cop in his throat. If I was white, I would be thinking about moving to the last white supremacist country, which is, . . . oh, sorry, there are not more! Sucks to be White, whitey!

    • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:31AM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:31AM (#1001614)

      I am racist due to the color of my skin?
      Then, so are you.
      Racist.

      • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:42AM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:42AM (#1001642)

        Ferk you, you Teutonics turd who's family has had to leave the Faterland, probably due to un-wergelded murder, or stealing candy bars, from children. I spit on your skin, not because of what color it is, but because of what stupid ideas you have about what it means. Looser! Idiota! Americano estupido! Baka-tari gaijin!

    • (Score: 1, Offtopic) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:34PM

      by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:34PM (#1001697) Journal

      Let's see how different formulations of your words read:

      Seriously, fuck all Jews. You fuckers are concerned about recovering old hardware from a sunken ship, knowing that nobody will ever use the hardware again. But you don't care about the lives of the unarmed black men who are killed by racist Jew police. Worse yet, the one comment here that actually acknowledges the problem has been censored to -1 by "moderators" using their Jewish privilege. Fuck all Jews. You are all racist pigs. Do something useful instead of worrying about recovering obsolete radios from sunken ships.

      Hmm, seems anti-Semitic to me. How about this?

      Seriously, fuck all Muslims. You fuckers are concerned about recovering old hardware from a sunken ship, knowing that nobody will ever use the hardware again. But you don't care about the lives of the unarmed black men who are killed by racist Muslim police. Worse yet, the one comment here that actually acknowledges the problem has been censored to -1 by "moderators" using their Muslim privilege. Fuck all Muslims. You are all racist pigs. Do something useful instead of worrying about recovering obsolete radios from sunken ships.

      That one sounds Islamophobic.

      It seems to me that blaming all white people for the actions of one white cop is like other categorical statements such as, "Jews are selfish, greedy, conniving, and evil," or "Black people are predisposed to crime," or "All Muslims are terrorists." It is bigoted.

      --
      Washington DC delenda est.
  • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @06:16AM (8 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @06:16AM (#1001622)

    It's legally reasonable that sharing a two or three sentence snippet of a story might constitute fair use, but SoylentNews frequently goes FAR beyond that. For example, this story reproduces several paragraphs from an ArsTechnica article. This story is not an outlier but the norm. It's quite rare that a SoylentNews story actually has original content instead of just ripping off someone else's work. I am quite certain SoylentNews doesn't have permission to do this. Worse yet, anyone can submit an article via IRC and the text is automatically copied by a bot to be displayed in the submissions queue. Permission isn't sought from the content owners before the bot reproduces the full text of stories on SoylentNews for all to see in the queue. This is a flagrant violation of the DMCA. SoylentNews has built a business around unauthorized reproduction of content created by others. If SoylentNews does not cease and desist, and if SoylentNews does not disable the frequently-abused spam mod, I will start going through past articles and the submissions queue, then notifying the owners of the content that it has probably been illegally reproduced here. Eat shit and die.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @11:39AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @11:39AM (#1001666)

      Frist prost, GNAA, goatse

    • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Monday June 01 2020, @01:39PM (3 children)

      You really need to brush up on US copyright law. Several paragraphs from a longer copyrighted work for reporting purposes has been perfectly legit fair use for going on three hundred years.

      As for the submissions, there are bots that submit the full text of a story. And none of them are run by SoylentNews. Legally, that's entirely on the bot-writer and the submitter. Our only legal obligation as far as user submissions go is to comply with or challenge properly submitted DMCA takedown requests.

      So, if you really want to waste tons of your time to get us in no legal trouble whatsoever, have at it. You're still going to keep getting slapped down for spamming.

      --
      My rights don't end where your fear begins.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:45PM (2 children)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:45PM (#1001765)

        Where did you get your law degree?

        • (Score: 3, Funny) by meustrus on Monday June 01 2020, @05:02PM

          by meustrus (4961) on Monday June 01 2020, @05:02PM (#1001780)

          Where did you?

          --
          If there isn't at least one reference or primary source, it's not +1 Informative. Maybe the underused +1 Interesting?
        • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Tuesday June 02 2020, @12:08PM

          You don't need to be a lawyer to know the law. You need to be a lawyer to be considered enough of an expert to represent someone else. Me, I've only closely followed copyright law decisions for a couple decades.

          --
          My rights don't end where your fear begins.
    • (Score: 2, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:38PM (2 children)

      by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:38PM (#1001698) Journal

      It's called an excerpt, and links back to the original source of the excerpt. The practice is long established on the Internet and has been adjudicated many times since. It is permissible to do what Soylent does.

      --
      Washington DC delenda est.
      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @11:26PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @11:26PM (#1001932)

        I'm not OP, but that person has a point legally. Yes, it is permissible to use an EXCERPT and has been long before the internet through Fair Use doctrine.

        However, I looked at the "summary" here (which is about 6 paragraphs) and then back at the original article (which is 17 paragraphs). Reproducing a THIRD or more of a copyrighted work is NOT something that would generally fall under Fair Use. There's no magic number for Fair Use, of course, and in limited circumstances courts have even ruled that 100% reproduction can sometimes be allowed, though certainly not in something like this.

