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posted by Fnord666 on Friday May 08 2020, @11:03AM   Printer-friendly
from the it-just-leaked dept.

Arthur T Knackerbracket has found the following story:

Public health experts at the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have leaked their recommendations on how to safely reopen businesses amid the COVID-19 pandemic—after officials in the Trump administration rejected the guidance and allegedly told CDC officials their plan would "never see the light of day."

The 17-page document (PDF found here) was initially set to be published last Friday but was nixed. Instead, it was released to the Associated Press by a CDC official who was not authorized to release it.

The guidance lays out detailed, phased recommendations for how to safely reopen child care programs, schools, day camps, faith communities, businesses with vulnerable workers, restaurants, bars, and mass transit. Though some of the general points laid out already appear on federal websites—such as an emphasis on hand hygiene—the document uniquely offers tailored recommendations for each type of business.

-- submitted from IRC


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  • (Score: 5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:28AM (48 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:28AM (#991614)

    Open everything now. Much simpler. Easy to understand. The greatest plan ever.

    • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:38AM (42 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:38AM (#991616)

      Trump opening sued for copyright infringement by goatse.

      • (Score: 5, Informative) by SpockLogic on Friday May 08 2020, @11:51AM (41 children)

        by SpockLogic (2762) on Friday May 08 2020, @11:51AM (#991617)

        Die you Boomers, you peasants, you little people, none of you are important enough. Sacrifice yourselves to the greater glory of the Trump kleptocracy.

        --
        Overreacting is one thing, sticking your head up your ass hoping the problem goes away is another - edIII
        • (Score: 5, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 08 2020, @01:06PM (40 children)

          You're not important enough to tank the entire economy and leave a nation starving and living in tents. Those guidelines would mean a hell of a lot of businesses (you know, the guys without which you have no job) have no alternative but to close up shop permanently unless they have cash enough stashed away to pay the bills until people quit panicking. If the CDC guidelines are accepted, anyone not following them, despite common sense saying otherwise or even impossibility, will have the complete shit sued out of them.

          --
          My rights don't end where your fear begins.
          • (Score: 3, Touché) by c0lo on Friday May 08 2020, @02:52PM (8 children)

            by c0lo (156) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @02:52PM (#991677) Journal

            Hey, Buzz, lemme cheer you: those $1T+ coronavirus help funds for businesses, from which you'll see almost nothing... you'll have to pay it from your pocket.
            Even more, with that much money and not enough goods, you retirement cache will need some supplements, you'll get to let those catfish be and go back to work.

            Now, $1 question is: who done it?

            --
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
            • (Score: -1, Troll) by Ethanol-fueled on Friday May 08 2020, @03:37PM (2 children)

              by Ethanol-fueled (2792) on Friday May 08 2020, @03:37PM (#991701) Homepage

              Jews did this. All the small business money went to Ruth's Chris instead of mom-and-pop restaurants, and they all profited from the stock market fluctuations based on advanced knowledge just as they did insider trading right before 9/11 hit.

              When the people gather their torches and pitchforks, Jews and the politicians controlled by them and the Chinese will be on the receiving end of those. Then all the Mexicans will be marched back into Mexico and America will be Made Great Again.

            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:47PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:47PM (#991766)

              Mmmmm, I love the sound of idiots getting smacked in the morning! Keep it up c0lo :-)

            • (Score: 3, Informative) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 08 2020, @10:34PM (3 children)

              You'll see less (not none, just less) unemployed motherfuckers. Which was the idea.

              --
              My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:41PM (2 children)

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:41PM (#991883)

                So reality is that unless we increase the policing workforce by like 5x there is just no way businesses and individuals will take the safety precautions seriously.

                Just today I had to go somewhere to open an account, older conservative dude was obviously a bit miffed that I was wearing a bandana on my face and backed off when he came close. I explained my reasoning, and it was clear he thinks the virus is a big nothing-burger. At least he was friendly after that, and I clarified I was doing it for HIS protection not mine which probably helped his attitude.

                Until someone they love gets seriously ill or dies most people just don't treat the threat seriously. Not long ago YOU were saying the same, thankfully you are more open to reality compared to the average Republican.

                • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday May 09 2020, @11:09AM

                  Oh I still think it's mostly a nothingburger. The only ones at significant risk of anything (beyond what NyQuil and a week off will fix) are old folks and even they're not at nearly as much risk as the folks determined to make it an economy-destroying disaster want them to think.

