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Recently published in Journal of Social and Political Psychology by Thomas F. Pettigrew seeks to understand the psychological profile of Trump supporters:
The Trump movement is not singular within the United States (the Know Nothing movement in the 1850s, the Wallace movement in the 1960s, and the more recent Tea Party Movement). Moreover, other democracies have seen similar movements (e.g., Austria's Freedom Party, Belgium's Vlaams Blok, France's National Front, Germany's Alternative for Germany Party (AfD), and Britain's U.K. Independence Party (UKIP).
In virtually all these cases, the tinder especially involved male nativists and populists who were less educated than the general population. But this core was joined by other types of voters as well. Five highly interrelated characteristics stand out that are central to a social psychological analysis – authoritarianism, social dominance orientation, outgroup prejudice, the absence of intergroup contact and relative deprivation.No one factor describes Trump's supporters. But an array of factors – many of them reflecting five major social psychological phenomena can help to account for this extraordinary political event: authoritarianism, social dominance orientation, prejudice, relative deprivation, and intergroup contact.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:25AM (25 children)
Because the reality is plain. When you strive to annoy people, for them removing the annoyance becomes a goal in itself.
(Score: 3, Insightful) by c0lo on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:38AM (24 children)
What a great way to remove annoyance: do serious harm to yourself and you'll no longer be annoyed. You'll be suffering instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 2) by The Mighty Buzzard on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:47AM (1 child)
The old smack your thumb with a hammer to get rid of a headache approach. I like it. Very Three Stooges.
My rights don't end where your fear begins.
(Score: 2, Funny) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:25AM
If you like that method, take it to its logical extreme and stand under a piledriver at a construction site. That'll get rid of one massive headache, I guarantee it. Plus they don't have to bury you in a coffin; they can just postmark you to Hell in one of those little padded manila mailers.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Arik on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:53AM (21 children)
Did Trump get some votes from prejudiced authoritarians? Of course he did. But the same is true for Clinton, the difference is only that her authoritarians are prejudiced in different ways.
He also got the anti-war vote, just exactly the same way that Obama got our support 8 years earlier. In neither case was it a candidate we actually approved of in any objective sense, but in both cases it was clear that the opponent was much worse. And this is what we see now that Trump is in office - the war party, with massive support on both sides of the aisle, pressuring him with everything they can bring to bear to force him to abandon his (very mild) skepticism on that particular subject.
All of this crying about Trump and searching for 'explanations' is a result of their refusal to face the obvious explanation - Trump won because most of us thought he was slightly less awful than Clinton.
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 5, Insightful) by fyngyrz on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:13AM (20 children)
Trump won because most of us - the plurality of voters - thought Clinton was less awful than Trump, but the electoral college mechanism discarded the "most of us" vote in favor of the "fewer of us" vote.
That was how the game was played, and we got Trump because of it – now we have to dig out of the incredible mess he's made, and we will, when we're rid of him.
But let's not pretend "most of us" wanted Trump. It's simply not true. It's never been true. It's still not true.
(Score: 1, Troll) by Arik on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:52AM (2 children)
If laughter is the best medicine, who are the best doctors?
(Score: 2) by FatPhil on Thursday December 07 2017, @10:39AM
Total: [269, 265, 2, 1, 1]
(Source available)
Also - do you agree or disagree with the statement "Californians are currently under-represented"?
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:17PM
Meh, just another angry conservative trying to yell "fake news" so they'll feel better. Womp womp :( The EC is bullshit, and I find it MORE offensive to give a VERY small number of people vastly more influence, but hey that is the GOP way. To the top of the pyramid bitches!
(Score: 1, Informative) by Runaway1956 on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:56AM (6 children)
That "most of us" is merely an interpretation of the numbers that you prefer. Neither candidate won a majority of the vote. The turnout was only about 55% or eligible voters. It's really hard to say that one or the other had a clear "majority" of the vote.
But, all of that aside, the electoral college is the very same system used to put every president in office. It worked well for your side when Obama was elected, it didn't work so well for your side when Bush was elected, but it worked beautifully for your side when the other Clinton was elected. As you work your way back, chronologically, it goes your way, then it goes against you.
Your attitude, as posted, is just so much sour grapes. If you really don't like the electoral college, then maybe you should be lobbying that elected officials win a clear majority. That is, to be elected, a minimum of 55% of eligible voters actually vote, and that the "winner" actually wins a majority - minimum 51%, and I would go along with a higher number than that.
We have had disgraceful elections in the past where total turnout was less than 30% of eligible voters. Should we have discarded those results, and polled voters again? Maybe send armed officers around to chase people out into the streets, and herd them toward the polling places?
Sour grapes. Your people didn't turn out in enough force to ensure the election - nor did the other side. The majority* have actually been disillussioned, and didn't want anything to do with EITHER candidate.