        The other issue is that courts generally look at whether reproductions convey the "heart" of the original vs. some small portion. If the "summary" here (mostly just an excerpt) were simply the opening paragraph or two, that could probably be Fair Use. If the "summary" were a longer set of random sentences that were intended to make several other points in an external (non-quoted) argument, then Fair Use probably would apply.

        But cutting out 1/3 of a copyrighted work and giving all the primary info bits? That's probably over the line. I'm not criticizing SN as OP was, but it IS something to be cognizant of. However, the SN audience and hit count probably isn't big enough for SN to get sued.

        There is a simple fix, of course. Stop with the extended excerpts and instead just put in a paragraph or two of actual summary (not 1/3 of the original article). For people who want more, click through the damn link and RTFA. Or, alternatively, have editors and contributors write actual summaries, but there doesn't seem much enthusiasm for that around here.

        • (Score: 2) by martyb on Tuesday June 02 2020, @01:27AM

          by martyb (76) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 02 2020, @01:27AM (#1001977) Journal

          Yes, I am mindful of "fair use" restrictions when working on a story. As are all the editors.

          As you said, there is no clear line as to how much one is permitted to use. It is a battle I wage every time I edit a submission. (Background: an editor takes a story from the submissions queue, edits it as they deem necessary, picks a date/time, and then pushes it to to the story queue. We generally succeed in having a different editor look over those queued stories before it gets released to the main site. This is called "seconding a story".) There has been many a time when I trimmed a queued story down lest we risk violating fair use restrictions. Occasionally we get story submissions that, although interesting, are so short that no reasonably useful/intelligible excerpt could be extracted into a story for SoylentNews.

          The source article in this case was so much longer than what we normally get to work with, I went a little longer here than I'd usually do. That said, there is a lot that was left out... and only some of that was mentioned.

          It just so happens that after I saw the GGGP(?) comment [soylentnews.org] I brought it up with other staff members. I was reassured that we were protected by the DMCA. It was my raising the issue that led to TMB's reply [soylentnews.org].

          I've put waaaaay too much of my limited time into this site — including late-into-the-night stretches to make sure we had enough stories queued up until morning — to risk seeing it all come to naught. So, I was rather earnest about pushing for clear guidance!

          The upshot was that (1) anybody could sue us (with or without a valid reason) (2) Even if a complaint were issued to us, we had DMCA protecting us. In such a case we could simply take down the named content in a timely manner and we would be protected.

          So, thanks to that, I can breathe a little bit easier now!

          Still, I took the liberty of updating the story to elide a couple more paragraphs and to more strongly encourage the reader to refer back to the original article for more detail.

          The community spoke up. We listened. We responded. We all win. Much better than beta! =)

          --
          Wit is intellect, dancing.
  • (Score: 0, Troll) by Username on Monday June 01 2020, @07:41AM (10 children)

    by Username (4557) on Monday June 01 2020, @07:41AM (#1001641)

    I don't like making generalization of races, but what is with white people and grave robbing? White serial killers too. Always takes a part of their victims. At least they're robing white graves this time.

    • (Score: -1, Offtopic) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:46AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @07:46AM (#1001644)

      What? Mormon soul-stealing proxy-baptism? Ghouls, necromancers, most perverted pseudo-Christian poly-gamist misogynist stupid people. Joseph Smith was re-incarnated as Jeffrey Epstein. True story, as told by the True Prophet of the Heavenly Father, who also was a pedophile polygamist. Fucking Morans.

    • (Score: 3, Insightful) by EJ on Monday June 01 2020, @08:33AM (4 children)

      by EJ (2452) on Monday June 01 2020, @08:33AM (#1001651)

      What is it with people and the concept of "grave robbing"? It's the circle of life. The dead don't care. Ashes to ashes. Dust to dust. The calcium in our bones should be returned to the environment so they can become bones to something new.

      Anything other than cremation is selfish wastefulness.

      • (Score: 5, Interesting) by coolgopher on Monday June 01 2020, @09:16AM (2 children)

        by coolgopher (1157) on Monday June 01 2020, @09:16AM (#1001655)

        Cremation is quite a waste of energy and also polluting. Have a look at composting [recompose.life] instead if you want a rounder circle of life.

        • (Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:52PM

          by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:52PM (#1001708) Journal

          Or you could be buried at sea.

          I'm gonna have myself frozen in carbonite and placed in the foyer of one of my kids' home.

          --
          Washington DC delenda est.
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:51PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:51PM (#1001772)

          The energy and pollution is negligible. The composting movement is a feel-good scam, like much of the so-called carbon-neutral company press-releases that were popular a few years ago.

      • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:24PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:24PM (#1001755)

        At that depth and that age there are no bodies.

    • (Score: 3, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Monday June 01 2020, @02:47PM

      by Phoenix666 (552) on Monday June 01 2020, @02:47PM (#1001704) Journal

      Grave robbing is practiced worldwide. Ancient Egyptians set traps for them in their royal tombs. Incans buried their dead in inaccessible niches in cliffs and hid the entrances to prevent desecration of remains. And so on and so on.