                  And, yeah, I dunno why the folks at the bank get cranky when you show up looking like you're looking to rob a train or a stagecoach or something. Ain't no call for profiling a guy like that.

                  --
                  My rights don't end where your fear begins.
                • (Score: 2) by driverless on Monday May 11 2020, @05:41AM

                  by driverless (4770) on Monday May 11 2020, @05:41AM (#992694)

                  Until someone they love gets seriously ill or dies most people just don't treat the threat seriously.

                  Don't worry, Trump is working hard to make sure as many people as possible will get to experience that.

          • (Score: 5, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @04:00PM (14 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @04:00PM (#991713)

            How about we roll back those massive tax cuts to the rich?

            Have you seen what the great economic geniuses (stable ones, I'm sure) in the Administration want to do? Cut taxes even more! Cut capital gains! Extend tax cuts that don't take effect until three years from now! That will surely jump start things now, letting businesses put off spending until years later.

            The only reasons trump wants to open up so fast is that he wants an improving economy to claim come November, no matter the cost. And no matter how bad that cost is, he'll be telling you how much worse it would have been if he didn't ban Chinese nationals (but no one else) from traveling at the end of January. I think we can all agree that after doing that (with still 40,000 people came over after that), it was "mission accomplished" and time to play golf all February.

            You really want to put the lives of thousands of people in the hands of these geniuses? Pretty much everything they've put forward so far doesn't do shit for getting people back to work safely.

            • (Score: 5, Touché) by DannyB on Friday May 08 2020, @05:18PM (1 child)

              by DannyB (5839) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @05:18PM (#991737) Journal

              How about we roll back those massive tax cuts to the rich?

              Do you realize what an insanely stupid idea that is?

              Without the rich, how would the wealth trickle down to the rest of us?

              Do you even realize the hardship this would cause for people to have to scale back on yachts, third and fourth homes, private jets, and other essentials?

              --
              When trying to solve a problem don't ask who suffers from the problem, ask who profits from the problem.
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:20PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:20PM (#991812)

                It's barely worth taking the yacht to Cannes this year - I heard they, ahem,... canned it. Geddit? Canned [soylentnews.org].

            • (Score: 2, Redundant) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 08 2020, @10:31PM (11 children)

              What you tax, you get less of. What you subsidize, you get more of. Do the math, noob.

              --
              My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 3, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:51PM (3 children)

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:51PM (#991890)

                So we should subsidize healthcare and education in the US since we're sorely lacking in both metrics?

                Thank you TMB, today you managed to do some good!

                • (Score: 2) by ChrisMaple on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:24AM (1 child)

                  by ChrisMaple (6964) on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:24AM (#991935)

                  Subsidies lead to more. More is not the same as better. Unfortunately, subsidies attract fraudsters and other bottom dwellers, as does almost any kind of government interference.

                  • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:05PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:05PM (#992078)

                    When your healthcare choices are: none. Then I'd say more is better, wait let me think... yep, yeah more is better.

                • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday May 09 2020, @11:11AM

                  "Should" is an entirely different discussion.

                  --
                  My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 2) by jelizondo on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:09AM (4 children)

                by jelizondo (653) Subscriber Badge on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:09AM (#991899) Journal

                Really? They been taxing beer and spirits for decades now, even going so far calling them "sin taxes"?

                I see more liquor stores, not less. Time to put your thinking cap on and ask: Am I wrong about taxes? Is the liquor killing my brain?

                • (Score: 2) by ChrisMaple on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:20AM (1 child)

                  by ChrisMaple (6964) on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:20AM (#991933)

                  The tax on alcohol is a pittance, and America is rich. Mother nature and economics limits the tax rate on alcohol, because anybody willing to put in the effort can make their own. To find something that taxation has materially affected, look at the sales of tobacco products. Most people can't grow their own tobacco, so there's nothing to stop places like New York from taxing cigarettes at more than 4 times production cost.

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:07PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:07PM (#992081)

                    Round and round you go! Weeeeeeh.....

                • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @06:50AM

                  by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @06:50AM (#991973)

                  He is an idiot. The sad thing is that the abusive people on SN like aristarchus, Azuma, TMB, EF etc. have driven away most normal people so we are destined to watch the idiots tank SN like they are tanking US.

                  At the end of the day, it will all boil down to "who has the bigger bomb". SN has fortunately no power over my life so... time pass :D

                • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday May 09 2020, @11:13AM

                  Yes, really. Booze is barely taxed. If you want a good example, go with cigarettes.