*Note that despite 55% of "eligible voters" turning out, far less than 55% of "Americans" voted. There are those who have been disenfranchised, even more who have never registered to vote, all of whom SHOULD have a voice, but don't. We might extrapolate that ~20% of Americans voted for Clinton, and ~20% of Americans voted for Trump. If ALL Americans over the age of 18 had voted, none of us can say who might have won.
A MAN Just Won a Gold Medal for Punching a Woman in the Face
(Score: 5, Informative) by Whoever on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:15AM (5 children)
That's a load of bullshit and you know it. In recent years, there have only been two occasions when the winner of the popular vote did NOT win the election and in both cases, the Republican candidate won.
It's ridiculous to claim that "but it worked beautifully for your side when the other Clinton was elected." when Bill Clinton won the popular vote.
(Score: 4, Insightful) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:28AM (2 children)
Don't confuse Runaway with facts. His mind, such as it is, is made up. Ironically, he's a perfect example of the very thing TFA is speaking about. Anosognosia with regards to this condition seems to be part and parcel of it, unfortunately.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:34AM (1 child)
Spot on. The only mystery that persists around, like a thick, sticky fog: made up of exactly what?
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:19PM
Vodka. Must have an impressive spell checker (Russian's are good coders dah?) to keep him legible with that much potato running through him!
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:33PM (1 child)
You're slowly catching on. The popular vote never did guarantee the election. We don't live in a democracy, we live in a republic. The republic has set things up so that it can trump the popular vote if and when it decides to. But, that's all beside the point. Hillary wasn't the popular choice, any more than Trump was. MOST PEOPLE COULDN'T BE BOTHERED TO VOTE!! Only a tiny bit more than half the eligible voters cared enough to vote. Do you call that "popular"?
Let's try one more approach. Two losers had a race, and you don't like the fact that one loser won over the other loser. WHAT DOES IT MATTER???? IT WAS TWO LOSERS!!! Get a grip.
When you're ready to express outrage that Bernie was bent over a barrel and raped hard, let me know.
A MAN Just Won a Gold Medal for Punching a Woman in the Face
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:39PM
So your initial point was clearly shot down along with the #fakenews factoids you tried to slip in and what? You move the goal posts and throw in some stupidity? It matters to many people how the country decided to put that idiot in charge. At the very least HRC would have been a politically competent sleaze bag, it is clear at this point that Trump is all about the swamp and in no way desires draining it.
It is really weird seeing supposedly intelligent people suck their own thumbs when their ideologies are impacted. So many of the prolific conservative posters here have repeatedly been shown to be intellectually bankrupt, thanks for the reminder that your opinions should be handled with a hazmat suit.
(Score: 3, Funny) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:46AM (1 child)
It is proven that illegal aliens are voting. Take out California alone, which grants driver licenses to illegal aliens and automatically registers them to vote, and Trump wins the popular vote.
There is no "incredible mess he's made". Aside from maybe the net neutrality issue, which Obama originally didn't support, Trump has done nothing wrong. He's doing an amazing job, far exceeding expectations. We could whine about minor things: our country still has non-zero illegal immigrants and there is non-zero Muslim immigration and we still haven't locked her up. Overall though, Trump is doing a fantastic job for our nation. He certainly beats every president in the prior 40 years.
Maybe you don't want Trump. If so, shame on you. It's time for you to rethink your belief system, especially if you voted for her.
(Score: 2, Touché) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:34AM
Oh, man! I could sure use some of whatever drugs you're on. Didn't your mother tell you if you're going to bring treats you should bring enough for everyone?
(Score: 2, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:10AM (1 child)
To be clear: You're talking about a plurality of those who cast a ballot.
Among those USAians registered to vote:
~29 percent - Clinton
~28 percent - Trump
~1 percent - a 3rd-party candidate
~42 percent - None of the above (Didn't cast a ballot)
Reasons:
1) The Big 2 offered the worst nominees from among their party's members.
2) Lamestream Media focused on everything that was NOT important to Joe Average--meaningless crap and not the issues (the horse race and not the track conditions).
They completely aced-out anyone but the Big 2's nominees.
N.B. A reminder here that the people of the USA own the broadcast spectrum.
Corporate media didn't analyze every lie from every candidate as those occurred.
(Comedians was where to find that analysis.)
In particular, they didn't mention Trump's bizarre personality and mention that the president has access to launch codes for nuclear weapons.
CBS's CEO even said out loud that Trump was crap for the nation but good for his company's profits.
The Media was also monstrously inaccurate with their polling.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 2) by FatPhil on Thursday December 07 2017, @11:58AM
Of course, in order to get anything done, they'd have to be awarding control to a lot of 2nd place candidates, it's just the pretence of majority representation I want them to drop.