      --
      Washington DC delenda est.
    • (Score: 1) by khallow on Monday June 01 2020, @03:18PM (2 children)

      by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Monday June 01 2020, @03:18PM (#1001717) Journal

      but what is with white people and grave robbing?

      Leave valuable stuff in your graves? You get white people. It's like leaving food on the floor for the mice.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:32PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:32PM (#1001722)

        Hey racists bastards, the Asians are the true grave robbers.
        See post farther down about WW2 ships being illegally scrapped and what they do to the human remains.

  • (Score: 5, Insightful) by EJ on Monday June 01 2020, @08:38AM (4 children)

    by EJ (2452) on Monday June 01 2020, @08:38AM (#1001652)

    "Mortal remains" is a stupid concept. There is nothing sacred about the leftover waste when a person dies. The bones are no more special than the dandruff, hair clippings, and other detritus from the human body.

    We should not be so selfish as to try to seal away the material that we've borrowed from the environment when we pass. Cremation or a simple pine box (WITHOUT embalming) is the only honorable way to release your body back to nature.

    • (Score: 2) by linkdude64 on Monday June 01 2020, @03:24PM (1 child)

      by linkdude64 (5482) on Monday June 01 2020, @03:24PM (#1001719)

      I've always thought that my body ought to just be thrown out into the forest. The wolves and the crows will eat - at least it's useful. Want to visit my grave? Enjoy a hike.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:55PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:55PM (#1001735)

        Noone wants this, for some value of many, bodies strewn about the place. What a mess.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:02PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @04:02PM (#1001740)

      The fact of your two solutions implies a recognition of the concept, accepted by majority of religious types, even just those that want the closure of saying goodbye.

    • (Score: 2) by cmdrklarg on Monday June 01 2020, @06:26PM

      by cmdrklarg (5048) Subscriber Badge on Monday June 01 2020, @06:26PM (#1001816)

      It is only a empty shell now; please treat it as such.

      --
      The world is full of kings and queens who blind your eyes and steal your dreams.
  • (Score: 1, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @01:22PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @01:22PM (#1001679)

    Imagine putting this work into this operation, getting the legal stuff out of the way, the actual dive, and then at the end they find out...

    The radio doesn't even work anymore!

  • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:14PM (4 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:14PM (#1001716)

    This is nothing. ENTIRE SHIPS from the WW2 era are being raised from the seabed by southeast Asian countries clandestinely for the scrap metal.
    Human remains there will not get any treatment better than trash.
    Just google this: southeast asia raise ww2 ships for scrap

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:27PM (3 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @03:27PM (#1001720)

      Here is one dumping ground for all the dead sailors brought up by the illegal ship scrappers:
      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/feb/27/indonesia-cemetery-search-bones-british-dutch-sailors-wrecks-warships [theguardian.com]

      • (Score: 4, Touché) by JoeMerchant on Monday June 01 2020, @07:47PM (2 children)

        by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday June 01 2020, @07:47PM (#1001847)

        It's one thing to declare it illegal, it's quite another to enforce it.

        A bunch of countries can get together and create a treaty for how the Moon and planets should/shouldn't be exploited. People who (hopefully) eventually operate independently there will no doubt re-write said treaties to their liking as soon as they are no longer dependent on the mudball.

        So, the western "powers" had an adventure in the South Pacific 70 years ago and they'd appreciate some respect for the toxic waste they left their countrymen's corpses in. Too bad, I'd say - the locals are going to recycle the iron whether you like it or not - certainly doesn't seem to be worth much to the western powers to go retrieve their fallen soldiers themselves.

        --
        🌻🌻 [google.com]
        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @10:42PM (1 child)

          by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @10:42PM (#1001918)

          The second half of your comment makes no sense: adventure, toxic waste, locals.
          I assume you didn't even read any of the links.

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:03PM (1 child)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @05:03PM (#1001782)

    .. / -.. --- -. .----. - / .... .- ...- . / .- / ..-. ..- -.-. -.- .. -. --. / -.-. .-.. ..- . / .-- .... .- - / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . / .. ... / ... --- / .. .----. .-.. .-.. / - -.-- .--. . / ... --- -- . / .-. .- -. -.. --- -- / ... .... .. - / .. -. ... - . .- -.. / --- ..-. / .-.. --- --- -.- .. -. --. / .. - / ..- .--. / -.. . .--. -

    • (Score: 2) by martyb on Tuesday June 02 2020, @01:36PM

      by martyb (76) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday June 02 2020, @01:36PM (#1002167) Journal
      ...- . .-. -.--/. .- .-. .-.. -.--/.-- .. -....- ..-. ..

       
      --
      Wit is intellect, dancing.
  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @09:30PM

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday June 01 2020, @09:30PM (#1001890)

    because the radio is too cool to leave it there? or because we need absolutely any excuse to go looking for something important we lost down there?

  • (Score: 1) by jman on Wednesday June 03 2020, @12:05PM

    by jman (6085) Subscriber Badge on Wednesday June 03 2020, @12:05PM (#1002683) Homepage

    If by "several famous people" the story means to say "Nikola Tesla", I concur.

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