                  --
                  My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:01AM (1 child)

                by Reziac (2489) on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:01AM (#991952) Homepage

                So, the more you tax income, the less you get of it...

                --
                And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
          • (Score: 5, Insightful) by SpockLogic on Friday May 08 2020, @07:13PM (9 children)

            by SpockLogic (2762) on Friday May 08 2020, @07:13PM (#991786)

            You're not important enough to tank the entire economy and leave a nation starving and living in tents.

            Translation :- You're not important enough to live.

            --
            Overreacting is one thing, sticking your head up your ass hoping the problem goes away is another - edIII
            • (Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:25PM

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:25PM (#991817)

              Right. Not at the cost of all our lives.

            • (Score: 3, Insightful) by The Mighty Buzzard on Friday May 08 2020, @10:32PM (6 children)

              That's not a translation, that's an outright statement. Less than a percent of the population dying is preferable to the entire population living in abject poverty and starvation.

              --
              My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 5, Touché) by SpockLogic on Friday May 08 2020, @10:42PM (3 children)

                by SpockLogic (2762) on Friday May 08 2020, @10:42PM (#991864)

                Me dead is better than you in abject poverty. Got it.

                --
                Overreacting is one thing, sticking your head up your ass hoping the problem goes away is another - edIII
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:43PM (1 child)

                by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:43PM (#991885)

                If you want to volunteer to die so I can haz a big mac, you go right ahead.

            • (Score: 4, Insightful) by digitalaudiorock on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:46PM

              by digitalaudiorock (688) on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:46PM (#992100) Journal

              Translation :- You're not important enough to live.

              Even if the notion that we need to sacrifice 10s (if not 100s) of thousands of working class, elderly, and other innocent lives to "save the economy" weren't reprehensible in every way (and almost surely not even true), it's sort of a moot argument that ignores another likely scenario. We have states broadly opening up despite the fact that their cases likely haven't even peaked, and the fact that they're not even following guidelines from the white house (no surprise Trump is praising them for doing so). What happens when this backfires and causes massive uncontrollable outbreaks??...lockdowns that will send us into an economic ice age that'll make the current scene look like the fucking baby boom. Great job of coming up with a worst of all worlds solution.

              Let's not kid ourselves. None of this is about "saving the economy" anyway...it's about saving the election for the orange fucking idiot...collateral carnage be damned. Never thought I'd live to see the day.

          • (Score: 1, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:10AM (2 children)

            by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:10AM (#991955)

            You're not important enough to tank the entire economy and leave a nation starving and living in tents.

            Maybe we could have actual social safety nets so that that doesn't happen. Nah, fuck it, reopen the economy and let everyone starve and die anyway!

            • (Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Saturday May 09 2020, @11:27AM (1 child)

              Erm, government social safety nets only work when you have money being made to tax. When nobody's working, you can not have a social safety net.

              --
              My rights don't end where your fear begins.
              • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:10PM

                by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:10PM (#992083)

                Or if we need $2T to fund the yacht parade, then it's RIGHT THERE.

          • (Score: 2) by Reziac on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:12AM (2 children)

            by Reziac (2489) on Saturday May 09 2020, @04:12AM (#991956) Homepage

            Yeah, I read 'em, and I was like... how da fuck?? Yeah, provided everyone has infinite time and patience (or a cadre of retarded monkeys to do the repetitive work), and about six times the income to cover the time wasted on procedures that will soon become too perfunctory to bother with. If you're an aged-care facility or a hospital, do the dance; you're supposed to protect your inmates. Otherwise... no fucking wonder Trump administration said No.

            Just wear a damn mask in public (prevents transmission of the whole cluster of respiratory viruses), wash your hands occasionally (or if you're a vulnerable, wear disposable gloves), and otherwise don't worry too much about it. Beyond that, open the hell up and be done with it.

            As to "social distancing" in restaurants and the like, seems to me cheap paper screens would be both effective and decorative.

            --
            And there is no Alkibiades to come back and save us from ourselves.
    • (Score: 5, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:52PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:52PM (#991626)

      Guide revision #532:

      Disinfectant injections are now mandatory.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:02PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:02PM (#991646)

        But only if you use Trump disinfectant [trumpwinery.com] with 11% alcohol.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:15PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:15PM (#991809)

      Just roll up your sleeves and wrap them around your face if it makes you feel any better. Think about all the poor Americans who'll do it for less. Bless them! Making America great again.