Thanks for posting the real US2016 figures (though an extra decimal place would have been nice ;-) )
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people; the smallest discuss themselves
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:38AM
No, the plurality of California voters. The rest of the country was overwhelmingly in the belief that Trump was the less bad option. By your reasoning we should just allow California to be the only place voting and let the remainder of the country live by their decision.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Phoenix666 on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:26PM (4 children)
What actual terrible mess has he made? The guy hasn't even gotten a single piece of legislation passed yet, because he's at war with the Republican establishment as much as he is with the Democratic establishment. If he gets this tax bill done and dusted, then that's something, but let's cut the crap and acknowledge that Hillary would have slit everyone's throats with this same damn package months earlier because she is the Establishment's creature.
And look at the positive things that have happened with Trump's presence in the office. He did actually kill the Trans-Pacific Partnership, the horrendous trade agreement that would have put the last nail in the coffin of the American middle class, the agreement that Hillary and Obama cheerleaded for for years. His mere presence in the Oval Office has catalyzed this current wave of catharsis over institutionalized sexual abuse that has been a fact of life in America for decades. His prevarications against globalism have at least given pause to the Establishment which has been selling out Americans for decades. Thanks to Trump's victory, we now know exactly how utterly corrupt the opposition party the Democrats are and how rigged that institution is against real progressives and progressive policies.
To me, the reality of Trump's coarse persona, his moronic incompetence, has spurred a quite long overdue and incredibly necessary cut-the-crap moment across the board that is shaking up the entrenched corruption of the status quo light years more than Obama's "Hope and Change" BS ever did (and I voted for that guy, hoping for that change). I couldn't be happier. Trump is the molotov cocktail so many have been dying to hurl at the masters of the universe in Washington and Wall Street for untold years, and is the last hope to forestall actual molotov cocktails being hurled at DC and Wall Street.
Trump is an asshole. Totally unfit to be president. Delusional. He is a trainwreck of epoch proportions. But consider that that was still considered preferable to the best the Establishment had to offer.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @09:33PM
Most folks say "epic proportions".
I think I like yours better.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Interesting) by fyngyrz on Thursday December 07 2017, @11:16PM (2 children)
As did I. I saw some of it happen, too. Some of it didn't, but that's presidential politics – particularly when the president is facing an effective opposing power bloc in congress. I saw medical care made available to many who previously had no notable access. I saw the LGBT community move forward a little bit. I saw credit providers restricted from some of their more egregious behaviors. I saw the economy recover somewhat from that idiot Bush's blundering. I saw the war in Iraq finally brought to (mostly) an end. I saw over a thousand unjust drug sentences commuted. I saw relations normalized with Cuba. I saw embryonic stem cell research supported. I saw a sober, compassionate president come forward in times of national grief.
Sure, I saw lots I didn't like too – but that's inevitable, because I think our government has the wrong idea about a lot of things, particularly with regard to constitutional law. But I was still very glad to see some notable progress in the above areas, I can tell you that.
He's undermined relations with the UK. He's doing his level best to screw up our just-somewhat-repaired relations with Cuba. He's interfered with the ACA. He's engaged in a hugely dangerous war of (clueless) words with nuclear-weapon-armed North Korea, basically a contest between two head-of-state morons vying tirelessly for who can say the most stupid/inflammatory thing. He's spawned quite a few idiotic executive orders, from increasing pollution to amplifying the drug war. He's interfered, cluelessly and idiotically, with immigration into the USA and travel in general, taking the "war on travel" (AKA the "war on terror") to new lows. He enabled the pollution pipeline (AKA Keystone Pipeline.) He has attacked the FBI and the CIA, not for their actual failings, of which there are plenty, but because they were doing their actual jobs. He lies, obviously and continuously and naively, thereby undermining the office of the presidency far more than any one of his predecessors in living memory. Whatever credibility it previously had is long gone. He's severely injured the state department. And then there's salting the supreme court and the attorney general's office and many other posts with pure idiots. That's just off the top of my head. There's plenty more harm already done where that came from, and I doubt he's done, either.
...by the Electoral College, and the smaller number of those who voted, yes. It was outright stunning to me at the time – it was truly obvious that Clinton, while a typical politician, would have been orders of magnitude better than Trump ever had a hope of being, but looking back at the propaganda that was being fielded, and now aware of how hard the deluded are trying to keep themselves convinced of those very delusions, it's a lot more obvious how it came about today than it was at the time.
I am looking forward to seeing the man go, either by natural causes, forced out whenever, voted out / quitting in four years, or at the end of a long and probably just as embarrassing eight years. Whatever day it happens, I expect it will be a truly great day for this country.
Trump is very much the low-water mark in American presidential officeholders. Could we do worse? I suppose. I find it difficult to imagine, but then, I never, ever thought Trump could get enough votes to even be nominated, much less push the Electoral College over such a dangerous cliff. I definitely learned something this time around: the Gaussian doesn't even do justice to the level of cluelessness in the general population.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @11:47PM
The two options are a second civil war and kill enough of the idiots, on both sides, to being making the changes necessary to have an educated populace.