    • (Score: 2) by Gaaark on Friday May 08 2020, @09:22PM

      by Gaaark (41) on Friday May 08 2020, @09:22PM (#991814) Journal

      #MADA!
      #MakeAmericaDeaderAgain!

      --
      --- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
  • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:42PM (11 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:42PM (#991622)

    Their guidelines are a bit too generic, repetitious and cookie cutter for my taste.
    But, in order for the Whitehouse to be justified in quashing this draft, they would need an alternative with logic, focus, and science. Seems doubtful.

    A couple of basic things are missing from this plan.
        One is that these risk mitigations don't have to be perfect, they only need to offset the extra risk taken out by getting out.
        One is that each of these venues to open pose unique challenges which should be noted and specifically planned for.
        Another is that the US offers a diverse set of circumstances and given the goals, folks can probably collectively find better ways than the cookie cutter.

    Perhaps:
        First list the general risks and the risks specific to each venue.
        For each risk talk about the reason it's a risk, strategies for mitigation, and then a points system for how serious the risk is in each venue.
        Then ask each venue to count their risk points and figure out how to lower them as best they can in their local situation. Then continually publish how they are doing.

    Example risks:
        How should entry screening be different for a subway, restaurant, or childcare center.
        Congregatiing (gathering folks together) in a church, subway, of sports arena each bring different challenges.
        Random mixing of groups of folks is different in a subway than a daycare.
       

    • (Score: 4, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:46PM

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @12:46PM (#991623)

      > they would need an alternative with logic, focus, and science. Seems doubtful.

      Seems doubtful? What planet have you been on the last few years??!! Not a chance that this admin will do anything with logic, focus and science. Trump plays to his base and rationality isn't part of their worldview.

      > A couple of basic things are missing from this plan.

      Sounds like you need to be working for the CDC.

    • (Score: 5, Insightful) by Thexalon on Friday May 08 2020, @03:24PM (9 children)

      by Thexalon (636) on Friday May 08 2020, @03:24PM (#991690)

      The CDC's recommendations are most likely imperfect. I'd expect that, for instance, state health departments might be putting together more detailed plans for specific venues and business types.

      However imperfect they are, though, they're likely to be substantially better than the administration's, because their response has been a combination of denial, incompetence, and profiteering.

      Denial
      Ignoring the problem in January and February. Pretending it wasn't going to be a big problem in the US. Pretending it would all go away when the weather started to warm up.

      Incompetence
      The CDC cuts that occurred before Covid-19 struck. Failing to contact-trace or quarantine early. Consistently refusing to follow the advice of doctors like Anthony Fauci and Deborah Birx (or even Ben Carson). Touting ludicrous miracle cures for the TV cameras.

      Profiteering
      All available evidence suggests that they've set up a pipeline that goes like this:
      1. Factories make masks that would normally sell for $0.30.
      2. The Feds seize said masks and give them to private dealers that are selected by the president's son-in-law.
      3. The states are forced to bid against each other for the supplies now held by those private dealers, paying something like 10-20 times the normal price.
      4. If the bid prices aren't going up enough, the Feds seize the mask shipments to the states and give them back to the private dealers.
      5. Meanwhile, the private dealers chosen by the president's son-in-law show their appreciation with kickbacks to the president, his family, or his campaign organization.
      6. The masks rarely if ever actually get anywhere near a hospital, barring state and private efforts to sneak them past the feds.
      As a result, politically favored individuals get rich, the president and/or his family get rich, the states get a busted budget which we all get to pay for in state taxes or cut state-level services, and doctors and nurses and aides and patients get sick and sometimes die.

      --
      The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
      • (Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @05:50PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @05:50PM (#991744)

        The Whitehouse is definitely a very sad story, but just because the CDC is better than that low bar does not give them a passing grade.

        Leadership is in short supply from both and the country needs and deserves better.

        • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:36PM

          by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:36PM (#991758)

          What do you mean "lack of leadership"? The boss is talking VERY LOUDLY.