Or emigrate. Or become stateless, whether to found a new state (the only way left today), or consider yourself a sovereign citizen and work outside of national boundaries as a loosely knit organization devoted to true liberty. America as that bastion of freedom never existed, and the winds globally, as well as within NATO, the EU, and the United Nations are all blowing against it, even if individual programs seem to care about it at some level.
Do your part today, before it is too late. The end of freedom is approaching and if you don't take the reins of your fate now, you will yourself and your descendants in shackles forever more.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Friday December 08 2017, @09:28AM
Politics is the art of the possible
(said a German who made a lot of what he intended possible)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 3, Insightful) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:36AM (10 children)
Let's put the pseudoscience theater of vilifying others via psychological interpretation on firm scientific grounds.
(Score: 5, Funny) by stretch611 on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:46AM (7 children)
Why should we trust you to give an evaluation of us.... when you can't even see that the real flaw is yourself.
Now with 5 covid vaccine shots/boosters altering my DNA :P
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:07AM (3 children)
But I sense that presenting the results of this noble effort will be akin to casting pearls before swine (not that I've observed any swine giving inadequate appreciation to pearls, it's just the way the saying goes). Well, such research is as much about the public display of virtue (which is my gravitas-ridden contribution to this great work) as it is about this critical subject.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:22PM (2 children)
Ehhh, you talk a lot about science and reason but cling to your personal beliefs when the evidence is against you.
Feck off ya bleedin idjit.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:36PM (1 child)
Seeing as you are a delusional, narcissistic, moonbat autist, I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand the importance of my work. Sad.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 08 2017, @05:30PM
Importancr of your work, so now you're a narcissistic fool as well. Got a youtube channel yet?
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:17AM (2 children)
That is precisely the same question we are asking about the author - AND the submitter.
A MAN Just Won a Gold Medal for Punching a Woman in the Face
(Score: 2) by janrinok on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:57AM (1 child)
I am not interested in knowing who people are or where they live. My interest starts and stops at our servers.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:15AM
The final straw though is the blatant slant to the interpretation of results. For example,
In other words, areas with huge increases in immigrant population voted for Brexit and for Trump in their respective countries. He chooses to interpret that as meaning that the native population hasn't yet had experience dealing with recent immigrants rather than that their experience with recent immigrants is going poorly.
(Score: 3, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:56AM (1 child)
Pseudoscience - within context, any article in a peer-reviewed scientific journal running contrary to the narrative the mothership employing khallow wants.
Until recently, the socio-economic and global warming were the topics which triggered a reaction from khallow. The pro-Trump stance seems to be the newer area the mothership looks interested.
Hypothesis: recent tax reduction legislation made from Trump a character worth defending.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:26PM
Spot on mate.
Khallow, the biggest shill around. Probably an alt of Jmorris who switched over once the Jmorris hate train picked up enough steam. Honestly K, you would get a lot more respect if you were a shill that came out rather than letting people think you're a monkey that learned how to read English. How many bananas did you get for this comment chain?
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:45AM (1 child)
Just like social darwinism and phrenology.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:52AM
Leave Khallow Alone!!!!!!
(Score: 5, Informative) by jmorris on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:51AM (11 children)
Ah yes, the "conservatives are mental" meme again. Oh well, guess it is a slow news day?
Instead of trying to unperson your opponents, why not allow a really radical notion into your noggins? There are people who disagree with you. They aren't shills, they aren't astroturf, they aren't insane, they aren't ignorant. They have read you literature, marinated in your mass media. They still don't agree with you. They don't want what you want, in fact they are convinced what you want can't exist and the attempt to attain it will destroy civilization. Ponder that. Discuss.
(Score: 2, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:58AM (2 children)
Here is the core problem: this is just not true. They actually are shills, astroturfers, Koch-suckers, insane, and ignorant, not to mention racist, misogynist, and religious and ammosexual. Funny jmorris would show up just right on cue, though.
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:29PM (1 child)
My friend, it is not a good sign when jmorris is coming off more level-headed and reasonable than you are. Rhetorically, it's quite bad.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:17PM
I think the issue is that there are more shills on the republican side willing to get paid to spread their alternate facts, than there are on the democrat side willing to spread their version. The dems only do it for free, and there are new iphones to buy and instafacegrams to post of that downtown shopping spree.
Worshipping capitalism wins when it pays to do so. doing something for free doesn't get you paid back if the efforts fail, but paid shills.. get paid regardless of the outcome.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:09AM
Of course, khallow alone can only generate that much impact.
A jmorris intervention is required. Except that, interestingly enough, the attack angle denies the use of one of jmorris'es strongest point of 'patriots, be prepared for blood letting. Anyone who is liberal is not American'.