      • (Score: 2, Insightful) by curunir_wolf on Friday May 08 2020, @06:32PM (2 children)

        by curunir_wolf (4772) on Friday May 08 2020, @06:32PM (#991755)
        Wow. Imagine the level of intentional ignorance it would take to actually believe this level of conspiracy-theory bullshit.
        --
        I am a crackpot
      • (Score: 1) by Hauke on Friday May 08 2020, @09:23PM (3 children)

        by Hauke (5186) on Friday May 08 2020, @09:23PM (#991816)

        I concur with the Denial section.
        I'd add the reduction of CDC personnel stationed in China to the list of Incompetence: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-china-cdc-exclusiv-idUSKBN21C3N5 [reuters.com]
        Do you have any supporting evidence for the Profiteering section? I don't like the fat orange shit-gibbon any more than half the country, but I like conspiracy theory bullshit even less.

        Cheers!

        --
        TANSTAAFL
        • (Score: 4, Interesting) by Thexalon on Friday May 08 2020, @11:06PM (2 children)

          by Thexalon (636) on Friday May 08 2020, @11:06PM (#991869)

          My "conspiracy theory", point by point:
          1. Factories make masks that would normally sell for $0.30.
          Nobody disputes that that's the normal price of a mask.

          2. The Feds seize said masks and give them to private dealers that are selected by the president's son-in-law.
          Nobody disputes this part either.

          3. The states are forced to bid against each other for the supplies now held by those private dealers, paying something like 10-20 times the normal price.
          Here's governors of Illinois, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Kentucky, and Michigan commenting on exactly this [cnbc.com].

          4. If the bid prices aren't going up enough, the Feds seize the mask shipments to the states and give them back to the private dealers.
          Such behavior has been reported by Wyoming [trib.com], Massachusetts, Maryland, California [nytimes.com], and quite a few others report this.

          5. Meanwhile, the private dealers chosen by the president's son-in-law show their appreciation with kickbacks to the president, his family, or his campaign organization.
          This is the only part not yet proven by publicly available information, but it would fit with the character of this administration perfectly.

          6. The masks rarely if ever actually get anywhere near a hospital, barring state and private efforts to sneak them past the feds.
          The main evidence here is that a substantial number of aides, nurses, and doctors have died due to a lack of masks. Meanwhile, more masks are being manufactured and somehow never reaching the states.

          --
          The only thing that stops a bad guy with a compiler is a good guy with a compiler.
          • (Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:48PM

            by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @11:48PM (#991889)

            You're obviously off your rocker. Trump and his son-in-law using the highest offices in the land for their own enrichment? Ha! Try again conspiracy LOOOOOOOOOOOON!!!! Beside, when you're POTUS they LET you do it!

          • (Score: 1) by Hauke on Saturday May 09 2020, @01:30AM

            by Hauke (5186) on Saturday May 09 2020, @01:30AM (#991922)

            Point 1: No argument
            Point 2: Ok, source this. You gave no evidence. What does, "Nobody disputes this either." mean? 7 Billion (+-) people on the planet think the president's son-in-law personally selected the recipients of masks seized by "the Feds"? Citation Needed.
            Point 3: I'm going to concede that point. I'll attribute incompetence/greed/no foresight/inability/inbelief at the national level for that.
            Point 4: See point 2.
            Point 5: Citation Needed
            Point 6: Pure speculation and conjecture.

            Whatever your belief, "Remember, remember, the 3rd of November".

            Cheers!

            --
            TANSTAAFL
  • (Score: 2) by SomeGuy on Friday May 08 2020, @12:49PM (4 children)

    by SomeGuy (5632) on Friday May 08 2020, @12:49PM (#991625)

    A lot of people seem to have a hard time swallowing the idea of "re-openining" the country/states/businesses. Basically, it boils down to how poorly this concept has been presented to the public.

    I propose a new buzzword to get the message across: "Smart Opening"

    The entire idea is that it will not be business as usual. Where possible, extra steps are taken, such as extra sanitation, keeping customers further apart, or worshiping imaginary sky fairies from home because it is scientifically proven to be just as ineffective. Hopefully these steps have been reviewed by "smart" experts. The public won't understand this, but understand "smart phones" are kewl so "smart opening" must also be kewl. Even those who disagree with re-opening may like the term as "smart" often means "stupid" these days.

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @01:38PM (2 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @01:38PM (#991638)

      Smart phones should detect when they are within 6ft of another smart phone and start beeping and going nuts. Smart people will know to move 6ft apart.

      • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:26PM (1 child)

        by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:26PM (#991661)

        so one must now own and carry a smartphone before they're allowed to leave the house?

        • (Score: 3, Interesting) by helel on Friday May 08 2020, @03:30PM

          by helel (2949) on Friday May 08 2020, @03:30PM (#991695)

          In my experience most people would support encoding this in law, implicitly if not explicitly.