In his present comment, he's showing a sort of a compassionate side, you know? Like he's the defender of the underdogs which, unlike liberals, are humans not unpersons.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:16AM
Just out of curiosity, how much are the Russians paying you to post this shit? Just asking.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:55AM
Is that what the kids are calling bullshit now?
(Score: 1, Troll) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:30AM (1 child)
I don't think you're insane; I think you're evil. You're sane, intelligent, clear-sighted, and evil. There is a difference, and it will become apparent to you a few seconds after what I will charitably refer to as your soul parts ways with that sack of dirty water and bones it's driving around. Fairly be ye warned.
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1) by Sulla on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:45AM
We just suffered eight years of doubling down on war with Obama, why would we want to stay the course insted of try something new in vain? All the shitty foreign policy decisions that would have been done by Hill have been done by Trump, the only exception being that we stopped funding the Syrian rebels and allowed Russia/Iran/Syria to bring some peace back to the region.
Republicans and democrats alike have done everything possible to double down in war, and trump has been dragging his feet due to incompetence, being bought off, or lack of will. Regardless of why less death is always better than more death.
Hell he just said that a two state solution is still the best option,
Ceterum censeo Sinae esse delendam
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:44PM (2 children)
To claim that conservatives and liberals have "read you literature, marinated in your mass media" of each others is not true. You never heard of echo chambers? Really?
Yes, conservatives and liberals want different things. Could that be because they are different?
You are the one that says conservatives are mental. Is that an admission? The FA just listed 5 qualities that science has attached to Trump voters. Why is that so hard to believe? Just out of curiosity, did you vote for Trump? Which of the 5 do you think you do and don't exhibit?
(Score: 2) by Freeman on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:26PM (1 child)
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/is-social-science-an-oxymoron-will-that-ever-change/ [scientificamerican.com]
"In the same way, social scientists should eschew the quest for truths about human behavior. They should instead focus more intensely on finding answers to specific problems, whether our current economic woes, the inefficiency of our health-care system or our reliance on military force to resolve disputes."
Joshua 1:9 "Be strong and of a good courage; be not afraid, neither be thou dismayed: for the Lord thy God is with thee"
(Score: 2) by jmorris on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:36PM
Or maybe they can just STFU until they learn to stop saying stupid crap like "or our reliance on military force to resolve disputes" since force or the threat of force is pretty much the ONLY thing that solves a dispute. Think about it. Even when a court "solves" a dispute it is the threat of overwhelming force backing the legal system that causes the losing side to accept the decision. The entire basis for the State is it holding a monopoly on the legitimate use of force. The only difference between police force and military force is military force is violence between nation states to create an international order vs internal enforcement of order.
Violence solves problems. Every solution to a problem tends to plant the seed of a fresh problem but properly applied violence solves problems. The only Nazis left are a few LARPers because violence solved them. Capital Punishment 100% solves the problem of recidivism and if swiftly and uniformly applied would do wonders at deterrence.
And the idea of social scientists trying to solve economics is comedy gold.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by NewNic on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:52AM (1 child)
So, blowhard, inward-looking, poor, racists?
lib·er·tar·i·an·ism ˌlibərˈterēənizəm/ noun: Magical thinking that useful idiots mistake for serious political theory
(Score: 0, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:30AM
Runaway1956!!!
(Score: 2, Insightful) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:54AM (23 children)
The bit about automation was just asserted and ended up having no relevance to the subsequent discussion about relative privation. The developing world doesn't have this problem with automation and instead has experienced a significant improvement in wages during the last few decades (in large part due to said automation). So it makes little sense to mention this, much less claim it as a "major factor".
Further one wouldn't really care so much about massive job losses, if they were in conjunction with massive job creation. Economically, Trump would appear superior to Clinton on that matter.
(Score: 5, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:01AM (11 children)
False. NOT true. Incorrect. Obama is responsible for the Trump economy so far. Clinton's growth was better than Obama, but then he was pre-Bush Republican "fixing" of the economy. Which Trump is probably going to cause more of.
(Score: 0, Troll) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:18AM (10 children)
I disagree. While the rise is mostly due to the end of the Obama administration, Clinton wouldn't receive the same bounce.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @09:06AM (9 children)
You do? How nice for you, then. Of course, you are still wrong. If you were right, I would expect some data, and some analysis? Or perhaps you prefer to stop at "I disagree"? Then you can tell everyone how the mean SJW disagreed with you on the internets.
(Score: 2) by Fishscene on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:58PM
You ask for evidence, yet provide none yourself. Go link yourself to some facts and post them before accusing someone else of not doing so.
I know I am not God, because every time I pray to Him, it's because I'm not perfect and thankful for what He's done.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:30PM (7 children)
This indicates to me that something happened around November 2016 that caused US manufacturing to sharply improve. The US presidential election is the obvious candidate for this sea change. Clinton was expected to win going into the election. When she didn't, suddenly manufacturing gets better. Funny how that works.
While manufacturing is just a part of the economy, increases in it indicate that someone is buying their stuff (and they in turn will consume more services and such from the rest of the economy), and hence other parts of the economy are growing as well.
(Score: 1) by redneckmother on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:07PM (4 children)
In other news:
https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2017/12/06/HUD-Homeless-numbers-up-for-first-time-since-2010/2611512617086/ [upi.com]
Mas cerveza por favor.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:44PM (3 children)
Well, we'll see what comes of that. But it's not a large increase nor a large rate [wikipedia.org] (0.18% of the US population is homeless as of 2015). For example, a good portion of the EU has a higher homeless rate (Germany at 0.42%, for example).
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:06PM (2 children)
You are a skilled shill, very adept at using bullshit to distract from the lack of support your "message" has. Never address that facts that go against your message, just distract with more bullshit. They must have a dairy farm dedicated to you somewhere.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:31PM (1 child)
This sort of shilling is called reason, logic, and rhetoric. Up your game and you won't be a whiny little AC anymore. I have years of practice dealing with this stuff.
Here, it was quite simple. I read the link and noticed the two facts I mentioned. Namely, that the increase mentioned was small (0.7%) and that the current homeless rate (0.18%) was small even for developed world countries. An increase of merely 4,000 homeless shouldn't make the list of the top 100 things that Trump has done wrong.
In comparison, manufacturing jobs went up by a little over 150k from November, 2016 to October, 2017. That's roughly a 1.3% increase in manufacturing jobs over the same time frame. That's roughly 35-40 manufacturing jobs per homeless person.
Now, obviously this could be the start of a bad trend with respect to the homeless numbers. But we'll just have to see what happens.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Monday December 11 2017, @12:57AM
I noticed that the figure in question is through January, 2017. So not Trump's fault or credit, but still not even a weak indicator that something is going wrong.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 08 2017, @09:07AM (1 child)
The growing trend started around mid 2010 had a stagnation in 2016 (consistent with an election year) then continued at a rate no higher than before. So far, there's no correlation with Trump's administration.
Here's another hypothesis which may explains the same: Obama's programs continued to work into Trump administration because Trump didn't manage to wreck them yet.
Nothing to see here but fluctuations, with an amplitude of +/-0.5h/week, 1% or so. Noise.
Tempting candidate for an explanation, yes. Obvious no.
While here may be something, it is also possible there's nothing. Many other factors can trigger the same.
Attributing this to the Trump-factor is, at best, a hypothesis which requires validation or a simple assertion without support in reality at the worst
Correlation, causation, you know the saying.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Saturday December 16 2017, @05:51PM
I missed this post earlier, but I'll note that a big reason why such stalls are "consistent" with election years is because of the uncertainty that comes from the possibility of a bad choice getting elected president. You have to consider the dynamics not merely assert that shit happens. If Clinton were a perceived as a much better choice for president, then these figures wouldn't continue to climb once Trump was elected. Manufacturers would instead be looking at ways to minimize the impact, such as reducing hiring.
Hence, the data which was supplied. That was a validation.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:15AM (5 children)
Wishful thinking.
Oh boy, oh boy, I just can't wait the moment khallow receives the statistics from the mothership, those numbers that show this is not wishful but cold objective thinking. Any moment now, I feel it in my urine!
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:47AM (1 child)
Roll that urine over your tongue a little more, and be sure you've felt all there is to feel. Here, I'll fill this quart jar, to be sure you don't run out. Be sure to let us know what you feel in your urine, as well as mine.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @04:54AM
Ha. One is asking numbers and receives a piss (not that I'd treat those numbers as more than piss, but anyway numbers are supposed to offer an appearance of credibility, something to at least look like a rational position).
So, what happens, the mothership is lagging again? Wow, I feel for you (in my urine), your income this month is gonna take a hit.
And this just before the festive season, poor khallow. Perhaps it would be wise to jump motherships, what say you?
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:34PM (2 children)
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:45PM (1 child)
Wow, that was one clear example of you being a shill. Thanks.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:58PM
(Score: 3, Insightful) by Runaway1956 on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:44AM (4 children)
Automation has not yet cost all that many jobs. I can walk out on my plant floor, and point to about 60 jobs lost to immigration - and only four jobs lost to automation. To date, most of the automation employed by my company have been aimed at reducing damage to equipment and plant, and to reduce the risk of injury to workers. Americans whose families have been American for generations have lost far more to immigration, than to automation, from my point of view.
A MAN Just Won a Gold Medal for Punching a Woman in the Face
(Score: 2, Disagree) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:59AM (3 children)
Just because you are stupid, doesn't mean you are right.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-21/how-just-14-people-make-500-000-tons-of-steel-a-year-in-austria [bloomberg.com]
1,000 went down to 14.