    • (Score: 4, Funny) by fyngyrz on Friday May 08 2020, @03:09PM

      by fyngyrz (6567) on Friday May 08 2020, @03:09PM (#991682) Journal

      I propose a new buzzword to get the message across: "Smart Opening"

      Donald Trump is deeply involved in (mis)managing the re-opening of the country's businesses and so forth, so the use of the word "smart" becomes an oxymoron and will just confuse the issue further.

      --
      A day without pizza is like...
      Just kidding. I have no idea.

  • (Score: 3, Insightful) by JoeMerchant on Friday May 08 2020, @01:43PM (11 children)

    by JoeMerchant (3937) on Friday May 08 2020, @01:43PM (#991639)
    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:05PM (10 children)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @02:05PM (#991648)

      "The state pulled the records off its website late Monday without explanation."

      What? I don't know what you're talking about. Nothing to see there. What? I can't hear you? What? *GUARDS TAKE HIM AWAY*

      • (Score: 3, Interesting) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @03:29PM (9 children)

        by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @03:29PM (#991694) Journal
        The explanation could simply be that some data entry monkey typed in the wrong dates. If there were 171 cases in January suffering symptoms of covid and testing positive for the antibodies, then why weren't there tens of thousands of such cases with symptoms on March 1 rather just 2 reported cases? We have a pretty good handle on how the disease spreads in a population that isn't trying to prevent it - and it's pretty damn fast.
        • (Score: 2) by HiThere on Friday May 08 2020, @03:34PM (8 children)

          by HiThere (866) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @03:34PM (#991699) Journal

          An explanation would still be desirable.

          --
          Javascript is what you use to allow unknown third parties to run software you have no idea about on your computer.
          • (Score: 1) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @03:37PM (7 children)

            by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @03:37PM (#991702) Journal
            And would mean what? Sure, if they admitted that there were 171 cases in January, that would probably be factual (since they're admitting something that probably would harm them in one way or another). But what if they echo the above scenario about it being data entry error?

            You'd still have the quandary of whether they're telling the truth or not. Actually, considering facts would need to be done anyway.
            • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:41PM (4 children)

              by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @06:41PM (#991761)

              Like all good scientists know, random errors ocurr on one side of the best-fit line. Quietly removing ill-fitting data points is the correct strategy.

              • (Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @07:25PM (3 children)

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @07:25PM (#991790) Journal

                Like all good scientists know, random errors ocurr on one side of the best-fit line.

                So would the journalists be all over this story, if the cases had been in July 2020 instead of January 2020? Observation bias can look a lot like confirmation bias.

                • (Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:35PM (2 children)

                  by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:35PM (#991820)

                  If Covid-19 had been in 2019, the journalists of the democrat media elites would not have been all over the story. They are now, because it is (still) an election year.

                  All the democrat efforts to outlaw and remove Trump the past four years have failed. They now want to kill the economy to teach the deplorables a lesson, deprive them of a job, then get them reliant on government handouts. Even better if Federal money can be appropriated to pay for State government mismanagement.

                  • (Score: 1) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @09:42PM

                    by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @09:42PM (#991828) Journal

                    If Covid-19 had been in 2019, the journalists of the democrat media elites would not have been all over the story.

                    Because? Sorry, I don't buy it - a very infectious and lethal disease has gone undetected by the Trump Administration for many months? They'd be all over it.

                    All the democrat efforts to outlaw and remove Trump the past four years have failed.

                    Only because they were stupid. Real crimes and such would have a lot better traction.

                    They now want to kill the economy to teach the deplorables a lesson, deprive them of a job, then get them reliant on government handouts.

                    None of those goals would be furthered by hiding a failing of the Trump administration.

                  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:51PM

                    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:51PM (#991836)

                    If only they had a healthcares... doh!

            • (Score: 2) by captain normal on Friday May 08 2020, @10:55PM (1 child)

              by captain normal (2205) on Friday May 08 2020, @10:55PM (#991867)

              Who was testing for Sars-Covid-2 virus or covid-19 illness in January, 2020 anywhere in this country? At that time anyone who showed up for medical care and exhibited the symptoms of covid-19 would have written off as suffering from "seasonal flu".
              We just don't know what we don't know. Personally I do find it hard to give much credit a proven liar and his funkies..