So yeah, maybe it's the "refugees" or the "immigrants"?? If anything, immigrants have vastly increased the wealth of Americans. Americans have done nothing but suck in the most ambitious and hard working people from around the world (and Mexico) and have done nothing but bitch about them. But don't worry, that gravy train is now quite done with.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @08:31AM
But it does mean that he doesn't know he is wrong. Man has an opinion. Don't confuse him with facts.
(Score: 2) by Runaway1956 on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:18PM (1 child)
Because you are stupid, you don't realize that I'm not from Oz. I'm from Murica. Nor do you understand that I work in plastics manufacturing, not in steel making. While you are attempting to be cute, you only expose your own stupidity and ignorance. Sux2BU, hey?
A MAN Just Won a Gold Medal for Punching a Woman in the Face
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @09:44PM
That may 'splain. Austria and the land of Oz are sooo far apart.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Entropy on Thursday December 07 2017, @01:58AM
The myth that people are one of two parties, the constant (and amazingly effective) striving to keep them voting for the lesser of two evils, and the absolute exclusion of anyone the two parties collectively are not interested in running.
(Score: 0, Troll) by idiot_king on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:17AM (7 children)
I don't get how many times you can strike out with mother nature and still manage to feed yourself. Trump supporters are a freak of nature, but I guess that's why they all chose a freak of nature for their leader.
Entirely disgusting, it's no surprise that they're all mental cases and need to be locked up, as if it even needs to be said. These people need help, but "god" knows they don't want it. They'd rather just nuke the planet than deal be told they're wrong about anything. The worst part is probably that they think they're morally justified. That's the only way they could support pedos like Roy Moore and flaming racists like Der Trumpenfurher himself. I can't believe how far we've sunk as a species.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:25AM
"I don't get how many times you can strike out with mother nature and still manage to feed yourself."
Surprise, surprise. Hillary supporters DONT feed themselves. That's what they elect people like her for. To make someone else feed them!
Doh.
(Score: 2, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @08:57AM (4 children)
Maybe you should look into a mirror. You're the one calling for locking up an entire section of the population because they have an opinion different from yours. Better if they were all killed and removed from the gene pool is what you're saying. No wonder Trump supports hate everyone else, you deserve it. Aren't you guys supposed to be accepting of everyone no matter their disABILITY? Isn't everyone supposed to be special and wonderful in their own way? You are the guys who can't handle words and need to hide in safe spaces where anyone who even slightly disagrees is a monster worthy of life imprisonment. How many wars has Trump started? Zero.
Idiot King is the correct name. Maybe your post was supposed to be funny?
(Score: 3, Insightful) by c0lo on Thursday December 07 2017, @09:22AM (2 children)
This guy certainly has a point.
You won't get out from the hole you dug yourself into unless you work together.
Calling names and spitting despise left and right doesn't make a good ground for working together.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:43PM (1 child)
What hole? There's no strike out with mother nature in the US. The environment is doing fine. No one is nuking anyone else. idiot_king is just another sarcastic troll account.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:59PM
And you're a giant lying shill? Glad we cleared that up.
(Score: 2) by cmdrklarg on Thursday December 07 2017, @10:13PM
Yet.
The world is full of kings and queens who blind your eyes and steal your dreams.
(Score: 2, Troll) by arcz on Thursday December 07 2017, @04:27PM
You could try being polite instead of name calling.
(Score: 5, Insightful) by Tangaroa on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:28AM (12 children)
Social Psychological Perspectives on Hillary Supporters
The Hillary movement is not singular within the United States (Julius and Ethel Rosenberg in the 1940s, the Dadaist movement of the 1920s, and the more recent Brony movement). Moreover, other democracies have seen similar movements (e.g. Italy's Ndrangheta, Mexico's Los Zetas, Canada's Polar Bear Plunge, and San Francisco's Folsom Street Fair).
In virtually all these cases, the tinder especially involved white males with low self-esteem and mommy issues who had formal educations but remained dumber than rocks. But this core was joined by other types of voters as well. Five highly interrelated characteristics stand out that are central to a social psychological analysis - stupidity, assholery, bigotry, batshit insanity, and living in a bubble of their own party's propaganda. No one factor describes Hillary's supporters, but all five do.
Someone give me an honorary sociology degree. This is ace stuff here.
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:33AM (1 child)
You are only proving the point of the fine article. "Educations"? A plural is not appropriate here.
(Score: 2) by c0lo on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:08AM
Let me correct that one typo:
Now, you see how much sense the phrase suddenly has gotten?
There were some issues (somehow related with mommy), issues that had formal education etc.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoFiw2jMy-0 https://soylentnews.org/~MichaelDavidCrawford
(Score: 0, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:09AM (9 children)
The insightful mod on that pile of bullshit proves that plenty of Trumpanzees are using their mod points today. If this post is modded troll it will provide further proof of the Trumpanzee activity.