              --
              Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts"- --Daniel Patrick Moynihan--
              • (Score: 1) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @11:21PM

                by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @11:21PM (#991878) Journal

                Who was testing for Sars-Covid-2 virus or covid-19 illness in January, 2020

                Who was testing for Covid-19 in March, 2020? Well, a lot of people.

                How do so many cases of an infectious disease magically disappear without infecting a lot of people?

  • (Score: 4, Interesting) by GlennC on Friday May 08 2020, @03:39PM (1 child)

    by GlennC (3656) on Friday May 08 2020, @03:39PM (#991703)

    Thanks to the general mistrust of government that the Party has sparked, and that the Toddler In Chief stoked, there's not much left.

    It should make the upcoming civil war more interesting, if nothing else.

    I only wish I was being sarcastic.

    --
    Sorry folks...the world is bigger and more varied than you want it to be. Deal with it.
    • (Score: 2, Funny) by khallow on Friday May 08 2020, @07:31PM

      by khallow (3766) Subscriber Badge on Friday May 08 2020, @07:31PM (#991794) Journal

      Thanks to the general mistrust of government that the Party has sparked, and that the Toddler In Chief stoked, there's not much left.

      Let me guess. That comment was meant to stoke trust in the government run by the Party and the Toddler in Chief?

  • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:45PM (3 children)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @09:45PM (#991832)

    All these private individuals in healthcare have clearly screwed it all up. Time to learn from experience, and put all healthcare in the hands of the government. They never get it wrong! After Trump 2020, Pence 2024 will bring compassionate, competent care to a new level through the power of a federal mandate.

    Oh, brave new world ...

    • (Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @10:03PM (1 child)

      by Anonymous Coward on Friday May 08 2020, @10:03PM (#991847)

      Certainly all the private companies that own nursing homes and senior living have done a pretty good job of screwing up -- not enough protective gear, skimping on staffing, etc, etc. This "industry" wasn't pretty before the virus, and it looks really bad now. A few big owners are probably going to be taken down as this plays out.

      • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:15PM

        by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @05:15PM (#992085)

        We'd be better off putting all the old people on cruise ships and going from port to port offloading dead bodies and picking up new clients every few days. Hell, at least they get to see some shows.

    • (Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:38AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:38AM (#991907)

      If you look beyond your own borders at the rest of the world. You will see that government run, public health care costs less per person, covers more people for that lower cost, and has better outcomes.

      The US has a private profit generating system (for rich parasites) that sometimes provides health care.

      The CIA world fact book which if anything is biased to be pro-USA, currently puts the US at number 53 in the world for infant mortality.

      The web version of the list has the countries listed worst to best, which obscures how poorly the US is (probably as a result of previous years pdfs listing in the opposite order, and news reports based on the shitty ranking number listed right next to USA), but scroll to the end, and do the subtraction, to verify:

      https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/354rank.html [cia.gov]

      What does nearly every country that does better on that list have? A government run national health care system (doctors etc. are employees of the state), or at worst, a single state run run insurance program.

      You are entitled to your own opinions, but you can't make up your own "facts". I get it, it is hard for you, since reality is generally in conflict with a political right world view.

  • (Score: 2) by shortscreen on Friday May 08 2020, @10:05PM (1 child)

    by shortscreen (2252) on Friday May 08 2020, @10:05PM (#991849) Journal

    While the peons debate whether they are more afraid of the virus, the economic depression, or the police state dystopia (hint: it's 'd' all of the above), the aristocrats are busy furiously bailing themselves out.

    Does anyone think the peons will or can also be bailed out?

    • (Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:09AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:09AM (#991928)

      Will? Not this time.
      Can? Obviously.
      Will they? Yes, I think after these massive failures by the DNC and GOP we'll finally get some motivated voters.

  • (Score: 2, Disagree) by crafoo on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:03AM (1 child)

    by crafoo (6639) on Saturday May 09 2020, @12:03AM (#991895)

    Now we know that the chinese virus has the mortality rate of the common cold, it's time to open everything up and go for herd immunity. All the fat, old, AIDS+ people can self-isolate to protect themselves.

    • (Score: 1, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:11AM

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:11AM (#991929)

      Always nice to know one's initial perception of someone were spot on.

  • (Score: 4, Funny) by ChrisMaple on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:28AM

    by ChrisMaple (6964) on Saturday May 09 2020, @02:28AM (#991937)

    The leaker should be fired and criminal charges against him seriously considered.

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