(Score: 1) by khallow on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:25AM
(Score: 5, Informative) by Gaaark on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:46AM (7 children)
Get over it...she lost because she (also) is a big steaming pile of shit!
Trump would have had NO chance running against someone-ANYONE else: no one TRUSTED her.
Both the candidates were crap offerings, but Trump won! WTF does that tell you about HER!
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2) by Azuma Hazuki on Thursday December 07 2017, @05:33AM (3 children)
It tells me that as utter shit as she is, she still won the popular vote. What does that tell you about HIM? What, for that matter, does it tell you about the way American electoral politics work?
I am "that girl" your mother warned you about...
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @09:02AM (1 child)
That the majority (of the 58% of the population who voted) can't easily gang up and vote themselves absolute power over everyone else. So our system of government is still working exactly as designed. Maybe you should take a world history course to learn the background as to why our system is designed the way it is.
(Score: -1, Troll) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:04PM
Eeesh, "vote themselves absolute power". Hmm, you should be banned from all future conversations on US politics since you clearly have a tenuous grasp on reality.
(Score: 1, Interesting) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @10:52PM
What does that tell you about... ?
It tells me that The Commission on Presidential Debates is an anti-competitive criminal syndicate wholly-owned by The Reds and The Blues.
Had more than 2 voices been allowed in the "presidential debates", a lot more folks would have voted for Jill Stein and her Green New Deal.
.
It also tells me that Lamestream Media is a waste of time when it comes to actual issues.
...not only because of what they get completely wrong but, more significantly, what/who they never mention.
-- OriginalOwner_ [soylentnews.org]
(Score: 3, Informative) by Phoenix666 on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:41PM (2 children)
At the time I really wanted Elizabeth Warren to run, because she was smart and capable and would have cut Trump or whoever won the Republican nomination to ribbons. Bernie Sanders was a lesser choice for me, but he still would have been fine. Either of them would have run away with the election because they would have taken away Trump's relative edge with bread-and-butter voters.
Now I have a much different, much lesser opinion of Warren and a much greater opinion of Bernie.
But thanks to the hacks of Leon Panetta's email and Donna Brazile's revelations about the DNC, it has been proven that neither Warren nor Bernie would have had a chance against Hillary's corruption of the process. That game was rigged from the start and is still rigged. The Democratic Party is a zombie, brain-dead and incapable of changing direction or doing anything positive.
FWIW the Republican Party is no less a catastrophe. They're in the middle of their own years-long civil war, and their house is burning down, too. So the country must not continue with the fiction that one party is good, and the other bad.
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 2) by Gaaark on Thursday December 07 2017, @03:35PM (1 child)
I don't know anything about Warren (I'm Canadian, and only really followed things about Bernie because he seemed to be less 'yucky' and more for the people than Hill/Don).
I'd like to see Bernie form his own party (unless he can run instead of Hillary) with the slogan "We don't fucking suck like the 2 major parties".
Maybe he'd pull it off, lol.
--- Please remind me if I haven't been civil to you: I'm channeling MDC. ---Gaaark 2.0 ---
(Score: 2) by Phoenix666 on Thursday December 07 2017, @06:52PM
You're not kidding. It wouldn't take much. "The Independent Party: We're not Lizard People." "Earth: We Live Here, Too." "We are not Re-animated Clones of Hitler. Promise."
Washington DC delenda est.
(Score: 1, Insightful) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @02:20PM (2 children)
You-fucking-lost-ism, won't-get-over-it-ism, etc.
You see a lot of this bullshit coming from people who supported HRC in the DNC primary. Instead of voting their conscience, they say things like "I didn't like her but I voted HRC because....". and then look for sophisticated reasons why their candidate (the most hated political personality in the U.S. before the primary) didn't get elected. The way it works is you take responsibility. THEN we move forward. In the mean time shove your sociology-passed-of- as-psychology so you can bill more, straight up your ass.
(Score: 0, Informative) by Anonymous Coward on Thursday December 07 2017, @07:11PM (1 child)
But her emails!!!
You realize you're the one banging that drum? The article is about Trump and how such scum managed to get barely enough votes to win. Clinton is mentioned only a few times in passing, with zero "she should have won wah wah wah". I haven't seen anyone here rally around her either, except to state that Trump lost the popular vote and would have lost entirely if not for some specific events and massive doses of #fakenews.
It is hilarious that the people who won't let go are the conservatives, you types always bring her back up, you are the masters of whataboutism. #hypocrisy
(Score: 0) by Anonymous Coward on Friday December 08 2017, @06:29AM
Minor correction:
Trump got plenty of votes to win. In fact, he got so many he could, if I remember correctly, he could have lost Florida outright and still won.
Remember, the Electoral College did the job, not the public. Not directly, anyway.